HELP! - Classic Lionel 1940ish - Give or take a decade ..

[Anonymous]

I am definitely not a regular toy train kinda person, but my neighbor's late husband was. He got this set when he was just over 10 years old (not sure how old he was when he passed just this year, but his wife is about 60, herself .. so just .. yeah .. it's an old *ahem* classic .. set), and now, it needs to be passed on. Only problem is .. in order to get it to someone new .. we need to find out how much this set is worth. And I can't find any information or pricing lists for old Lionel sets.

To start .. let me show you what we've got :

Tracks - The actual section set up is made up of four curves, and four straight (just to give you an idea of size). Each extra set is put into fives. There are approximately 45 straight rails, and approximately 30 curves, not counting miscellaneous parts that are in the picture as well.

Consoles - These are the consoles that I've found in the set. And I'm pretty sure that "thing" in the center is the 1948 ZW Transformer. See? I've done SOME research. =D

Bridge - This is the bridge and the pieces I have for it. Biiiiiiig bridge .. if I'm guessing correctly. If I knew how to set it up, I'd do it. cause I'm sure this whole thing would be gorgeous completly set up. But .. I don't know how. So .. I arranged it all pretty-like for you. You can see how many piece I have for this monster of a train set.

Train - I'm sorry I couldn't get a better picture of the train(s). My camera's battery was dieing and this was all I could get before it just said that it'd had enough. But these are all of the in tact cars I have. I'll try and list the ones I've got until I can get individual pictures of them. Here goes :
- 1682
Caboose, red, pre-war, 0 gauge, tinplate
- 1680
Shell tank car, pre-war, 0 gauge, 1933-42(?), yellow, tinplate
- 624
Chesapeke & Ohio NW2 switcher, blue, 1951-54(?)
- 2466
Whistle (coal) tender
- 2440 (2)
Pullman car, green, post-war, tinplate
- 027
Part of wabash cannonball set loco motor(?), engine
- 671
Turbine Engine 1948
- 654
Sundco Tank car(?)
- 3461
Log dump car (4 rail posts & logs missing)
- 6457
SP Caboose(?)
- 6465
Sunoco Tank capacity 8000
- 2441
Green observation car
- 2025
Tender whistle(?)
- 6460
Buchyrus Erie class 250 RR Crane 1952-54
- 6462
Red/Black
- 6560
Crane - in pieces
- 6257
Shell, caboose, red, in pieces
Shell, buch erie, gray crane shell

This is all the information I was given on them. My neighbor categorized them by a newer book from an antiquing friend of her's, so we're not sure if this information is 100% correct. If anyone could give me some more info on this, or any of these trains, I would be greatly appreciative. Heck .. if any of you wanted to purchase these trains .. I'd be happy to take offers. Once good prices have been set .. they'll be going on to ebay, or some site where a train lover (such as yourself) can take on a truly classic set. I just hope you guys will be kind enough to help out a newbie.

Thank you all! And I hope I've posted in the right space. =D

- Shane

[phillyreading]

Hello Shane,

The track don't bring much at all used, unless it is T-Rail that bolts together. The ZW transformer may bring up to $200.00, but you will need to add shipping costs as this one is heavy to ship.  Accessories may bring a good price but must be in good shape both physically and in working order for top dollar, if a decal is missing it may still bring good money but if the roof or ladder is missing down goes the value!  The Lionel # 6257 caboose is worth very little even in good shape, save the frame if the shell is damaged.

The prices I am quoting are from Greenberg's Price Guide.

1682 caboose- 33 to 42,  red Lionel, $17 to $40

1680 tank car- 33 to 42, IVES TANK LINES $80 to $95, NO IVES $19 to $34

624 C & O NW2 52 to 54, $135 to $235

2466 NO separate listing!  comes with a steam locomotive.

2440 green pullman 46 to 47 $25 to $60

671 steam 6-8-6 (wheel arrangement) 46 to 49, with 671W tender $120 to $$215, with 2671W tender $150 to $270

671R steam  46 to 49 with either tender # 4424W or 4671 $130 to $280

654 NO Listing/incomplete number

3461 operating log car 49 to 55, black car $15 to $40, green car $28 to $65

6457 SP type caboose, 49 to 52, $19 to $36

6465 Sunoco two dome tank car, 48 to 56, $6 to $18

2441 green observation 46 to 47, $22 to $55

2025 steam 2-6-2 or 2-6-4, 47 to 49 & 52, with either 2466W or 6466W tender, $65 to $145

6460 Bucyrus Erie black cab crane 52 to 54, $18 to $50 with black cab, $29 to $80 with red cab

6462 Pennsylvania gondola black, 49,  $10 to $25

6462 NYC(New York Central) 49 to 57, black $9 to $14, green $8 to $25, red $5 to $17

6560 Bucyrus Erie crane with (smoke?)stack,55 to 58 &68 to 69, reddish orange or black cab $65 to $160, gray cab $40 to $75, red cab $24 to $45, dark blue(Hagerstown) $40 to $85

Remember these are book prices, the low for poor quality or parts missing or faded paint, high price for excellant quality and looking like brand new and needs to have the original boxes from Lionel Trains.  Repainted trains will not bring good prices!!  Hope this helps you!

Lee F

[Frank53]

time for a greenberg update. The most recent Greenberg prices are far from reality.

[phillyreading]

Frank53,

Are you saying that Greenberg prices are inflated? Like too high?

Lee F.

[Frank53]

Frank53,

Are you saying that Greenberg prices are inflated? Like too high?

Lee F.

take a wild guess Lee.

As a postwar buyer, it is tough to overcome the perception of a person who has inherited trains with a Greenberg book in hand who claims their trains are in "excellent" condition or "like new" condition and think their New York Central F3's are worth $1500.00, because Greenberg says so. 

I had an opportunity to buy a fair amount of trains from a person who had inherited a collection. Nothing rare or spectacular, just nice solid post war trains in run worthy condition. I run them as opposed to collect them, and my goal is to acquire material in condition similar to those I have.

I selected a number of pieces from her list and asked for prices - all Greenberg left most column.

I did go to a fair amount of trouble to point out the differences in condition and the fallacy which is Greenberg, but I was perceived as someone who was trying to rip her off. After hearing the same story from the next several prospective buyers, she got the hint and sold them for less than I had offered.

Kind of sucked to be first in line on that one, as she had some nice material.

[Anonymous]

So, Philly. *grin* Now that we've got a general price layed down, where do I go from here?

These trains do not have the original boxes, so their prices aren't exactly worth full value. One thing I do know about them is that they haven't been touched since 1984. We found them in two sealed wooden containers (no spiders, bugs, etc - nothing was able to get in those boxes) wrapped in newspaper from 1984, and my neighbor told me they haven't used them since Christmas of 1984 .. hence the newspaper dates. Heck .. the newspaper was still in good condition .. if that tells you anything of how well these had been packaged. It's just that .. the packaging wasn't the original boxes. Hard to expect a 10 year old kid keeping boxes from a train set this big, you know?

Some of these items are broken. I tried to only list the ones that were in the best shape. But do I sell the whole thing in one big swoop, and just give the buyer the extra pieces to fix if he/she chooses to? Or do I try and sell each one separately? And where would be the best place to put them up for sale? And how much "off" would be a good price to list them for, since they're not in perfect condition? 25? 50? 75 percent? I can get a zoomed in picture of one if you'd like an idea of the wear and tear on them to figure out a more reasonable price.

I'm sorry to be a pest, but I just don't want my neighbor to get ripped off for these trains. I'm sure if someone was to restore them and give them a good home, they'd be an amazing set, but it's too big of a hassle for her, and she just wants to let them go to a new home.

Thanks again for the help. I really do appreciate it.

- Shane

[Frank53]

list them in the Buy/Sell/Trade Forum on MTJ:

 

follow this link ----->>> http://www.modeltrainjournal.com/phpBB2/index.php

[dwiemer]

One option would be for you to contact a local hobby store or Model RR club and ask if they have anyone who can give you a fair appraisal of the trains, condition and value.  This will give you a better idea of what you have.  Then, you can either go to a auction site as mentioned above, or put an add in the paper or, you can contact CTT (owners of this site) and place a add in the back.  In the end, they are only worth what someone is willing to pay.  Remember, the auction sites are going to get a percentage of the sale price. 

Regards,

Dennis

[phillyreading]

Frank53,

I have been unable to get even half of book value for Lionel down here in south Florida, sort of thought that it was the area here but now I think that Greenberg is way-overpriced in thier values of Lionel and other trains, and not 100% accarate. Mainly I use the Greenberg Guide to see if a price is TOO high or a variation that was not made, some people like to repaint some of the Lionel trains for what they like. Also Greenberg's Guide don't say about having the original box that something came in or if it does it is only in the index or back page.

I have a variation on a 1938 locomtive and tender that Greenberg's Guide does not list, a 249E with a 2225T tender, and has a 2653 hopper in the set. The 2653 hopper was mentioned as being rare in a set for that year by an article in CTT. The reason that I know this one is an original is that my dad gave it to me in the 1970's, and my dad did not know about buying extra stuff to match-up something with.

Lee F.

[Frank53]

Frank53,

I have been unable to get even half of book value for Lionel down here in south Florida,

Lee F.

 

Lee:

I see you are in Lake Worth, and I admitedly do not know where that is. I am in Sarasota - kind of like O-Gauge Hell.

[Jumijo]

I've recently bought some really clean post war locos and rolling stock in C-8 condition. I paid much less than half of Greenberg's price on every single one of them. Heck, I bought a very nice 2056 and tender a few weeks ago for $30.00! The shells has minimal wear or chips. I got it cheap because the hobby store owner couldn't get it to run. It runs now!

I see ads in CTT for post war stuff and it makes my head spin. The exhorbitant prices being asked for VG grade trains is amazing.

As for selling off items, you'd do way better selling off each piece individually on an auction site. You're gonna make much less selling that lot off as a whole. That's a fact.

Jim

[phillyreading]

Frank53,

I am south of West Palm Beach by about five miles.  Agree with you about Sarasota being deficiant on model trains in general.   Perhaps you can try Fort Myers, at least two stores that deal with trains in Fort Myers.  I use West Palm Beach or Miami for model train stuff new, used I usually go to train shows, even been to the one near Thanksgiving in Ft. Myers area, larger show than the Port St. Lucie one in October 14th.

Just went to the site you list for progress on your layout. A tip or two; don't put curve tracks too close together because of hang over by engines or long cars like 60 foot Madisons. Do a test run before permantly securing the track.

A word about selling stuff with ebay or other auction sites is that you have to pay for each listing if selling separate, also a reserve price may be good to do but it too costs more money on most sites.

Lee F.

[Frank53]

Lee:

I have yet to find a train show. Please let me know if you are coming over to Ft Myers or other shows which might be in reasonable distance from Sarasota. You can reach me at: [e-mail]

[Frank53]

I've recently bought some really clean post war locos and rolling stock in C-8 condition. I paid much less than half of Greenberg's price on every single one of them. Heck, I bought a very nice 2056 and tender a few weeks ago for $30.00!

didn't you learn about sharing in grade school?