EMD FT's with steam generators?

[Wdlgln005]

Part of the confusion arises because the A & B units were used as a pair, connected by the drawbar. EMD could boast of a 4 unit 6000hp loco, adding the HP of the 4 units.

Some freight locomotives could & were used on passenger trains. There is always the possibility of one pinch-running for an ailing pass unit, or one that had been in an accident. They may have had steam lines included to pass thru from a s/g in another unit. Restricted speeds may have been ok for a short passenger run.

[SSW9389]

I posted this question to the Santa Fe list and got some help from Andy Sperandeo and the Kalmbach Library files.

Hi Ed,

I was curious after corresponding with you yesterday and looked for some more information about GM 103 in our library. The Diesel Era book, "The Revolutionary Diesel, EMC's FT," has a photo on page 7 of GM 103 hauling Santa Fe no. 4, the "California Limited," at Nelson, Arizona. So the demo locomotive did pull at least one Santa Fe passenger train. Also in "The Revolutionary Diesel," a photo on page 14 shows AT&SF 159 with its pilot door open (apparently removed) and with the steam line visible below the coupler.

That book didn't help on the location of the 103's steam connections, however. In our library files I found closeup photos that showed no doors in the pilot but a relatively large pipe fitting inside the coupler opening, to the right of the coupler, or to the left as you face the locomotive. A photo at Livingstone, Montana, in 1940, where the 103 replaced a 4-8-4 on the "North Coast Limited," shows steam coming from that location next to the coupler. My best guess is that there was a flexible steam hose that could be connected to that fitting to provide steam to a passenger train, and it might even have been used on freight runs to provide steam to dynamometer cars.. Still guessing, I'd say that when not needed the hose was removed and stowed, and that's why it hasn't shown up in photos.

So long,

Andy

[Anonymous]

right................

[rrandb]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SSW9389

I've seen photos of several small Rio Grande passenger trains set up this way with an AB set of FTs on the point. [:)]

QUOTE: Originally posted by daveklepper

Could it be that they always ran with a B unit next to the passenger equipment if they used an FT on a passenger train?

Thank you very much for your reply. Any and all info is appreciated. as always ENJOY[8D]

[SSW9389]

I've seen photos of several small Rio Grande passenger trains set up this way with an AB set of FTs on the point. [:)]

QUOTE: Originally posted by daveklepper

Could it be that they always ran with a B unit next to the passenger equipment if they used an FT on a passenger train?

[daveklepper]

Could it be that they always ran with a B unit next to the passenger equipment if they used an FT on a passenger train?

[rrandb]

QUOTE: Originally posted by daveklepper

I understood the D&RGW put its original FT's to work on freight, and that the Exposition Flyer and other passenger trains remained behind steam throughout the war. If this is true, then there would have been no need for b-unit boilers. But am I correct?

http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=51726 Here is a wealth of info on another thread. My only question is the location of the trainline or steamline conections? There is no visable door or access panel at the bottom of the frieght plow on the A end of the A unit? Someone said there was a flexable hose connection but I know of none like this.! As always ENJOY

[daveklepper]

I understood the D&RGW put its original FT's to work on freight, and that the Exposition Flyer and other passenger trains remained behind steam throughout the war. If this is true, then there would have been no need for b-unit boilers. But am I correct?

[SSW9389]

I see where Don Strack has this data on his Utah Rails website. The museum book only stated that the D&RGW 5482-5483 B Units were built with steam generators and that boosters 5492-5493, 5502-5503, and 5512-5513 had steam generators added in 1948 and removed in 1953. My question would be did the earlier production D&RGW FTBs leave LaGrange with steam generators. [:I]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CSSHEGEWISCH

Only FTB's had space for steam generators. The ATSF FT sets were used in part to dieselize the Chief. 18 Rio Grande's FTB's (543BC-551BC) were equipped with s/g's.

[rrandb]

Once again Thank you very much. ENJOY

[passengerfan]

Great Northern FT 250Aand B and 251A and B the B units were steam generator equipped and were assigned to the Badger and Gopher as two units sets during the day and operated as a four unit set in freight service between Duluth/Superior and Minneapolis/St. Paul at night. Originally numbered 2500 1501 A&B.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

Only FTB's had space for steam generators. The ATSF FT sets were used in part to dieselize the Chief. 18 Rio Grande's FTB's (543BC-551BC) were equipped with s/g's.

[SSW9389]

Rio Grande FTBs 5482 and 5483 were built with steam generators in March 1944. From Locomotives of the Rio Grande by the Colorado Railroad Museum.

[SSW9389]

The Santa Fe 167 set left EMD with steam generators in both B units. That is the 167LABC set. The units were built in February 1945. These units were delivered with 57:20 gearing in freight colors. The steam generators were Vapor-Clarkson CFK 4225s. The other 10 Santa Fe four units sets 158LABC-166LABC and 168LABC had steam generators added to the booster units between April and August 1946. Data from Early Diesel Daze by John B. McCall.

[rrandb]

Yes, thank you very much. My understanding was the B&M got around the restrictions by doing the work in house as "maintenance" . This got aruond the WWII restrictions. Thank you.ENJOY

[daveklepper]

Again, I do not believe there was room in the A unit for the boiler, only in the B unit.

[daveklepper]

There may have been some. The Boston and Maine did use FT's on passenger trains, but I always assumed they added the boilers, not original factory equipment. They were added to the B-units only, which had room for them, and the A unit always ran with a B unit (on frieght as well as passenger). Indeed they were originally draw-bar connected, possibly with couplers applied later. Later FT's and F3's were seen in mixed consists.

The FT was built as a freight locomotive, and most were built during WWII, when there were restrictions on building passenger locomotives. (SP and N&W 4-8-4's without streamlining, etc.) By the time WWI was over, wasn't EMD already producing F-2's and F-3's?

[rrandb]

Does any one have any info about any FT's that left LaGrange with steam generators. I am aware of the FT's that were converted to FPL9's and the SantaFe conversions. Thank you in advance. ENJOY [?]