Texas Depot

[SSW9389]

Deggesty

It's too bad that the last post prior to the above post was almost eleven years ago--and the original poster no longer participates in the forum (listed as "Anonymous", which is how all former posters are listed). I hope that he did get the information he was seeking.

sclm046, thank you for the information, and welcome to the forum.

 

 

I'll send it to Charlie, he's on Facebook and about every Cotton Belt group there is.

[Deggesty]

It's too bad that the last post prior to the above post was almost eleven years ago--and the original poster no longer participates in the forum (listed as "Anonymous", which is how all former posters are listed). I hope that he did get the information he was seeking.

sclm046, thank you for the information, and welcome to the forum.

 

[sclm046]

Hopefully you still have the same e-mail address. Regarding Waco, TX and the tornado damage to railway structures. Maybe you have not seen this video.  On your search engine type in  The Waco Tornado-Tragedy and Triumph-TAMI  . Once you have this video, you can stop it at 15:16 (not related to damage) which shows the lead engine of a passenger train stopped at the Katy depot. The engine belongs to the Frisco Railroad which at the time ran through St. Louis to San Antonio passenger trains in cooperation with the Katy Railroad (this through service ended in 1959).  The Katy ran parallel to the Cotton Belt, one block to the east through downtown Waco. The Katy had their own depot and did not share with the Cotton Belt.  You can see damage to the Cotton Belt Freight Station at 16:21 and the remains of the Cotton Belt Depot (also known as Union Station) at 16:36.  Further into the video at 48:30 you can see the upper portion of either an interlocking tower where either the Katy or the Cotton Belt crossed the former San Antonio & Aransas Pass Railway (Southern Pacific) or possibly it was a manned cabin where an operator lowered and raised crossing gates at a major street crossing of one of the rail lines (there were not a lot of automatic crossing signals in that day and age).  As information, the old Southern Pacific line mentioned is long gone.  It ran pretty much where East University Parks Boulevard now runs through downtown.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by wrwatkins

On State Highway 31, a few miles east is the city of Corsicana where two UP rail lines cross. Just north of the diamond (1-2 blocks) there is a semi derilect concrete or stucco depot with an interesting turret. I think this would make an interesting restaurant. Does anyone have any info on it?

Yes.

That building is the old Trinity & Brazos Valley depot. T&BV went bankrupt and was purchased by what became the Burlington-Rock Island (B-RI), a partnership of the Fort Worth & Denver (FWD) and the Chicago, Rock Island and Gulf (CRIG)--remember, Texas law until 1961 required RRs operating in the state to be headquartered there. This depot served such trains as the Sam Houston Zephyr, Texas Rocket, and Twin Star Rocket, and is located on the B-RI DAL-HOU main line (now BNSF). It does have great potential--sorry it has fallen into such a state of disrepair.

See the folllowing link for photos of the three Corsicana depots:

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Prairie/5726/Test8.html

The Corsicana SP depot was used by the TNO Hustler and Owl and the SSW local/motorcar from Tyler to Waco--the TNO Sunbeam blew right through town without even slowing down, just like it did every other town between DAL and HOU except Ennis (crew change) and College Station (flag stop only for Texas A&M).

There is an almost identical T&BV depot in Waxahatchie, a few more miles up the road, that has been restored and converted to an office building. It's been occupied by the Nay Company, which is a grain milling company, for many years, and is in good shape. Check out the similarities:

http://txdepot.railfan.net/Waxahachie1.html

This is an interesting cookie cutter depot plan. Both T&BV depots date from about the 1907 period.

BTW, The Nay Company also owns and uses the T&BV/B-RI/FWD-CRIG freight house in Waxahatchie.

Hope this helps. Fire back if you have any other questions.[C):-)]

[Anonymous]

On State Highway 31, a few miles east is the city of Corsicana where two UP rail lines cross. Just north of the diamond (1-2 blocks) there is a semi derilect concrete or stucco depot with an interesting turret. I think this would make an interesting restaurant. Does anyone have any info on it?

[Anonymous]

Tatans--

Glad you enjoyed it. The old Dr. Pepper bottling plant (now museum) was very close to the SSW depot and was also damaged in the tornado. If you looked at the walls you saw where they had been rebuilt.

Next time you're down this way, also go to Dublin out NW of Waco, where the oldest surviving DP plant is located. Also one of the only ones in the world that sell the elixir made with the original formula--sugar, not corn syrup. A genuine delicacy.

[tatans]

Stopped in Waco a year or so ago, what a great place- the interest? DR.PEPPER museum of course ! saw the old iron bridge and my first bamboo tree and got a great tour of the unique catholic church with the ships roof, a great place, lots to see, a little warmer than here in Canada.

[Anonymous]

Sure hope it helps. Tell them you're a Kiwi and maybe they can email you some photos. Enjoy your Autumn.

I have heard estimates of that storm ranging from F3 to F5 and I understand it has officially been classed as an F5 (worst conceivable). Have no idea what it actually was as I was a kid then. It made a terrific waste of Waco. Parts of downtown looked like they had been carpet-bombed.

The Jarrell TX tornado about 8-10 years ago (that flipped T&NO 786's 26-ton tender around like a stalk of dry grass, among other things) has been classed as F4 or F5, depending on who you talk to--most are F5, and the May 3, 1999 Moore OK tornado has been classed as an F5. These are the most intense storms, with winds generally well greater than 200 mph (F4) and 250 mph (F5) and capable of cleaning off a foundation and taking pavement off a road.

See the following for more info, if you're interested:

http://www.tornadoproject.com/fscale/fscale.htm

BTW, what is it that causes one of our friends down under to be interested in Waco? Seems somewhat off the beaten track, as most people have never heard of the place, much less know about the tornado. We Texans appreciate the interest and extend to you a warm welcome!

BTW--TYPO ALERT--Jackson is a block East of Mary, not west! Sorry for the potential confusion.

[Anonymous]

Hey, what a great reply.

Will followup the information.

Regards

Charlie In New Zealand

[Anonymous]

[#welcome] Welcome to the forums.

The Waco TX depot that you are interested in is the SSW passenger depot, which also served SP(H&TC/T&NO) and IGN (MP) trains in the early days of the 20th century. It was located on the west side of Mary St (1 block west of Franklin) between 3rd and 4th Streets--the SSW tracks ran down the middle of Mary St. This depot was severely damaged in the May 11, 1953 tornado, but by then I'm virtually certain all the pax svc to this depot was gone (all three of the roads were only branch lines into Waco). In the storm, a portion of the brick building collapsed from what has been described as a direct hit. SSW yardmaster O. R. Loving and telegrapher B. R. Brownfield were in the building, along with 3 women who had been driving down the street and sought shelter there after their stopped car had been partially picked up and blown several feet by the wind from the approaching funnel. The accounts also indicate that there possibly were 2 additional men in or around the building when the storm hit. Miraculously, all were uninjured except for minor cuts and bruises to the face of Mr. Loving. The women's car was crushed and buried in the debris.

The Katy depot is several blocks south at 8th and Jackson (and the property extended to 11th, and included the MKT freight station, the SSW/MP/SP joint freight station, and a small building occupied by a beer distributor--yes, beer in Waco!) and was only minimally damaged. It stood until torn down in 1968 due to a dispute with the city over taxes, after Katy pax service through Waco ended in 1964. The REX and Post Office outbuildings stood until they burned under suspicious circumstances in the mid 1980's. They were abandoned, open and used by transients. See this link from 1979:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/mkt/mkt-waco-bwp.jpg

The freight station was razed about the same time the other two bulidings burned. Here's a link from 1979:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/mkt/mkt-waco-awp.jpg

BTW, the storm hit downtown just a few minutes after the popular and crowded NB streamliner Texas Special (#2) had left the Katy depot at its scheduled time (yes, young-uns, they generally ran 'em on time in those days). The Katy tracks ran (and still do run) up the middle of Jackson St 1 block E of the SSW tracks on Mary. The Waco minor league baseball park was catty-corner NW from the depot and across the MKT tracks, and it was destroyed and dumped all over the tracks where the loaded pax train had just been.

There are photos of both stations in the Texas Collection at the Carroll Library building on the Baylor University campus in Waco, at the corner of 5th and Speight streets on campus, and there are also a large number of tornado damage photos. You will probably need to go there or contact the Collection curator and let them show you what they have. See the following Link:

http://www3.baylor.edu/Library/Texas/

Some of the post-tornado photos are spectacular. Coverage is extensive, most are B/W snapshots, but some can best be described as very distrubing and possibly gruesome,. However, the damage to the SSW pax depot and area are in there.

For those of you unfamiliar with this subject, the May 11, 1953 Waco (TX) tornado was the first recorded significant tornadic storm storm to hit the downtown section of any major or mid-size US city. It struck at about 4:35 PM and cut a roughly S-N swath about 1/4 to 1/3 mile wide directly across the downtown core and the city itself. There were 114 deaths and hundreds of injuries. Many of those killed died in the collapse of a couple of large buildings, including a multi-story department store, right in the middle of downtown. The effect on the city was devastating, and it can be argued that in some respects they probably haven't completely recovered from the trauma even 50 years after the fact, although it's not because they haven't been trying. As sswcharlie said, the beautiful SSW depot was severely damaged-partially collapsed-and was torn down, as were several square blocks of downtown. This was one of the first tornadoes to have been observed on radar (the first was 2 months earlier in Illinois). There were no such things as tornado watches or warnings, nor did the Fujita scale exist.

Suggest John Edward Weems, The Tornado, Texas A&M University Press, 1977, 1991. Weems was a reporter for the Temple Daily Telegram 40 miles S of Waco, lived between Temple and Waco, saw the storm (but not the funnel) from his dad's farm, chased it to Waco and covered the story for the newspaper after being called by his editor to check out reports of a storm that had hit Hewitt, just south of Waco. His book, an eyewitness account, is readable, personal, well-researched, and has an excellent bibliography. It's available at libraries and in paperback.

Hope this helps. [C):-)]

[Anonymous]

Looking for photos of the Waco TX Union (MKT/SSW?) that was destroyed by tornado in 1953. Any photos out there.[?]