I thought we might have heard back from "Savage Tunnel" by now, especially after my "...get marketing" suggestions, but since we haven't, I'll help him out.
Here's the Lehigh Valley Chapter of NHRS website...
https://www.lehighlines.org/ Nicely done website, I might add.
For the book he mentioned, and others the chapter's put out select "Bookstore", scroll down for the full display, then click on "....order_form.pdf" for the pricing.
VERY reasonable!
So if you're interested in things "Lehigh Valley," have a look.
The video referenced early in this post is well worth it. The official title is the" LV Railroad, Volume 1, Diesel Operations, Jersey City to Laurel Run, Steam and Diesel Operations mid 40's to mid 60's" Many shots of the BLACK DIAMOND, ASA PACKER and JOHN WILKES but none of the ovenite trains, the MAJOR/STAR and MAPLE LEAF.
Well, if "Savage Tunnel's" NRHS chapter has a problem with this they should speak to the University of Michigan about it. Certainly no-one on the Forum who references it just for fun purposes here is doing so to make any money off it, or intentionally doing anything wrong, so let's keep it in perspective.
What I'd do if I was in "S-T's" place is, for the benefit of anyone interested in things Lehigh Valley, tell us the full title of the book, what his chapter's selling it for, and how to get a copy. Drum up a little business for the chapter, you know? Also, look at the top of the thread there's 696 views, that means almost 700 people looking in who don't care to comment. There's over 600+ potential customers for your chapters Lehigh Valley book, or any other publications your chapter's put out.
Just post the chapter's website, that's all you have to do.
Treat the thread like a commercial for what looks like a very informative and interesting book. I'd imagine this is the first any of us has heard of it.
Don't get mad, get marketing!
That's what I'd do.
Flintlock76I just checked the "hathi" link, that book's an revised edition from 1962, the original was first printed in 1956. In addition, it looks like it was converted to microfilm (Remember that? I do.) at some point. They probably tossed the hardcover a long time ago. Even if it's still in print, has the copyright been renewed? They do expire after a time.
This is an example of the 'problem' that caused wanswheel to be restricted.
Hathitrust provides the page display for online reading on their site, or for fair use. This is not really different from having a library and allowing people to read the copy that you have.
Making a digital copy of this is just as much a violation of copyright under the DMCA as scanning and posting it would be. (It should be noted that HathiTrust can, and does, restrict access to some copyrighted documents even where it possesses complete and readable scanned images or text for them.)
We can argue, of course, whether reposting pages of a free display should also be considered free. There is no doubt how the moderators and administrators of this forum think about the issue, though.
It might be interesting to see whether the original and 'revised' editions are both still under copyright, but I'd expect that if the latter is, any of them would be. There is also the moral issue involved with a 'railfan organization' holding and benefiting from copyright on the printed version, and perhaps from 'licensed' versions of a digital version.
This is not an example of an annoying trend that followed the DMCA, where people who had reprinted long-out-of-copyright texts as 'resources' (there are many, for example, in the steam-hobbyist community) could then petition to keep Google Books and HathiTrust from displaying the originals.
Jack Delano was the great photographer of railroad scenes in Chicago and along the Santa Fe to California.
He visited Mauch Chunk and took these
Just guessing, but looking at the print, composition, and layout style that book seems to have been originally produced some years ago.
I just checked the "hathi" link, that book's an revised edition from 1962, the original was first printed in 1956. In addition, it looks like it was converted to microfilm (Remember that? I do.) at some point. They probably tossed the hardcover a long time ago.
Even if it's still in print, has the copyright been renewed? They do expire after a time.
The Star ... New York /Philly to Buffalo
Savage Tunnel--- If you bothered to click on the link at the top of the Leigh Valley comment with the pictures and text you will see that the source is the hathitrust and it is public domain and clearly stated as such.
I'll have to remember that. I might be in the area again this September.
Backshop I've only been to Jim Thorpe once, in 2002. I was in the area because I had a ticket on the Rockville Bridge Centennial passenger excursion. I expected to feel the ghosts of the LV there, but it was in the middle of a torrential downpour and all I felt was the dampness... :(
I've only been to Jim Thorpe once, in 2002. I was in the area because I had a ticket on the Rockville Bridge Centennial passenger excursion. I expected to feel the ghosts of the LV there, but it was in the middle of a torrential downpour and all I felt was the dampness... :(
If you ever find yourself in Jim Thorpe again when its raining, get yourself over to Molly Maguire's Pub, just behind the CNJ/Lehigh Gorge Scenic depot.
Have a prime rib sandwich and a beverage(s) of your choice; worked for me!
the photos and text above was scanned from a book entitled "Railroads in the Lehigh River Valley", published by Lehigh Valley Chapter, NRHS. Obviously the University of Michigan cares not for copyright law, hardly surprising given the academic attitude nowadays.
Thanks to the above NRHS chapter, I'll be riding a train of 3 Reading & Northern RDC's this Saturday through Mauch Chunk aka Jim Thorpe on a tour of R&N trackage.
This trip kicks off another season of R&N RDC trips to Jim Thorpe every weekend until fall, and 4-6-2 425 will be riding to Jim Thorpe on 7/6.
No dout about it the PA. Turnpike NE extension sounded the death knell for LV passenger service.
As far as the RDC service was concerned the RDC-2 (#41) was sold to the Canadian Pacific in 1958. RDC-1 (#40) ended all passenger service on the LV on February 8, 1961 and later ran in commuter service on the Reading and SEPTA. It was later donated to the Pennsylvania Railroad Museum in Strasburg/
Flintlock76If memory serves, I believe the Lehigh Valley was the first to operate the 2-8-0 type of locomotive, and gave it the name "Consolidation" as the locomotive arrived more-or-less concurrently with their consolidation of some smaller 'roads.
You'd be right. And for still more fun, look at some of the experimental locomotives they were playing with around that time, particularly the Strong designs (including what is probably the world's first true 4-4-2). You'll find them in Sinclair as well as some other places...
I had a long post on this which disappeared in the worthless phone software over the weekend.
The initial service ran roughly as follows: Black Diamond was the through train to Buffalo; John Wilkes ran to Wilkes-Barre (basically a slower version of the CNJ Bullet we were discussing earlier); Asa Packer quickly became service to Lehighton (and by connection, Hazleton).
It was interesting to see the Mauch Chunk (which I thought was still firmly called 'Jim Thorpe' at the time!) poster, as I'd had no idea promoting that service to that community was considered important; I think it's akin to the Delta Eagle - the only way for large numbers of people to get to Wilkes-Barre, or New York, or Beth/Phila at that time. Much of this would be increasingly siphoned away by good roads, including Rt. 22 to the south, but it was and is an exciting trip to get into the valley where Mauch Chunk, that glorious vacation spot, is situated.
The thing that definitively killed the LV passenger trains, all of them nearly at once, was the construction of the Northeast Extension of the Pennsylvania Turnpike. (And it should be noted that an observation at the time was that the Turnpike as built had relatively light traffic! -- light, but certainly comprising 110% of anyone who would be riding a parallel train, even one operating directly out of Penn Station behind a GG1 as far as Newark Junction/Hunter Tower.)
Amusingly, the state of Pennsylvania wouldn't let LV take off the Toonerville-RDC service from Lehighton to Hazleton when all the main-line passenger trains came off, so it became even more of a 'shuttle to nowhere' for some few years...
Great collection of photographs!
If memory serves, I believe the Lehigh Valley was the first to operate the 2-8-0 type of locomotive, and gave it the name "Consolidation" as the locomotive arrived more-or-less concurrently with their consolidation of some smaller 'roads. Needless to say, the name stuck and all 2-8-0's were called "Consolidations" ever since.
Scroll down for many great pictures.
Asa Packer and more about the Lehigh Valley
You're right Overmod, as I said I wasn't sure, not being a 'Valley fan.
But if I get that DVD I might just turn into one!
Flintlock76Not sure if that's the "John Wilkes" or the "Asa Packer."
Aside from the poster saying 'John Wilkes' -- the Asa Packer power was semi-streamlined similar to the treatment for the NYO&W Mountaineer. You can see it in the first clip of the referenced Pechulis video.
I can imagine being trackside on a busy day there Vince. Pick a good shady spot, have a picnic hamper full of goodies and beverages, have some binoculars and cameras ready, and enjoy the greatest show on earth. For free!
Oh, I caught that Erie ABBA set all right! Sad, now just as extinct as the steamers they replaced. Some might say "Serves 'em right!" but still...
Wayne
Thanks Wayne, how about that detouring Erie freight with the matching A-B-B-A set. Plenty of steam and PA's. Imagine being trackside for a day.
Great additional historical info from Mike on Lehigh Valley
Great poster! Who wouldn't want to ride behind an engine that looked like something out of a "Buck Rogers" serial?
Not sure if that's the "John Wilkes" or the "Asa Packer."
Anyway, I went looking for some film of the "John Wilkes" and came up with this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHFNN8HR0WY
I'm not a big Lehigh Valley fan but that DVD looks great! I suppose I'll be putting it on the shopping list for the next train show I attend.
Another outstanding poster ad. Anyone for a ride in the parlour car? These railroads sure fell a long way. What a shame.
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