Geared Locomotives

[B&M482]

Hello,

I am doing a paper for school on the development of geared locomotives in the U.S. and am having trouble finding info on this subject. Does anyone know if there is a book on geared locos, or will I have to put together information from many different sources?

Thanks for any help.

Mark

[Firelock76]

There's probably a book out there specifically on geared locomotives but I'm not sure of a title.  You can peruse copys of "Trains", "Classic Trains," or "Railfan and Railroad" to find the book dealers and see if any of them have something you could use. The downside is that can get expensive. The local library isn't likely to have anything on the subject. However, many librarys nowadays are set up with sharing programs so if they don't have anything on a particular subject they can probably have it sent to them.  It's not like when I was in school in the Jurassic Period where you were stuck with what the local library had, and that was it!  You can see if there's a local rail historic society around your area and maybe they can point you in the right direction.

Right now your best bet is the Internet.  Try Googling Shay, Climax, or Heisler locomotives and see what you come up with.  The website for the Cass Scenic Railroad in West Virginia may have information you can use, they operate all three types!

Good luck!

[B&M482]

Thanks for your response. It is actually for a college paper and on of the things we diecided on was a paper that was free of website sources. I have a number of articles and a book that is actually on logging railroads that has some info. I just have been unable to find anything on specifically geared locos. I belong to a railroad museum and we have come up short there also.

Mark

[daveklepper]

Why not contact Cass Scenic Railroad directly.  Promise to credit them and share their publicity with your fellow students. They will then be glad to send you all the information on an email person-to-person basis to bypass the website limitations.  They have the information you need.

[rcdrye]

John T. Labbe and Vernon Goe's 1961 book "Railroads in the Woods" has several chapters on the development of geared steam locomotives, including Shay, Climax, Heisler and Baldwin.  Also covered are some very eccentric homebuilts.  Looks like it's still fairly easy to find.

[Firelock76]

Glad to be of assistance B&M482.  I see your avatar has a "address" of Seattle, Washington.  I'm not too familiar with Washington state but I see there's a "Great Train Show" this weekend in Pullyallup.  Hope I spelled it right!

Click on the "Resources" tab on the top right of the web page, select "Coming Events,"  and follow the prompts. it's not too hard.  If you're close, you may want to go to the show and see if there's any booksellers there and what they've got.  You may strike gold, I know I have several times.

Just did a little follow-up.  The "Great Train Show" this weekend is at the Washington State Fair and Events Center in Puyallup (spelled it right this time!) Washington.  Saturday and Sunday 10 to 4.  Check www.TrainShow.com for details.

If you've never been to a train show you should go!  They're a lot of fun and no more expensive than going to the movies.

Keep your eyes open for a book called "The Steam Locomotive In America" by Alfred W. Bruce.  It was published in 1952 and there's just about everything in there.  It's kind of semi-hard to find, but I have found two in the past ten years so it IS out there.

Again, good luck!

Umm, they DON'T want you to use the Internet for research?  THAT'S a switch!

Let us know how things turn out, will you?  You've got our curiousity piqued.

[ndbprr]

Mathew Shay lived in Harbor Springs Michigan. His house is open to public tours. Perhaps they would have information on his engines..

[daveklepper]

Be certain to look at the latter part of the "Visit the High  Line NOW" thread on Trains-Transit Forum fpr the unusual Shay geared locomotives used in Manahttan 1923-1930.

[Firelock76]

I hope B&M482 gets back to us with how his research is going and how his paper is turning out, I'm really curious.

[CSSHEGEWISCH]

Ephraim Shay was the inventor of the geared locomotive that bears his name.  Matt H. Shay was the Erie locomotive engineer was cursed with having the Triplex named after him.

[DS4-4-1000]

CSSHEGEWISCH

Matt H. Shay was the Erie locomotive engineer was cursed with having the Triplex named after him.

I don't understand all the hate directed at the Triplex by the railfan community.  The Erie wanted a locomotive that could be used as a helper to move a train up a grade and do that while using the least amount of coal possible.  They did this well and were retired only when the freight business required faster trains.  Who cared if the boiler pressure had dropped significantly by the crest of the grade.  All you needed to return to the base was gravity and brakes.  The fireman had time to rebuild the pressure before the next shove.  So what if the Triplex couldn't move a time freight over the road, they weren't supposed to.  Do we distain Shay or Climax locomotives because they cannot pull the Hiawatha at 100+ mph?  Of course not!!!!  So why is the Triplex held to a standard to which it was never designed?

And yes I know the Virginian purchased one Triplex for use as a road locomotive.  They very quickly realized the mistake.  The Erie Triplexes ran for a number of years in the service for which they were conceived.

[daveklepper]

A very good point.   This makes a lot of sense to me.

[Deggesty]

DS4-4-1000

 

 

CSSHEGEWISCH

Matt H. Shay was the Erie locomotive engineer was cursed with having the Triplex named after him.

 

 

I don't understand all the hate directed at the Triplex by the railfan community.  The Erie wanted a locomotive that could be used as a helper to move a train up a grade and do that while using the least amount of coal possible.  They did this well and were retired only when the freight business required faster trains.  Who cared if the boiler pressure had dropped significantly by the crest of the grade.  All you needed to return to the base was gravity and brakes.  The fireman had time to rebuild the pressure before the next shove.  So what if the Triplex couldn't move a time freight over the road, they weren't supposed to.  Do we distain Shay or Climax locomotives because they cannot pull the Hiawatha at 100+ mph?  Of course not!!!!  So why is the Triplex held to a standard to which it was never designed?

And yes I know the Virginian purchased one Triplex for use as a road locomotive.  They very quickly realized the mistake.  The Erie Triplexes ran for a number of years in the service for which they were conceived.

 

Yes, you can wonder why the Virginian's triplex was so poorly designed that it was unable to make the steam necessary for road service.

My mother had an aunt who lived near Dinwiddie, Virginia (I do not know just how far north Dinwiddie was from the Virginian), and she told me that it was possible to hear the triplex when it  feel the ground shake when the triplex went by--I had showed my mother the item in Trains about the engine, and she remembered it.