Turning Passenger Trains in Chicago

[rcdrye]

Richhotrains post on Dearborn led me to think about how trains were turned in various Chicago terminals.  Since it's not completely straightforward, I thought I would open a post.

Here are the Gimmes:

CB&Q, PRR, GM&O   -  Union Station south wye

        CB&Q and PRR had coach yards nearby, GM&O took trains out to Brighton Park

CMStP&P  - Tower A5 (Pacific Junction) coach yard at Western Avenue

C&NW - California St Coach Yard wye

AT&SF (18th St coach yard loop)

So here are the ones to look at:

B&OCT (B&O/PM/CGW/Soo)

NYC (NKP)

RI

C&WI and owners (Monon, Erie Wabash, C&EI, GTW)

IC (Big Four, MC, later Soo)

[ndbprr]

Ic had a balloon track several miles south around 103d street as I recall. It was on the east side of the mains.

[rcdrye]

ndbprr

Ic had a balloon track several miles south around 103d street as I recall. It was on the east side of the mains.

I don't see any obvious marks of it on Google maps, unless it was just south of today's Bisop Ford Freeway (I-94).

B&OCT serviced B&O/PM/Soo/CGW trains at Robey St.  There was a wye at 14th St where the Altenheim Sub came in from the west that seems a likely spot to turn trains.

[ndbprr]

I asked a conductor on a commuter train about twenty years ago and he pointed out the bridges over a couple of streets at an angle to the mains. The loop is long gone and just the two bridges were all that were left and trees were growing on them back then.

[ndbprr]

Look at 82 and 83 streets. They might be the bridges not sure.

[rcdrye]

The bridges over 82nd and 83d st were part of the Nickel Plate's line from Pullman Junction (near 95th and Stony Island) to Grand Crossing.  NKP had a freight house on the IC somewhere along the lakefront, so there was a track connection to the IC, too. On the other hand, there's a nice pie-shaped parcel just south of there with a relatively new building on it...

[richhotrain]

Yesterday, I was looking at a web site that has a huge series of Chicago aerial photos taken in 1938.  These photos clearly show roundhouses and turntables.

So, here are my educated guesses on some of the ralroads.

C&WI (including Erie, Wabash, Monon, C&EI, and GTW) - C&WI maintained a large coach yard and engine servicing facility including a roundhouse and turntable at 49th Street.

Rock Island - A large roundhouse and turntable can be found at its 47th Street servicing facility.

NYC - There was a large roundhouse and turntable at its coach yard at 63rd Street, next to Englewood Station.

Rich

[richhotrain]

On a 1938 aerial map of the City of Chicago, I can see two roundhouses located on the lakefront at 29th Street, part of the IC rail yard facilities.  The two roundhouses are next to each other, and each is a 180 degree shape with the open end and turntable on the east side facing the lake.

Rich

[rcdrye]

I should have looked at the "Trainwatcher's Guide" for a diagram of 16th St.  There was a Wye leg in the northwest quadrant (gone now) that would have made backing a train onto the St. Charles Airline to turn it an easy move from LaSalle.  The southwest connecting track still exists for occasional Metra moves.  There were also connecting tracks to the CR&I line to the stockyards at 39th st that could have been used.  Except for the "Century" NYC tended to turn entire trains. The Century's sleepers weren't turned so that the Bedrooms, compartments and Drawing Rooms would always face the Hudson.

The C&WI must have had access to a wye or loop somewhere, so trains with observation cars or fixed consists (Wabash's Blue Bird springs to mind) could be turned. Maybe C&WI had rights to use AT&SF's 18th st loop?

[richhotrain]

Among the many connections at 16th Street (SCAL, IC, CRI&P, NYC), the CR&IP ran a balloon track from just south of 16th Street in a southwest direction to connect with the loop in the ATSF 18th Street yard.  Presumably, NYC had access to that balloon track since there were crossovers on the CRI&P tracks at that location.

Rich

[pullman jct]

I don't think the NYC or CRIP used the ATSF balloon track. That connection was used for transfers; sleepers, express, etc.

The IC balloon track was located at Fordham Yard. The east leg of the balloon track crossed 87th St on its own bridge approximately halfway between the IC and NKP mains. The bridge and loop track were still there in the early 1960s but I don't think were used much by that time.

The C&WI turned owner road trains at the CJ wye at 40th St.

Bob Lalich

[rcdrye]

That makes sense from the map and sattelite photos.

CRI&P and NYC could have used the St Charles Air Line to wye trains.  The other CJ wye at 40th St would also have worked for both CRI&P and NYC.

[richhotrain]

pullman jct

I don't think the NYC or CRIP used the ATSF balloon track. That connection was used for transfers; sleepers, express, etc.

On a detailed track map that I have, the balloon track has the designation "C.R.I.&P. Ry." on it, but I cannot tell you which railroad used it and for what purpose.

Rich

[pullman jct]

Rich, are you referring to a track that ran parallel to Archer Ave? If so, it was used for transfers rather than turning passenger trains. NYC and CRIP trains were turned at Root St. near their coach yards.

[richhotrain]

pullman jct

Rich, are you referring to a track that ran parallel to Archer Ave? If so, it was used for transfers rather than turning passenger trains. NYC and CRIP trains were turned at Root St. near their coach yards.

Bob, yes, that is the track that I was referring to. 

I didn't mean to imply that NYC and CRIP trains were turned there, but I was wondering which railroad conducted the transfers there.  

Was it exclusively used by ATSF switchers, or did NYC and CRIP operate switchers on that track?

Rich

[pullman jct]

Rich, ATSF and NYC used that track to move through sleepers between Dearborn and LaSalle St. I'm not sure about CRIP using the track, since they were somewhat of an ATSF competitor.