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Routing from Hyde Park to Washington

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Routing from Hyde Park to Washington
Posted by 081552 on Sunday, August 12, 2012 3:26 PM

I know this question has been answered before..sorry!

 

What was the route for FDR's train from Hyde Park to D.C.?

 

Thanks!

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Posted by henry6 on Sunday, August 12, 2012 4:23 PM

There were several routes use.  Sometimes it was the train that was routed but not FDR himself.  Coming down the Hudson and across the Bronx along the Harlem River to GCT if the President himself was to spend time in the City.  The train then backtracked to the Bronx.  From the Bronx  with or without the Presidential Party, it would go a little north ont he Harlem line then turn east on a wye and branch to Port Norris and a junction with the New Haven Hell Gate Bridge Line to Pennyslvania Station.  If needed, FDR and his party would board there.  Otherwise it was PRR to D.C..

 

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Posted by R.N. Nelson on Thursday, August 16, 2012 2:43 PM

Prior to the war, FDR's trains between Washington, D.C. and Hyde Park would equally use two routes; either the PRR or the B&O.

Using the PRR, in Washington loading was done at an inside freight dock of the Bureau of Engraving and Printing on Fourteenth Street. From there the train would proceed (north) using the PRR freight line which bypasses Washington Union Station, rejoining the main, which is now the Northeast Corridor, near Lanham, MD. The train would continue on the PRR to Penn Station then over the Hell Gate Bridge route of the NH to New Rochelle. There the train would reverse and go to Mott Haven Jct. in the Bronx and. reverse again and travel on the NYC to Hyde Park.

The B&O route involved the same loading at the Bureau of Engraving and Printing freight dock, then by PRR switcher to the B&O at Benning, D.C. (a freight interchange) and with a B&O pilot on board, to the B&O main at Alexandria Jct., which was at Hyattsville, MD., about 6 miles out of Washington Union Station. This train only consisted of three cars: The Ferdinand Magellan for POTUS, a sleeper for his immediate staff and Secret Service and a communications car.  The bulk of the train loaded in Washington Union Station and the B&O road engine would take it to Alexandria Jct. and wait for the three cars with POTUS, where the train was made solid.

From there the train traveled to Philadelphia on the B&O, then over the Reading to Bound Brook Jct. then over the CNJ to Claremont Jct. in Jersey City. This was part of the established Washington-Jersey City through route the B&O normally operated under an agreement with the other two railroads.

At Claremont Jct., a NYC engine and crew would take the train north over the National Docks Rwy. to Weehawken and then over the NYC’s West Shore line to Highland, NY, which is across the Hudson River from Poughkeepsie, NY. At Highland, a motor entourage would take everyone across the river on the Mid-Hudson Bridge and on to Hyde Park. The train would then deadhead to Albany to be turned and serviced and return to Highland for the return trip to Washington.

During the war, concerns for security over the P.R.R. route, particularly at Penn Station and with the reverse movements, resulted in the train being routed solely over the B&O.

 

 

 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Friday, August 17, 2012 10:38 PM

I recall reading in an article about New Haven's Maybrook yard that FDR's train would occasionally come thru there.  The author commented that the switches were spiked before the train came thru.

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Posted by R.N. Nelson on Saturday, August 18, 2012 6:11 AM

Yes, that was done as a matter of practice for safety, to any switches that would affect his route. Also a Train Order was issued.that prevented any trains from passing POTUS and even had adjacent yard switchers stop working and tie down, 30-miutes prior to train time.

Once POTUS  had cleared, the track crews would unspike the switches and the traffic would resume.

When crews were called for POTUS (the day before) they were only told it was a  "passenger extra". But on the B&O at Washington, the tip off was "And wear clear overalls." Most people on the railroad had no idea that the train would be POTUS but even so, it was relatively easy to figure.

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Posted by Firelock76 on Saturday, August 18, 2012 9:58 AM

The "Code Phrase"  on the Jersey Central that FDR was coming their way  was was "Buck Benny Rides Again!"

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Posted by henry6 on Saturday, August 18, 2012 12:00 PM

Via Maybrook is something I heard, too.  Up from D.C. to Trenton then the Bel.Del to Phillipsburg and LHR to Maybrook and NH across the Hudson to NYC track sounds resaonable.

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Posted by nabils2405 on Sunday, August 19, 2012 11:04 AM

Hi--I get the B&O route (daughter went to school in P'keepsie) but understand the PR route. Did it terminate in New Rochelle and then the President traveled by car to Hyde Park?

  Also, did the NYC have a car siding at Hyde Park?

Wayne

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Posted by henry6 on Sunday, August 19, 2012 11:45 AM

No, PRR route would be via NH at Port Norris yard then a NYC-NH connection to just north of Harmon on the Harlem line, then south leg of wye to Harmon and north leg of wye to Hudson line.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Sunday, August 19, 2012 8:10 PM

Henry, I think by Harmon you meant Mott Haven (Harmon is the electric to steam/diesel engine change point about 30 miles north of NY City)

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Posted by henry6 on Sunday, August 19, 2012 8:52 PM

Brain Freeze!  Yeah...I said the same thing earlier in this thread and knew it was wrong...but, ah, well, Brain Freeze!

 

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Posted by R.N. Nelson on Monday, August 20, 2012 7:45 AM

I failed to add the the PRR electric would take the train all the way to New Rochelle (with a NH pilot on board) There the PRR electric would cut off and a NH electric would couple to the rear and pull the train to Mott Haven and head south and cut off. A NYC steam engine would couple to the other end, which was the front of the train, and take it to Hyde Park.

Over the years, selecting alternative routes and variations of the standard ones for POTUS, was a matter of good security planning.

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Posted by henry6 on Monday, August 20, 2012 8:11 AM

The New Rochelle routing sounds much easier than the routing I listed, and more feasible.  However, the routing I gave is the one described in the book about the FDR funeral train which may have been a routing only for that move. 

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Posted by wjstix on Thursday, August 23, 2012 10:00 AM

Hyde Park was a station on the New York Central, but I'm not sure if it had a sidetrack for trains at the station or not. It sounds like other trains weren't usually running when the POTUS train was so I expect it wouldn't be a problem if the train was stopped on one of the mainline tracks - plus NYC had a four track mainline so there would still be three clear tracks anyway.

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Posted by henry6 on Thursday, August 23, 2012 10:27 AM

I believe in the book about the  FDR Funeral Train it states that there was a PVC  siding at Hyde Park; if not at the station, then behind the Roosevelt home as was often the case for monied and important people at that time.

 

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Posted by nabils2405 on Thursday, August 23, 2012 12:23 PM

I searched the web but could not find a description of a PVC siding. What does that describe?

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Posted by henry6 on Thursday, August 23, 2012 3:53 PM

Private Car.  Private Carriage.

 

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Posted by nabils2405 on Thursday, August 23, 2012 5:25 PM

I finally found an article on the Hyde Park siding. Trains, June, 2010 by Kevin Keefe

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Posted by wjstix on Friday, September 28, 2012 8:01 AM

I think it's unlikely FDR had his own sidetrack or spur to his house. The estate was near the tracks, but at that point I believe the tracks are on a causeway with water on both sides, so I don't know if it would have been all that practical. (Plus I think the estate is a bit elevated above the track/water level?) I'd think it's more likely the president got off the train at the station and went by car the mile or so to his home.

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Posted by henry6 on Friday, September 28, 2012 8:03 AM

It was so indicated in the book about his funeral train...

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Posted by wjstix on Sunday, September 30, 2012 5:24 PM

Was the siding at the station, or at his estate??

Stix
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Posted by henry6 on Sunday, September 30, 2012 6:53 PM

I believe it was at or near the station.

RIDEWITHMEHENRY is the name for our almost monthly day of riding trains and transit in either the NYCity or Philadelphia areas including all commuter lines, Amtrak, subways, light rail and trolleys, bus and ferries when warranted. No fees, just let us know you want to join the ride and pay your fares. Ask to be on our email list or find us on FB as RIDEWITHMEHENRY (all caps) to get descriptions of each outing.

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