Santa Fe streamliner

[tjl0824]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCRoCgbRWjU&feature=relmfu

I found this video with an odd santa fe streamliner right at the 2 minute mark. What is it? The B-unit also appears to be black, am I right?

[FlyingCrow]

Super Chief with the "Bulldog" A unit and a brand new stainless steel B.   The shadows make it look "black".    

[timz]

Offhand the Super seems unlikely. When did SFe rebuild that lead unit into that form?

[rcdrye]

The lead unit was Santa Fe 1, one of the original B-B Super Chief units. Carbody rebuilt in 1939 (front truck replaced (now 1B-B) rear truck replaced later (1B-B1). Traded in in 1953. The B unit is Alco DL110 50A.  Train is carrying coaches behind the heavyweight baggage car, so it's not the Super Chief.

The second Super Chief unit was similarly rebuit (10) in 1939, but was converted to a freight unit (2611) around 1941, giving up its 1B truck at the time. This second 1B truck probably went to 1 at that time.

[FlyingCrow]

My oversight!  Yes, so it's the original El Capitan then.   

[ZephyrOverland]

FlyingCrow

My oversight!  Yes, so it's the original El Capitan then.   

I don't think its the El Capitan.  The El Capitan did not handle a heavyweight baggage car and unless it was an emergency the Santa Fe would have not used that particular combination of motive power on that train.  My guess would be the Chicagoan or Kansas Citian.

[M636C]

rcdrye

The lead unit was Santa Fe 1, one of the original B-B Super Chief units. Carbody rebuilt in 1939 (front truck replaced (now 1B-B) rear truck replaced later (1B-B1). Traded in in 1953. The B unit is Alco DL110 50A.  Train is carrying coaches behind the heavyweight baggage car, so it's not the Super Chief.

The second Super Chief unit was similarly rebuit (10) in 1939, but was converted to a freight unit (2611) around 1941, giving up its 1B truck at the time. This second 1B truck probably went to 1 at that time.

The reality was a bit more complicated than that.

Both 1 and 10 were rebuilt in 1938, not 1939.

Both 1 and 10 received two six wheel trucks by 1940 becoming 1B-1B, since the trailing axle led on both trucks. In 1941, 10 lost its cab and became B unit 1A, retaining both 1B trucks. It was not converted to B-B as 2611 until 1948.

The B unit in the video was an E1B, thus it was one of 2A, 3A or 4A and not the DL-110 50A, although 50A definitely ran with 1 during the war.

M636C

[rcdrye]

I concede the E1B.  Should have notice the smaller radiators (The DL110's are nearly full carbody height.)  More interesting is to realize that the Super Chief units and the E1s were probably more MU compatible with the DL109/DL110 than with other EMC/EMD power.

[M636C]

rcdrye

I concede the E1B.  Should have notice the smaller radiators (The DL110's are nearly full carbody height.)  More interesting is to realize that the Super Chief units and the E1s were probably more MU compatible with the DL109/DL110 than with other EMC/EMD power.

I guess I should be happy that you agree with the only part of my response I didn't use a reference for......

I recommend John B Mc Call's book  "Santa Fe's Early Diesel Daze" which despite its odd title is the best reference to the subject I've seen.

On page 83 there are photos of 1 and 10 as 1B-B. the caption for the left photo reads "Fresh from rebuild, the 1-spot beaks in on "The Plug" from Topeka to Emporia, June 1 1938.

The right photo caption reads , in part , "In the summer of 1938, locomotive 1B ...  emerged from Topeka shops.... as the rebuilt 10 spot"

On the page the text reads  "the new six wheel trucks .... worked well enough to to call forth two more copies a year later"

On page 125 there is a photo of 10 showing the two six wheel trucks dated April 13 1941. Below it is a photo of a 1B-1B booster unit. The caption reads, in part, "after rebuild from unit 10L ... as unit 1A, it lost the elevated cab it had as the 10 spot".

On page 198 a photo of 2611 is captioned  "In August 1948, unit 1A emerged  (as)  #2611"

All that seems to support my comments.

Incidentally, on page 83, the two units have small yellow numbers on the red warbonnet. On page 92 there is a photo of 1L dated July 1 1939 showing the large black number on the silver body. On page 89, a photo of 10L dated 21 Jan 1939 still shows yellow numbers.

The video shows a black number so is 1939 or later.

M636C