Dear railfans,
I've recently found the "Official Guide of Railways" published in March 1956 by National Railway Publication Co.. What I'd like to know is this publication periodicity: monthly? Semiannual? Annual? If annual (for example), which was the validness period? Moreover, where could it be bought? Stations? Travel agency? Was it only for rail attendant use? When did this Guide disappear?
Thanks a lot
The Official Railway Guide was published monthly for many, many years. The building where it was published, printed, and stored before shipment was in New York City. If you were on the correct side of a train leaving Penn Station and looked up as you left the station and were in that one or two block open area, you could see the building. In later years they published a passenger edition that started out monthly and then changed to whenever major schedule changes occurred. I just donated my Passenger Guides to the local NRHS Chapter so I can't give you specifics. I kept the older ones. They contain a wealth of information, which you will find as you read through your copy. Every train station had a copy as I remember gettinga copy from the station agent in North Girard, PA when I was just a kid. I'm sure other copies were distributed to travel agents and the like.
Mel Hazen
Jacksonville, FL
Mel Hazen; Jax, FL Ride Amtrak. It's the only way to fly!!!
Most RRs had a distribution scheme on the Guides. The new issues would go to big city ticket offices and when the new (monthly) issues came out the old issues would be sent by RR Co mail to to the next station on the list. By the time they worked their way down to West Nowhere they could be pretty dog-eared.
A usefull feature for psgr train freaks is the equipment lists for the various trains that would ,typically, show how many and which type of Pullmans and between which points each train carried. Coaches would sometimes be listed by number used but more typically just an indication that some undetermined number ran from Ato B and they don't show head end cars, but you can make up a fairly accurate consist of Pullmans using them.
I say thank you, Mr. Mel Hazen and jimrice4449, for your helpful answering.
One more question, be patient: I know that in the second half of the fifties US passenger traffic began to decline in considerable way (sigh!). Being not really knowledgeable about this, I wonder if it is true. Is a March 1956 "Official Guide of Railways" a declining passenger trains one?
Thank you for your attention.
Sure-- lots of passenger service had already disappeared, years before 1956. Probably hundreds of branch lines had some sort of passenger service in, say, 1930 and had lost it before 1956. A fair number of main lines, too. And those lines that still had passenger trains in 1956 almost certainly had fewer than they had had 5-10 years before.
Any particular line you're wondering about? We can look in the older Guide and compare it to yours.
Are the Official Guides only for passenger operation or do/did they include scheduled freight trains?
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
About the listing of exact coaches and number of seats. That usually depended on whether a train had re specifically assigned reserved seats.
Official Railroad Guides were often located in the lounge car of major trains. Hotel Red Books could be found in the trains, in the aisles of sleeping cars for example.
If my apartment was burning down and I could only take ONE railroad item ,it would, hands-down, be an Offical Railway Guide---because it includes everybody. I would also prefer one from the mid-50's, kind of a peak year for passenger railroading broadly speaking before such seriouss cuts in service started.
I would take the ORG over anything Amtrak just because Amtrak stuff can be gotten so much more easily.
ETR_500 wrote: I say thank you, Mr. Mel Hazen and jimrice4449, for your helpful answering.One more question, be patient: I know that in the second half of the fifties US passenger traffic began to decline in considerable way (sigh!). Being not really knowledgeable about this, I wonder if it is true. Is a March 1956 "Official Guide of Railways" a declining passenger trains one?Thank you for your attention.
o, that is still a "safe" year. I would not go too much later, though. 1956 is fine. You have to remember the new Denver Zephiyr, the new Hi-level cars on El Capitan, maybe some other newbies as the death watch began. 1956 is ok.
Winter of 57 gets bad, though, due to the discontinuance of the "Dixieland" on the former "Disie Flagler" route from Chicago to Miami. That was one of the original and at one time busiest of the various CHI-FLA routes. And good through serv ice stopped Nov. 29, 1957. That is a bad sign. It is biased on my part, as that is the first train I ever rode.
But in today's climate when there is no direct service whatsoever from CHiIto FLA that loss looms large. NOTE. yes i know good service still was provided by the City fo Miami and the South Wind.
Some issues of the ORG included freight service. I pulled a Dec. 1969 issue out of the stack of stuff and, as an example, you can find freight scehdules for MP, C&EI, CNW, ATSF, CB&Q, and others. Also, some issues included lists of past and present rr names - very useful to find out who owned what yrs ago. Bill makes a good point - I'd take one from the 1929-1930 period, though.
Hope this helps
work safe
Don't mean to hijack the thread... but (obviously I have just done so), does anybody have a guide that might tell me what freight trains might have been doing some switching in the Seymour, Indiana area in June and July of 1949? Might answer a question that is related to my "compulsion" about Steam Locomotives! (Yes, a long shot at best!) It would be B&O, PRR or C.M.St.P.&P. (I think). I am having trouble narrowing down the dates for sure, I only know it was a Friday evening (probably around 8:00 to 9:00 PM) that was warm (hot) and raining. Weather reports from the Seymour Tribune of that era show only these dates as fitting that weather.
Friday, June 10, 1949 Friday, June 17, 1949 Friday, June 24, 1949 Friday, July 22, 1949 Friday, July 29, 1949
ANY info would be appreciated.
Another thing about at least 1956. You want to include the invention of slumber coaches and that happend along about then.
Also, it was not until about 1954-55 that Caanada came out with its giant streamliner program. That would be the Canadian for CP and the Super Continental for CN. You would not want to leave them out.
Semper:
I do not have a 1949 OG, but do have a OG for 1946 and 1953 ( plus other dates).
In 1946 PRR hada train 327 which ran from Louisville to Indy at 843pm. B&O had train 61 to St. Louis which arrived at 715pm
In 1953 PRR had the 208/308 Blue Grass Special which arrived at 710pm for Louisville and train #4 at 617pm on the B&O.
Cant help you other than that.
Official Guides are great reference tools and fun to look at. One can pickup OG's reasonally priced on Ebay auctions. It is very interesting to not only see the disappearance of passenger trains in the 50's and 60's, but also the merger movement during that same era.
ed
Are the times you listed for the train being at Seymour? Or are they Departure/Arrival times at the terminii?
I know reading these types of things can be fascinating. While researching the weather I read (well..., "scanned") all the Seymour Tribune newspapers for Jan, 1949 thru June, 1950 and found way too MANY diversions to read... (besides the comics!)
1949 Local news:
New "interlocking" installed at the midtown RR diamond. This was hailed as a wonderous thing that would eliminate trains having to stop and manually flag the crossing (and thus blocking grade crossings throughout the town for extended periods). Prior to the interlocking the crossing was basically a 4-way stop.
Once the interlocking was installed, the city tried to impose speed limits for trains within the city limits, because they now seldom had to stop they were a hazard going at higher speeds! The RRs objected and the city said the speed limit would not be applicable to any RR that had a passenger train that stopped there. The city attorney (rightfully) quashed it before the 3rd reading made it law, but the RRs said they would not eliminate the passenger service.
A city block sized fire destroyed several businesses. This was especially interesting to me as there was a photo that showed the RR ice building in the background that was of special interest to me for other reasons.
A new Greyhound Bus station opened. This was BIG news as it was covered for two day before the opening. It also helped me eliminate over half of the weather reports since I know that what I am seeking did not occur at the "new" bus station.
1949 National News:
The Whitehouse was to be torn down and a new one built, to be more in keeping with America's image! After a lot of outrage from history minded individuals, it was decided to just gut and rebuild the interior. During the rebuild, someone on the committee that decided what to do, took a door hingepin and encased it in glass as a souvineer paperweight to see if there might be a market for such things... this caused such additional outrage that all scrap from the site was either buried in a "secret landfill", or if the item was reusable, the paperwork was obscured such that no one would know the item came from the Whitehouse. Laborers leaving the worksite were searched to be sure they were not taking souvineers.
The French demonstrated an airplane that was launched from the top of a larger airplane... the photo looked remarkably like the Space Shuttle on top of a 747... just lots smaller!
A coal miner's strike caused the Federal Government to tell RRs to eliminate all trains for which they did not have a 30-day supply of coal. Refer back to the Local news... the RRs got to elimate the passenger service that they wanted to, by order of the Federal Government!
Those times were the Seymour, Indiana times.
Do you mind my asking your interest in the trains at those times? Did you happen to see a train at that time?
I have one photo of Seymour, a Penn Central train southbound over the B&O crossing around 1975.
Thanks. At least it tells me that I could very well learn which trains were in the area at the time I want to know, "IF" I could get an Official Guide of Railways that covered June/July 1949.
Yes, there is a reason for my request. See the thread on the Trains Magazine board about "What Sparked Your Interest In Trains?"
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/2/1173742/ShowPost.aspx#1173742
(near the bottom of the second page in the thread). I explained it there.
I have been researching it for several years now, off and on. I have enlisted the aid of the Jackson County Librarian and a few others, even found a co-worker here in Cedar Rapids, Iowa that is from Seymour, Indiana. He and his mother have been a great help in remembering little details.
Unfortunately, everybody that "I" knew that would have exact details have passed away. Mom kept saying, "If there is anything you'd like to know, you'd better ask now." and I could not think of a thing to ask!
As a kid, I had always thought it was a Monon (dunno why), but when I started the research in earnest I discovered they didn't run through Seymour. That is when I found out it was one of 3 RR's; B&O, PRR, or C.M.St.P.&P. I, at first, discounted it being the Milwaukee Road because the only maps I could find did not show that they approached the downtown area... only had a line across the northern edge of town.
Now, the librarian has told me that someone remembers that Milw had a line into the area of the mid-town B&O/PRR diamond. I also have a new book, "Railroad Depots of Southern Indiana", that has a photo of a freight depot (that was still standing when I was there last year) and it calls it the "Milwaukee Road Depot".
I have studied Fire Insurance maps of the area to see where the RRs had various spurs and sidetracks. Unfortunately, there are no maps for that era, they were made every 7 years but there is a gap of about 20 years, centered around 1949 (ratz!).
But, from the ones the library had, it seemed that the RR's put in and took out spurs whenever it was deemed necessary, like a new business needed bulk RR service, so a spur was built to them. Then they would go out of business and the spur would be removed. I noticed several such instances on the E/W B&O line from the 1910's to about 1936 (the last map before the gap).
I have been assumming the locomotive I seek was probably parked for a while... maybe waiting for permission to pull onto or cross another line and that is why there was such steam coming from the front of the engine (cylinder cocks open due to having been standing for a while) and why we didn't hear it coming (no whistling for previous grade crossings in town, etc.)
I have studied Google earth for evidence of rail lines. I can see evidence of the old C.M.St.P.&P. across the northern edge of the city, but everything south of that has obviously been re-paved over (multiple times!).
I think I know where the bus station was (now it is Summit Cleaners) as it looks like what I remember. except it has an addition on the south side where I think we parked. But, the Hoosier Parts Warehouse is "in the way" of a N/S rail line and I cannot find information as to when it was built (or added onto). I also cannot find what businesses were North of that place to know if there might have been a bulk RR commodity business that train might have been servicing... but then it could have been a MILW line from the north waiting to cross the B&O line near where the passenger station was.
So far, it is ALL speculation based on a faint memory of a "traumatic" event that occured when I was 3 and a half years old, "surmises" based on knowledge of steam locomotives, and circumstantial evidence turned up in spotty research.
Then there have been some totally unrelated events that keep leading me to the C.M.St.P.&P. for some odd reason.
.
My sincere gratitude to all of you for giving all these informations about that important period of US passenger service. I've "thirstily" read March 1956 Official Guide of Railways and, yes, 1956 is still a "fine" year for passenger trains. In my opinion, this giude is a real source of knowledge for every US railways loving enthusiast railfan (above all, for a european railfan interested in US rails too).
Thanks moreover to TIMZ and BILL HAITHCOAT for their kindness: thanks Timz, now I'm not wondering about a particular line. For now, I'm only in a generally speaking interest.
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