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Pink Foam board

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Pink Foam board
Posted by johnbalich on Monday, October 11, 2021 6:48 PM

does anyone know of a good dealer near Los Angeles to purchase owens Corning pink foam? seems not as common here due to mild winters.

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Posted by MisterBeasley on Monday, October 11, 2021 8:34 PM

I always got my pink foam from Home Depot in Massachusetts, but I hear it's hard to find further south.  You might try talking to them locally to see of you can order some, or call Owens-Corning and ask where it's available where you live.  Some big commercial building supply place might have it, too.

It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse. 

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Posted by doctorwayne on Monday, October 11, 2021 10:56 PM

MisterBeasley
I always got my pink foam from Home Depot in Massachusetts, but I hear it's hard to find further south....

johnbalich
Owens Corning pink foam? seems not as common here due to mild winters.

It's always puzzled me why insulation seems to be not used in areas where the weather is hot.
 
Up here in the Great White North, insulation helps to keep the cold air out, which takes stress off the heating system.  It works just as effectively when the weather here gets hot, and our air conditioning is running.

In a hot climate, insulation keeps the heat out and the cool air in, with less stress on the air conditioning.

While I am in Canada, it's about as far south as it could be, while still being in Canada.  Over the years, I've seem temperatures here as low as -40ºF and also over 100ºF...those are, of course, extremes, not occurring for long periods or on a regular basis.

Wayne

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 8:35 AM

We have AC as well as heating (not the norm up here and hardly necessary where I live at 1,000 meters elevation). Our house is well insulated (retrofit) with 2" foamboard (blue up here, not pink) added to the outside of the walls and loosefill added in the attic. When it's 35C outside (about 90F) the AC doesn't come on until after 4:00 pm most days, if at all.

 It is a puzzle why houses in hot climates  are not insulated even more so than in cold places. AC consumes a lot of power compared to a gas heated furnace. It should save money if you were to insulate any house these days. 

Alyth Yard

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Posted by York1 on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 8:54 AM

I believe houses in warmer areas that need a lot of air conditioning are also insulated.  The issue is that they use other forms of insulation.

My house in Louisiana was just as insulated as my house further north, but the insulation was more fiberglass batting.

I can't say why the foam was not used as much.

My kids say they want a cat for Christmas.  Normally I do a turkey but hey, if it'll make 'em happy ...

York1 John       

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Posted by 7j43k on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 9:46 AM

possible reasons foam insulation is not used in warmer US climes:

 

takes longer to cut to size

must cut to fit around wiring and pipes

must seal edges of foam

 

On a recent house I worked on, foam insulation was added as an external layer to a roof.  It was also used on the inside of the concrete basement (floor and walls).  The foam for the walls had slots cut in the back of the foam, and it was actually faster to run the wiring than if it had been a stud wall.  But that's not the kind of foam we're after.

But aside from the above, I'm not seeing an advantage to using foam in wood frame construction without basements (the typical warm clime US method).

 

When I wanted some foam for my layout, I went to a real lumber/building supply place to get it.  They didn't have much.

 

 

Ed

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Posted by BATMAN on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 10:31 AM

If you go to the Contractors' counter at Home Depot they will order it for you. It may not be a local item for the region you are in but it is in the HD product line.

Drop the manufacturer an Email and see where you can buy it in your area. I did this for a similar product and was directed right to the local wholesaler and ended up paying 40 cents on the dollar for it as they sold to me at wholesale.

Brent

It's not the age honey, it's the mileage.

https://www.youtube.com/user/BATTRAIN1/videos 


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Posted by SeeYou190 on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 10:38 AM

Lastspikemike
 It is a puzzle why houses in hot climates  are not insulated even more so than in cold places. AC consumes a lot of power compared to a gas heated furnace.

What???

I guess what??? Do you really think houses in hot climates are poorly insulated???

Do you really think our builders and engineers are that inept?

Houses down here are required to have insane amounts of insulation, and "foam board" is not good enough.

Huh?

johnbalich
Does anyone know of a good dealer near Los Angeles to purchase owens Corning pink foam? seems not as common here due to mild winters.

Hi John. Since this thread has been unfortunately "Spiked" and driven off topic, you might not get much help.

I live in an area where foam insulation board is only available in 3/4" thick 4 by 8 sheets. It is also possible to find 1" thick foam in 2 by 2 "hobby" sized sheets, but it is very expensive like that.

To get my 2" foam and Homasote, I rented an SUV for a trip I was making anyway to Indiana, and stocked up at a Menard's up there. Homasote is also not readily available in Florida unless you are buying an entire pallet.

You could team up with other hobbiests (CosPlay people use lots of 2" foam) and special order in a contractor quantity. People used to do that here to get Homasote.

This is the load I brought back from Indiana. I had to cut the sheets to fit them into the Ford Explorer. It is enough for my home layout and my planned portable layout.

Good luck.

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

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Posted by rrebell on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 10:42 AM

Thats why I use beaded foam as when I started the other foams were just not available.

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 2:41 PM

I didn't take this thread off topic. Just incidentally, insulation requirements in my locale are about double the spec used in Florida. 

For accurately dimensioned foam products you just can't beat Woodland Scenics bead foam board. It cuts nicely using the hot wire or knife producing minimal objectionable fumes. It's a bit pricey for large areas. But then it's moulded to exact dimension unlike house building stuff.

A combination of the WS flat foam board and risers turns out to be pretty efficient for constructing a foam layout. Jointly with Kato WS has developed a variation of their Modu rail system incorporating hardboard panels and other structural items to use with Kato's sectional track which is interesting enough to take a look at. If you use a plywood base then adding the WS riser system is very effective.

Alyth Yard

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Posted by cuyama on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:11 PM

Some bad information and speculation in this thread. Pink and blue foam are often used for underfloor heating systems and elsewhere in basements, both of which are rare in California. Pink and blue foam are available in So Cal, but can be hard to find. There are dealer-finders on both the Owens-Corning [pink] and DuPont [blue] (formerly Dow) sites, but they will often suggest big-box stores that do not actually have the material in stock – and minimum orders are often large. Call first before driving.

Dupont (their version is called Styrofoam Square Edge)
Dealer Locator

Owens-Corning (their version is called Foamular)
Dealer Locator

Another option (though expensive) that some friends and clients have used is:

Foam Sales Group
1540 Gage Rd, Montebello, CA 90640
(818) 558-5717

Good luck with your search. Oh, and call first before driving.

Byron

 

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Posted by CSX Robert on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 3:27 PM

SeeYou190
Since this thread has been unfortunately "Spiked" and driven off topic, you might not get much help

Doctorwayne's post came before Lastspikemike's and was no more on topic, so it's a little disingenuous to accuse Lastspikemike of driving it off topic.

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Posted by richhotrain on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 6:16 PM

The whole thread is likely off topic. It seems to me that the OP is looking to buy some pink foam board for his layout, not to insulate his house. Granted, the OP suggests that pink foam board is less common in LA due to mild winters. 

But, as Kevin points out, insulation is not unique to Canadian homes. Here in the Chicago area, we have summer days approaching 100 degrees and winter days approaching minus 25 degrees. Of course, our houses are fully insulated. In fact, quality builders often substitute 2x6 framing for 2x4 framing in the walls to create more depth for more insulation.

What are our Canadian friends thinking? ConfusedConfused

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by 7j43k on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 7:41 PM

richhotrain

 

What are our Canadian friends thinking? ConfusedConfused

 

 

 

Of somewhere warmer than Chicago, perhaps.  They didn't specify, only said "hot climate".

 

 

Ed

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Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 8:01 PM

In previous threads. people who live in California the Southwest, and the South can only buy 2" foam on special order in huge quantities.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by Track fiddler on Tuesday, October 12, 2021 8:01 PM

You must find some of that stuff John.

Owens Corning pink extruded foam isn't just for breakfast anymore so to speakLaugh.  It has many uses and it's even used under airport runways as geothermal qualities to prevent heaving from extreme temperature swings.  The Panther made airport runways float.

The reason this stuff is not ready available in the south is the lack of demand.  Fiberglass batt insulation is way cheaper and breaking cold air drafts and outside infiltration of winter is not needed down there in the south.  Airtight defense of the cold in the Northern Hemisphere, it is quite effective.

I think ordering it from the contractor desk at Home Depot as suggested here would be your best bet.  Or Menards if you have them down there.

I hope you can get some because personally I really enjoyed working with the stuff as I think you will.  It was one of the funner craft projects I took on. 

I just hate the pink color untill its finished.  I think silver or beige would have been a better choice the Pink Panther could have decided onLaugh

But then again I don't think the Panther ever anticipated his product would ever be used on Model RailroadsHuh?Laugh

 

I wish you the best JohnYes

 

 

 

WinkTF

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Posted by doctorwayne on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 12:48 AM

richhotrain
The whole thread is likely off topic.

Yes, and I apologise for that. The reason for my comment was my puzzlement why extruded foam seemed to be unavailable in warmer areas of the U.S., as it's been used a lot here in Canada, likely shortly after it became available. 
If few builders use it, then it does help to explain why it's hard to find it for model railroading useage.

I'm using some extruded foam to replicate the appearance of the layers of shale, limestone, and clay which characterize open-face areas of the Niagara Escarpment, but I don't use it for  a layout base or for track inclines.

And no, I didn't use extruded foam for insulation when I built my house: fibreglass batts between 2"x6" studs, and more than a foot of the same stuff in the attic.

I think that Brent's suggestion of contacting Home Depot might be a good idea for getting some foam board available.

Wayne

 

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 9:06 AM

Blue or pink is just the manufacturer preference. Same stuff.

Having used both plaster cloth and foam I do wonder why foam seems popular for scenic effects. Hot wire or knife cutting works better than shaving, messwise, and plaster cloth can involve excesses of plastery water you need to deal with but cutting foam or grinding it is just plain messy.

Alyth Yard

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 9:17 AM

Lastspikemike
I do wonder why foam seems popular for scenic effects.

Weight, ease of use, availability of product, personal preference, etc.

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

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Posted by Track fiddler on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 9:33 AM

SeeYou190
 

 
Pefect!
 
My number one reason for using the stuff is it's so light weight.  Otherwise I would not be putting up with the static stormsLaugh
 
I want to take my portable layout to the train shows some day for the kids to enjoy.  I guess I was trying to think ahead for when I get older, I don't want to be putting my back out moving it. 
 
Plaster adds up surprisingly quick and gets very heavy.  Plaster doesn't like movement either as it tends to crack at the stress areas.  Plaster is great if it doesn't get moved around and I do miss working with it.
 
 
 
 
 
TF
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Posted by rrebell on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 10:03 AM

Plaster cloth works fine on show layouts but it must have solid backing, like carved foam.

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Posted by BATMAN on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 11:17 AM

This 6' x 18' piece of bench is 1" x 4" open grid with 2" foam on top. My neighbour and I carried it the 230ft around the house easily. The layout is movable but not portable. There is no way the two of us could have picked it up if it had been plywood instead of foam. If moving a layout may be in your future, foam is an option to consider. When and/or where we move determines whether the layout comes along or not, but at least the option is there.

 

 

Brent

It's not the age honey, it's the mileage.

https://www.youtube.com/user/BATTRAIN1/videos 


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Posted by hornblower on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 1:58 PM

As previously stated, fiberglass batt insulation is more popular in Southern California so the local big box stores don't stock extruded foam insulation.  The big box stores will not accept orders of only a sheet or two of extruded foam insulation as they simply can't guarantee it will be in one piece by the time it gets to the store.  

Hornblower

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 2:03 PM

rrebell

Plaster cloth works fine on show layouts but it must have solid backing, like carved foam.

 

Not according to Woodland Scenics. They specify only crumpled up newspaper for their otherwise 100% beaded foam system.  Plaster cloth goes over the foam base and newspaper lumps. 

Alyth Yard

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, October 13, 2021 10:32 PM

rrebell
Plaster cloth works fine on show layouts but it must have solid backing, like carved foam.

Yes it does. I know several people that finish off their foam surfaces with a layer of plaster cloth.

I built my 1/100 Atlantic Wall like that. It was portable and worked perfectly.

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

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Posted by johnbalich on Saturday, October 16, 2021 2:37 PM

is the woodland scenics foam "bead" board?

 

 

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Posted by Lastspikemike on Saturday, October 16, 2021 5:41 PM

johnbalich

is the woodland scenics foam "bead" board?

 

 

 

Yes. It is higher quality than the usual stuff. It is dimensionally accurate for one thing. It seems stronger than standard bead foam but that may be illusory. It cuts easily with the Woodland Scenic foam knife which I highly recommend. It also cuts well with hot wire or hot knife but I found that takes quite a bit of skill to do accurately. The WS videos make it look a lot easier than it is. I notice less nasty fumes off WS foam products when using the hot wire or knife as compared to regular styrofoam. I'd cut regular styrofoam outdoors but WS can be cut indoors without stinking up the place.

WS also makes a foam tack glue which is formulated to stick well to its foam products. It's "white glue" (PVA of some sort) but it dries kind of rubbery and stays tacky even when fully set. WS also sells a low temperature "hot glue" gun and glue sticks which stick foam without melting it.

WS products aren't exactly cheap but they are of excellent quality and work very well to build the substructure under your tracks.

Alyth Yard

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Posted by BATMAN on Sunday, October 17, 2021 10:45 AM

Lastspikemike
WS also sells a low temperature "hot glue" gun and glue sticks which stick foam without melting it.

Any decent big box store sells glue-gun sticks that have various melting temps for much less than WS sells it. 

In the heatwave, we had this summer, we had some glue failures because my wife had not noticed the bags of sticks had different melting temps. Remember this if your layout is exposed to high summer heat.

Brent

It's not the age honey, it's the mileage.

https://www.youtube.com/user/BATTRAIN1/videos 


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Posted by Switcher on Sunday, October 31, 2021 10:47 AM

BATMAN

 

 
Lastspikemike
WS also sells a low temperature "hot glue" gun and glue sticks which stick foam without melting it.

 

Any decent big box store sells glue-gun sticks that have various melting temps for much less than WS sells it. 

In the heatwave, we had this summer, we had some glue failures because my wife had not noticed the bags of sticks had different melting temps. Remember this if your layout is exposed to high summer heat.

 

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