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Classic Train Questions Part Deux (50 Years or Older)

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Posted by Overmod on Thursday, May 27, 2021 6:34 AM

No -- these were cars people clamored to get into, and then clamored while riding.

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, May 27, 2021 3:29 AM

I think it is an instruction car or prison car, again 13 rows of seven each, possibly 11 rows of 9 each (very uncomfortable), standard- or broad-gaoge.

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, May 26, 2021 12:55 PM

As another hint: at least one other railroad had a train of this kind of car, and regularly ran it in comparable service.  We had a thread involving it a couple of years ago.  But I don't have a specific capacity number for their version of the car...

I note an interesting comment made about their 'comparable' car construction and use that provides insight about the numbers -- the seating is not part of their car design, but adapted to it.

Incidentally, there was a discussion about what would be used to replace these cars in postwar service.  Supposedly that would involve wide-window parlor cars, brought in from logical traffic-generating areas:  a much more comfortable -- and far less useful and suitable -- alternative...

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, May 26, 2021 11:16 AM

106 does not permit dividing into X rows with y seats.

105 can mean 15 rows of seven seats each, possible without a center aisle.  Add a cobuctor and you have 106. Or possibly there are 16 rows, and some space is  usurped by a stove.

This might be the Durango and Silverton Silver Vista with individual doors for each row.

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, May 26, 2021 8:15 AM

All the seats face the same way.  Hint: this is important to why the capacity can be so high...

As a hint that will give it away: The number of passengers is exact in the car description I read.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, May 26, 2021 6:00 AM

But Utah's Salt Air had trailer open-banch cars meeting the description.  They were hauled by closed motor cars until dieselization, then by locomotives.

The UK and Isle-of-Man have narrow-gauge 40-foot (approx.) slam-door compartment cars, without aisles, again outside running boards  for steps and for use by the conductor (guard).  All are pulled by steam.  France has one such operation, but most runs are by petroleum rail-buses.

Each compartment has two bench-seats facing each other, six or seven seated on each bench, part of one compartment may be usurped by a conductor/guard's position.

There may be such an operation in the USA.   Where?

Jack May photo, Isle of Man:

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, May 25, 2021 9:46 AM

I said 'passenger car', not trolley.  The cars I'm thinking of are locomotive-hauled.

Here's a hint: Mr. Klepper isn't right about the seating arrangement.  And another hint: that turns out to be important.

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, May 25, 2021 6:16 AM

ConnCo was legendary for the use of open cars to handle Yale Bowl crowds for football games.  I have seen photos of 15-bench opens with every seat filled, someone on most laps, assorted hangers-on on the running boards and a few nut cases on the roof.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, May 25, 2021 5:38 AM

Entirely inside, no, because the car you describing can only be an open-bench car, seating six across on 16 benches, and the NYNH&H had some cars of that type for an early 600V DC branch-line electrification, possibly in Rhode Island.

105 passengers, plus the operator-motorman., seated on a front bench with passengers, or just stanidng with the 106tth passenger behind himots.  And lots  of Connecticiut Co. streetcars, other systems as well.

Once you intriduce an interior aisle, insufficient room for 105 0r 106 passengers.

Open-bench cars had running boards outsude for use by the cnductor, with passengers using them as stepa directly to-and-from seats.

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, May 24, 2021 9:50 AM

And before you ask: no straphangers, no standees, no one on the outside of the car, and no second or multiple deck.

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, May 24, 2021 4:34 AM

Show me a 40' passenger car that seats 106... entirely inside.

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, May 17, 2021 6:06 AM

Pittsburgh had a surprising number of double-deck cars, including trailers, all of which were double-trucked.  Except for special events (baseball games and the like) the cars were rarely used anywhere near capacity.  Some of them were cut down to single level, but many were retired early and just scrapped.

 

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, May 16, 2021 9:06 AM

There were several systems that had early double-deckers and then went to PCCs, so this one hinges on the existence of trailers.

As a non-trolley guy I'll toss back Pittsburgh Railways; they certainly ran double-deckers long enough to have flirted with unpowered ones.

I was surprised to find an American system that ran FOUR-WHEEL double-deck equipment.  Who knows where and when?

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, May 15, 2021 4:33 PM

I'll throw one out...  This city, known in later years for PCCs, had several double deckers in the early years, both motors and trailers.

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Posted by Overmod on Saturday, May 15, 2021 12:27 PM

CSS owes for this one, too.  Just sayin'

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 12:24 PM

CSSHEGEWISCH

The train ran from CUS to Savanna and was locally known as the "City of Savanna" or the "Lone Ranger".  It replaced the prior "City of Portland/City of Denver" schedule within Illinois.

 

As you say.  Most days the crew outnumbered the passengers.  The train was an intrastate remnant of UP/MILW's pre-"City of Everywhere" combinations.  From the late 1950s on the CofP and CofD ran on the CofD's number and timetable from Chicago to Denver with the CofP continuing to Portland via the Borie cutoff.  The CofLa and CofSF were the other combo.  From time to time int othe mid 1960s all of the "City" trains would run as separate trains, though usually as multiple sections.  The last "City" trains ran with the City of LA's numbers 103 and 104.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, February 16, 2021 12:15 PM

The train ran from CUS to Savanna and was locally known as the "City of Savanna" or the "Lone Ranger".  It replaced the prior "City of Portland/City of Denver" schedule within Illinois.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, February 15, 2021 6:18 AM

I'll toss out another Chicago-area train for ID.  After UP and Milwaukee consolidated the "City" trains into the "City of Everywhere" one additional schedule remained on MILW's west line that went beyond Elgin.  Usually just an FP7 and a reclining seat coach, it was locally known as a "City" train, though not called such in the timetable.  I'll lead with the train numbers, 111 and 112.  What was the train's local nickname, and which "City" train did it replace in the schedule?

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, February 15, 2021 5:07 AM

Glad to give the honors to rc if he wants them.

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, February 13, 2021 4:23 PM

C&NW's trains 1 and 2 (except Sundays and Holidays) and 11 and 12 (Sundays and Holidays only) were the remnant of the Kate Shelley 400 between Chicago and Boone IA.  Cut back to Clinton IA around 1965, they ran out their years with a pair of 56-seat ex-400 coaches and one of two steam generator equipped C&NW E7s, 5012B or 5013B.  They were also the last C&NW trains that did not carry at least the occasional bilevel.  C&NW had retired all other E7s before the trains' last run, and all C&NW E8s had been converted to HEP for commuter or long-distance (with bilevels) service.

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, February 13, 2021 4:02 PM

Whichever was the last passenfger train to operate beyond the suburban zone on the line to the west 1o Iowa.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Friday, February 12, 2021 1:57 PM

And on to the next question:  Which Chicago & North Western passenger train was the last on that railroad to operate with steam heat?

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by SD70Dude on Thursday, February 11, 2021 5:07 PM

CSSHEGEWISCH

I would say that we're looking for air-brake repeater cars.

Correct.  Their name varies from railroad to railroad but they all work the same, carrying their own diesel engine and air compressor and using radio signals from the lead engine to duplicate what its brake valve is doing.  

CN officially calls them "Distributed Braking Cars", but switch lists shorten that to "AirCar", which is their most common name out on the property.

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Thursday, February 11, 2021 12:03 PM

I would say that we're looking for air-brake repeater cars.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, February 11, 2021 3:00 AM

Flame or other heating device to unclog ice- or snow-cloged switches and diamonds?

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Posted by SD70Dude on Thursday, February 11, 2021 1:01 AM

Great Northern was the first to use this specialized type of rolling stock to combat cold-related problems.  

Several other railroads tried them over the years, but CN is their only current user.  

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, February 10, 2021 2:53 AM

Waiting for an SD&Dude question!

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, February 1, 2021 12:57 PM

Well Done!  Unlike contemporary streamline trains, the Rebels were designed from the beginning as separate cars. Carbodies came from ACF's Berwick PA plant (as did all cars).  351-353 came in 1935, 354 followed a bit later.  Eventually used as far as East St. Louis after the M&O merger they were pulled from service in the early 1950s.

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Posted by SD70Dude on Monday, February 1, 2021 11:54 AM

Gulf, Mobile and Northern's "Rebels"?

Built by ACF with McIntosh & Seymour 531 engines (M&S being owned by ALCO by this time) and Westinghouse electrical equipment.  

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, February 1, 2021 6:18 AM

So a great follow-on:  There was one Alco-Westinghouse diesel-electric collaboration (not including repowers) that went in carbodies not built by Alco.  Name the Railroad.

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