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All the Boston Type 5 Car photos you could want

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All the Boston Type 5 Car photos you could want
Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 5:37 AM

Many of mine have already been posted on the Fellsway Line thread and for Mattapan.  I will try to avoid duplicating those posts.  Type 5s served n mre Boston lines than any other type.  We'll start  in the area around Symphny Hall, Massachusetts Avenue, and Massachusetts Station.

The trackless trolley wire is for the part the loop on Massachusetts Avenue for the Mass. Sta. - Harvard Bridge - MIT - Harvard line.  The streetcaes shown ran Mass. Sta. - Dudley.  Today the bus runs Harvard - Dudley, and Mass. Sta.'s building was demolished for the Mass. Pike Interstate.

Watertown Square, Watertown Carhouse, Harvard - Watertown Line, today trackless trolley:

The above is on Mt. Auburn Avenue, near where the scene in the motion picture, The Cardinal, was filmed with a Boston streetcar loaned by Seasore running off the trackless positive wire, but with the rail ground return still useful.  Also on Mt. Auburn Avenue, with the MIT Lightweight Crew on the Charles River (also printed in the Boston Street Railway Society's MTA Years book):

At the Common Street polo short-turn crossover on Trapolo Road, the Harvard - Waverly Line. both cars using the crossover.  PCCs ran the through service to Waverly at the time, running through the underground Harvard streetcar alighting and barding stations from Arlington Heigihts or North Cambridge.   Post-WWII loops were built at Waverly and Arlington Heights to enable PCC operation.

But the B&A-NYCentral Highland Branch conversion to the Green D Line Light Rail was done on a budget.  Buses were boughten  to convert the Dorchester and Arborway-south trackless-trolley lines to diesel-bus, the trackless trolleys then moved to the Harvard Square Lines, so the PCCs there could join the fleet serving the Green Lines into the subway.

The Waverly line had a most pueculiar conversion. The additional negative wire was installed to the Waverly Loop and through sevice with TTs replaced PCCs.  But how to handle the heavy rush-hour Common-Street cutback service had been decided.  So for about a month, Type 5s continuied rush-hour North Cambridge or Harvard - Common Street service.  And during this period Arlington Heights went diesel bus, since Arlington did not want TT wires.  So Sundays saw Waverly - Arlington diesel buses, full-time Satruday and weekday TTs, and rush-hour Type 5s to Common Street.  Eventually a short-turn loop was constructed, but I have no idea where. 

At Revere Beach (two)

 :

Suffolk Downs:

City Point:

North Station:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted by NKP guy on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 8:51 AM

   Beautiful and interesting photos, Dave.

   As a young railfan and traction enthusiast I often made the mistake of getting too much of the equipment in my photo and not enough context.  You seem not to have had that problem and consequently your photos are now much more interesting to view than my early (1964) attempts.  Thank you.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 9:38 AM

I deeply appreciate the complement.  The negatives f some of these photos are in perfect or near perfect condition and may a bit of intelligent cropping and/or light-dark or contrast balancing.  Others require a day's work of spot and scratch removal (also). I hope the results make it impssible to tell which category is which, and your compliment justifies my effort (and that of Richard Allman who sometimes comes up with a final tweaking that is a real improvement).

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Posted by MidlandMike on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 8:30 PM

When were the color photo and the North Station photo taken?  The autos in those photos look a much later vintage.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 4:06 AM

The oldest of the photos are from Autumn 1949, when I was Freshman at MIT.  The MIT-Crew Charles River color photo is Spring 1950 or 1951.  North Station, a later fan-trip, between 1957 and 1966.

The separate Fellsway thread photos are all 1952-1953. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, April 10, 2021 4:05 PM

I am posting the following photo because the caption for the previous posting is in error.  Trapelo Road is correctm but rhe location is Not the Common Street short-turn location, but the enf of the line before the loop to permit PCC operation was added at Waveerly Square.

The following picture proved it:

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, April 12, 2021 9:33 PM

Suffolk Downs Race Track:

Ocean Avenue, Revere Beach:

Revere Beach Station:

Trestle betwwen Point-of-Pines and Ocean Avenue, Revere Beach:

 

 

 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Monday, April 12, 2021 11:01 PM

Did you get to Revere Beach while the narrow gage traction was still running?

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, April 13, 2021 8:00 AM

It closed before WWII.  I started photographing Boston streetcars and trains in 1949.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Tuesday, April 13, 2021 7:04 PM

Do you know of any of those standard gage trolley lines were built on the ROW of the old NG trolley?

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, April 13, 2021 9:41 PM

The Blue Line Rapid Transit uses the old Boston Revere Beach & Lynn RoW.   The former Eastern Mass RoW (Boston El 1936-on, then MTA) and the BRB&L RoW were parallel, but separate.  When the Blue opened just to Orient  Heights, all streetcar service out of Maverick station was converted to trackless trolley or bus, including the direct line to Revere using much private RoW north of Orient Heights.  The Blue line eventually rerached Revere on the ex-BRB&L RoW.. 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Wednesday, April 14, 2021 9:05 PM

I followed the Blue Line on Google Earth.  I see they located the Orient Heights Yard where the BRB&L Winthrop Loop branched off the mainline, apparently reusing the former wye.  I also read up on the Blue Line in Wiki, and found out that the line uses both 3rd rail and overhead wire.  I see the plan is also to eventually continue on to Lynn.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, April 15, 2021 4:29 AM

Lynn and Revere are both stops on commuter trains to and from Newberryport and Goucester.  Before sometime around 1960, this Boston & Maine line continued to Berwick, NH, where it joined the still existing main line through Haverhill, and some trains to Portland, ME, were routed that way.   When I did my load-control  research for my MIT SB Thesis, 1952-53, the line was abandoned or out-of-service north of Portsmouth, NH.  Today, passenger service is provided only as far north as Newberryport (and the branch to Gloucester), and I don't know if Portsmouth still has freight service.

There hass been some discussion as to whether extension of the Blue rapid transit line  should stay entirely on the old BR$B RoW or swing to the west and share n the B&M RoW.  The concessis seems that a direct, across-the-platform transfer between the two modes would be a good idea, but where the connectilon between the two RoWs should be located was not decided, last I heard.

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Posted by rcdrye on Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:44 AM

MBTA cut service back to Ipswich on the "Eastern" around 1965.  The track remained but was out of service to Newburyport.  MBTA restored the line to Newburyport a couple of decades ago.  The ROW is intact to Portsmouth but is missing some key elements like the drawbridge in Newburyport, so only a couple of miles on the Portsmouth end are active.  Portsmouth is serviced now on a remnant of the Manchester & Portsmouth branch from Rockingham Jct. on the Western main line.  Nearly moribund a decade ago, traffic has picked up significantly, mostly lumber and propane.  The rail-highway bridge across the Piscataqua was replaced several years ago, including a track on the lift span that can be lowered to rairoad level for the passage of rail equipment to the Shipyard in Kittery Maine.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, April 15, 2021 9:31 AM

In winter, 1952-1953, although not related to my MIT Load-Control thesis, I used my B&M engine pass to ride the Manchester to Portsmouth doodlebug, 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:23 PM

daveklepper
The Blue Line Rapid Transit uses the old Boston Revere Beach & Lynn RoW.  The former Eastern Mass RoW (Boston El 1936-on, then MTA) and the BRB&L RoW were parallel, but separate. 

What appear to be the old trolley tracks in the pavement are visible west of the Suffolk Downs (Blue Line) station.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Suffolk+Downs+Station,+Boston,+MA+02128/@42.3900035,-70.9983515,134m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x89e36e262211ba47:0x52021ecc07842858!8m2!3d42.3898195!4d-70.9978275?hl=en 

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:33 PM

In October. 1950, East Boston's Meridian Avenue Drawbridge was taken out of service for repair.  Two streetcar lines that used the bridge, Maverick - Revere Beach via Broadway and Revere Street, and Maverick - Revere Beach via Broadway and Beach Street were rerouted via Central Avenue and its drawbridge, and the short-turn Maverick - Chelsie's Balingham Square discontinued.  A substitute service between Maverick and a temporary crossover at the Meridian Avenu Bridge approach ran until all streetcar sercvice ended when theEast Boston Tunnel Line, now the Blue Line, got its first extension to Orient Heights in January, 1952.  5880 is at the bridge approach

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, April 16, 2021 3:44 AM

Corrections made to the previous post.  Thank you.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, May 27, 2021 3:12 AM

When the Riverside Line, Green Line D, was PCC operated.  These photos are obviously on Sunday, since weekday operation always involved 2- and 3-car PCC  trains.

 

Posted by error and duplicated on the Boston PCC thread.  Will delete if  requested. Apologies.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, July 28, 2021 1:59 PM

Three lines serving Mattapan in the classic era, all using Type 3s, except that the line from Arborway did use PCCs wben available off-peak hours.

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, October 24, 2021 3:23 AM

!950 weekday viewe of City Point Carhouse.  Type 5s for lines City Point to South Station, to Dudlry, and rush hours Dudley - Massachusetts Station.  Type 4s left for City Point - Morth Station vuia Subway.  All-Electric PCCs based here, but all were in-service to North Station asnd to Dudley.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, November 5, 2021 7:33 AM

In 1949, lower level, street level, of Forest Hills Station, south terminal of the elevated line above.  A Type 5 just out of the Arborway loop, is enterning enroute to Cleary Square.  John Stern is to my left:

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Posted by Pauley on Friday, November 19, 2021 12:32 PM

Thanks for posting all these great Boston trolley pics in your threads.

I grew up in Mattapan during the 50s and 60s, and since my family didn't have a car, I spent quite a bit of time on the trolleys and subways - it was obviously where and why I became a railfan. (Several PCC cars share my layouts with other locomotives.)

Check out my web site for more info.

Pauley

 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Saturday, November 20, 2021 9:49 PM

In one of the Boston threads we talked about the Boston, Revere Beach, and Lynn narrow gauge trolleys.  I just read that some of that passenger equipment wound up on the Oahu Railway in Hawaii during WWII.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, November 21, 2021 10:46 AM

Correct.  Way back when, an early issue of Trains had an article on this.  Perhaps Classic Trains should resurrect it!

The only single track line, with an unusual operating arrangement during rush hours, as told in Bradley Clark's Boston's MTA book.

 
Actually, the very lst E. Boston line to cease  streetcar service.   Why?   The very last scheduled car into Maverick Station was a  Revere via Broadway and Chelsie Avenue.  I think it used Revere St., Not Beachb St. in revere, but my memory is not certain on that, although I rode it.
 
What was  a  complete surprise, howeverm vwas that at Day Square, instead of proceeding directly to Maverich, we turned right. looped completely around Eagle Street Carhouse, and ran down Lexington Avenue rto Maverick!  We were told that wire work in progress at Day Square prevented the route that was regular after the Meridian Street Bridge had shut down for repairs (without tracks or wire) several months earlier.
 
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Posted by Pauley on Sunday, November 21, 2021 10:47 AM

MidlandMike

In one of the Boston threads we talked about the Boston, Revere Beach, and Lynn narrow gauge trolleys.  I just read that some of that passenger equipment wound up on the Oahu Railway in Hawaii during WWII.

That railroad wound up being a significant factor in my hobby.

From my web site:

Many years ago, I owned a graphics company in Glendale, California, called Boston Type (I'm from Boston and we provided typesetting services). Since I already had a URL (web address) and a hardly-used web site (which was not train-related) I thought it would be a fast track to get this project rolling. It turned into the perfect inclement weather/pandemic pastime.

It occurred to me to search for the phrase "Boston Type" to see if, by any chance, it had any train-related connection. To my great surprise, Whyte notation (a classification method for steam locomotives) does include a "Boston Type" with a 2-4-4 wheel configuration originally used in England.

Not only that, but it turns out that several 2-4-4s ran (by coincidence more than any other reason I can think of) on a short Boston-area narrow gauge railroad in the early 1900s. And as another bonus to me, the Boston, Revere Beach and Lynn Railroad eventually became part of Boston's rapid transit system (the Blue Line) that I rode as a kid.

Wow! How cool is that?

 

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Posted by MidlandMike on Sunday, November 21, 2021 8:25 PM

The 2-4-4T Boston type seems to have been an outgrowth of the 0-4-4T Forney type.  For the BRB&L they were built by Alco Manchester and also Mason Machine Works in the form of Mason Bogies.  A number of 0-4-4T and 2-4-4T locos were also built for the Maine 2 foot narrow gauge lines.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Sunday, November 21, 2021 8:39 PM

MidlandMike

In one of the Boston threads we talked about the Boston, Revere Beach, and Lynn narrow gauge trolleys.  I just read that some of that passenger equipment wound up on the Oahu Railway in Hawaii during WWII.

 

I probably need to qualify my earlier post.  In the Classic Trains special edition (2019) Trains Go to War in the chapter on the Oahu Ry  "... the trucks under some passenger coaches carry the cast iron BRB&L of the old Boston, Revere Beach & Lynn..."  I assumed the coaches were from BRB&L, but Wiki says the Boston coaches were burned and the metal salvaged, so maybe it's just the trucks that went to Hawaii.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, November 22, 2021 4:08 AM

Wicki is not always 100% reliable.  My best guess is that the eight or ten trailer coaches, with their origanal two BRB&L MCB drop-equalizer-type trucks did go to Oahu; and the the larger fleet of motor cars, with one truck of the two originals repolaced with a two-motor Brill E-77-type leaf-spring truck (and seating capacity reduced by the interior engineer's cabs at each end) were those that were burned and metal salvaged. All were wood, open-platform cars.

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