Trains.com

A way to get more traffic on Amtak ?

6164 views
73 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    February 2018
  • From: Flyover Country
  • 5,557 posts
Posted by York1 on Saturday, September 5, 2020 10:14 AM

JPS1
What do you think is the problem(s) of Amtrak and solution(s) that the Congress could fix?

 

Everything concerns the whole issue of government involvement.  Amtrak is in the worst possible position, being between a profit-making company and a government-run entity.  I don't think Amtrak should exist that way.

I want Congress to finally decide one way or another.

I don't think the U.S. should be underwriting train travel unless it is a necessary means of transportation.

If Congress decides that it is necessary, then let's do it.  Some ideas:

1.  Don't require Amtrak to follow railroad union rules.  To pay food workers or custodians two or three times the rate that normal workers get won't work.

2.  Charlie's idea (with which I don't agree) is to nationalize the tracks and run them like we do highways.  Amtrak as a business can't operate if they have to provide track maintenance.  It also can't operate as a profit-making business by relying on tracks run and maintained by other companies that don't really want it there.

3.  Relax certain environmental laws and limit court injunctions on building new tracks.  We have crippled any attempts to build HSR in our country.

I don't have time to come up with more.

One issue I will mention is sure to bring the wrath of many on this forum:

Hire another CEO like Anderson, who does not have a railroad background.  We need new thinking to run a 21st Century transportation system.  We don't need someone who wants to run the system using 1950s thinking.

 

Personally?  I don't think Amtrak should exist if the government has to pay for it.  I also think U.S. highways should be toll-based, airlines should pay for airports and air traffic control, and shipping companies should pay for port construction and maintenance.

York1 John       

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:48 AM

blue streak 1

SNCB RR ( Belgium ) is setting up 2 free rides a month for all citizens. This might be a way for Amtrak to really open up citizens to appreciate the RR.

 

When my wife took her first Amtrak train trip (see above referring to "appreciate"), she said "Never again."  

Most everyone who might ride Amtrak already knows it exists.  They likely have opinions.  Many of those opinions are from life experience.

If you want to "sell" Amtrak, convince people it's the greatest thing (see wife's comment).

Oh yeah.  Exception:  She does like first class on the Acela.  And she's had more than one ride.  And we've paid for all of them.

See, it works.  She likes and will ride on the Acela.  She dislikes and will not ride on the long distance routes.  Didn't even need to give her a free ride.

 

 

Ed

  • Member since
    December 2018
  • 865 posts
Posted by JPS1 on Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:37 AM

York1
  Increased ridership might spur Congress to come up with some solutions to the problem of Amtrak. 

What do you think is the problem(s) of Amtrak and solution(s) that the Congress could fix?

  • Member since
    December 2018
  • 865 posts
Posted by JPS1 on Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:33 AM
Although it is not offering any free rides, Amtrak has a variety of deals, as per the attached link.
 
 
Austin tried “free” transit in the late 1980s.  Apparently, a lot of unsavory people camped out on the buses, especially during inclement weather, and drove away many would be paying customers.  Austin Metro went back to collecting fares after about a year or so.
  • Member since
    February 2018
  • From: Flyover Country
  • 5,557 posts
Posted by York1 on Saturday, September 5, 2020 9:30 AM

Regardless of what Belgium does, I think the OP posed a suggestion that could at least be considered.

Outside of the NEC, the vast majority of U.S. citizens today have probably never ridden an Amtrak train.  How about one free trip per U.S. citizen?  It's possible that even a small percentage of people who took a free ride would decide to try a paid trip in the future.

Increased ridership might spur Congress to come up with some solutions to the problem of Amtrak.

Of course, with some of Amtrak's problems, the free ride may convince many people never to ride the train again, and to demand Congress quit funding it.

York1 John       

  • Member since
    July 2016
  • 2,631 posts
Posted by Backshop on Saturday, September 5, 2020 7:07 AM

In size, Belgium ranks between Maryland and Massachusetts.  Therefore, any free rides being offered would be very short haul.  Other than the NEC, Amtrak doesn't really offer those kinds of opportunities in any number.

  • Member since
    September 2017
  • 5,636 posts
Posted by charlie hebdo on Friday, September 4, 2020 10:44 PM

US homeless estimate in 2018, according to the White House was actually 532,830.

  • Member since
    August 2006
  • 575 posts
Posted by alphas on Friday, September 4, 2020 10:03 PM

The US population is just about 30 times greater that Belgium.  So as a percentage of the total population 19,000 homeless in Belgium equals about 540,000 homeless in the US.    The latest statistic I could find for the US homeless was from 2018 and was about 253,000.     So adjusting for poulation Belgium and the US both have about the same percentage of homeless.

  • Member since
    September 2017
  • 5,636 posts
Posted by charlie hebdo on Friday, September 4, 2020 10:47 AM

With a humane social safety net,  homeless problems are minimized.  Even though the number of homeless beggars in Belgium has increased,  especially in and around Brussels,  it's small compared to here, about 19,000.

How about adopting some European discount schemes,  such as the Beautiful Weekend Pass for travel of groups or regional passes any day? 

  • Member since
    June 2009
  • From: Dallas, TX
  • 6,952 posts
Posted by CMStPnP on Friday, September 4, 2020 10:44 AM

Have to give Amtrak kudos for the new pandemic advertising.   It is a good idea and the slogan "We are here when you feel safe".......very well done.   Someone should get a pat on the back for that.

More traffic ideas?   How about a student rail pass that is intermodal Thruway bus and Train.........marketed towards college students.   Maybe Amtrak could really surprise us all and make the pass good on local transit (city bus) systems as well or good for a discount with Yellow Cab, Uber or Lyft.

  • Member since
    September 2003
  • 21,669 posts
Posted by Overmod on Friday, September 4, 2020 10:20 AM

The "SN" in SNCB should, alone, tell you everything to know about where the funds to do this would come from, who would bear the costs ... and whether there is a 'government' concern with increased numbers of 'non-revenue-generating riders' (or clochards staying warm in winter, etc.)

If Amtrak were run totally as an arm of government, then measures to increase ridership for 'social' purposes might indeed make sense. But in the unfortunate worst-of-both-worlds conditions Amtrak is in today (where it is subject to all sorts of government pressure while still also subject to 'plausible denial' calls for full above-the-rail profitability -- and now all the fun regarding pandemic operations) it would, in my opinion at least, have many more drawbacks than advantages, not least that it would almost certainly, perhaps vastly increase 'farebeating' attempts by other passengers at other times.

  • Member since
    September 2017
  • 5,636 posts
Posted by charlie hebdo on Friday, September 4, 2020 9:11 AM

Belgium is one of the most densely populated areas of the world with a rail network serving most towns.  We have nothing like that except in a few corridors.  However,  this is a federation,  not a confederation so areas should be served by our federal government by passenger rail in partnership with states and regions,  just as we do with roads and riverways. 

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: US
  • 2,593 posts
Posted by PNWRMNM on Friday, September 4, 2020 7:08 AM

Duplicate.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: US
  • 2,593 posts
Posted by PNWRMNM on Friday, September 4, 2020 7:07 AM

This will not bring traffic, but it will bring deadheads. More work, no money, what a plan! If you read between the lines of the cited article, this seems to have been imposed by the govt, as opposed to being some kind of railroad marketing inititive.

ATK serves no transportation purpose. Kill it and give the NEC to the states that it operates in.

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Georgia USA SW of Atlanta
  • 11,919 posts
A way to get more traffic on Amtak ?
Posted by blue streak 1 on Friday, September 4, 2020 12:22 AM

SNCB RR ( Belgium ) is setting up 2 free rides a month for all citizens. This might be a way for Amtrak to really open up citizens to appreciate the RR.  Amtrak could limit distance traveled and allow a one way free trip on one train at least 10 days apart.?  Cannot book more than 48 hrs before to give Amtrak time to allow  enough coaches when available..  No sleeper travel booking but could full fare upgrade when onboard train.

Follow separation requirements of the CDC,  Governent could provide an amount close to the lowest fare.  Could imagine that would possibly push for a revival of diner service?

This might compete very well against the airlines loss leader fares.

 

https://www.railjournal.com/passenger/main-line/sncb-launches-free-rail-pass-and-reports-first-half-loss/?utm_source=&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=19435

 

Join our Community!

Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.

Search the Community

Newsletter Sign-Up

By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy