JPS1When I lived in Australia the Indian Pacific ran two days a week and the Overland was an overnight train between Melbourne and Adelaide. But the market did not support these schedules. So, the operator did the unthinkable for many people. The schedules were adjusted to meet the demand. The Indian Pacific was scaled back to one day a week, and the Overland was rescheduled as a day train.
So Austrailia is doing that to boost tourism and I would bet the economic impact of those trains running exceeds their subsidy. Because they can advertise them overseas and draw people over for the train ride and then market add-ons.
I don't think we will ever see the stat from Amtrak but I would really be curious to see how many overseas people ride Amtrak with it's extremely limited budget. I know over the years I have run into quite a few from Europe on a USA Rail Pass. Scandanavia, UK, Germany......just a few that I remember and the age group was split between retired and college age. About a year ago I ran into a German couple traveling the Milwaukee to Chicago Amtrak route on their first US train trip.....they were happy to hear Siemens would be providing new cars for the train service. Another railfan was talking with them. On the train they were impressed with how much space between the seats.....I guess it is a little less in Europe. Also they liked how large the restroom was (Bombardier Comet Cars).
daveklepperI think your prescription for the Texas Eagle could be applied to other LDTs as well. The Lake Shore Limited could better serve both NY-Cleveland and Cleveland-Chicago better than it does. One of the two should be overnight and the other fast day trip, both useful.
Also this is an issue of priorities. I strongly believe Amtrak is going to do this in the future but their priority is to develop a network of corridors first. I am OK with waiting on this or having it tabled to the back burner because at some point Amtrak is going to figure out they can time a train to run on two corridors with a space in between at decent times if they have it be an overnight run.....to bridge the gap between corridors. I think the equipment utilization would be higher than just a layover for overnight and wait on a slot. We'll see though.
I think your prescription for the Texas Eagle could be applied to other LDTs as well. The Lake Shore Limited could better serve both NY-Cleveland and Cleveland-Chicago better than it does. One of the two should be overnight and the other fast day trip, both useful.
BaltACDMy understanding is that no passenger service in the world is fare box profitable - why does the US think Amtrak should be fare box profitable?
Agree for regular conveyance passenger trains but the cruise passenger train niche is largely profitable in several countries and doing well. I am not sure we need to preserve the entire LD train network but it makes sense to preserve a few. Not just out of nostalgia but our National Parks are overcrowded and our population as a country continues to increase. Most of the older generation does not have the means to access the scenic areas of this country cheaply outside a National Park or Cruise Train, IMHO. I think if you converted the Empire Builder and Califorinia Zephyr to cruise trains you could preserve both routes and spin them off to a private operator.
As for the Texas Eagle. It is more an overnight train and is becomming increasingly a two corridor train as population increases and the roads congest (Chicago to St. Louis) and (Dallas to San Antonio) I would tighten it's schedule more with the 125 mph capable equipment that is on the way and retain it as an overnight train. Perhaps tweak it's schedule a little more and drop a few tiny stations stops as well. I still think overnight trains have potential probably more so than the three day West Coast trains as they can use the night sleeping hours to run across two corridors at convienent times vs just one, one way. So time the train to arrive in St. Louis at 9 or 10 p.m. Southbound and arrive in Dallas at 7:00 or 8:00 a.m. South bound. If properly routed and timed there is a potential for overnight trains in this country.
The problem with Amtrak LD trains is they were never really funded fully in most of the years they operated and so were always operating on a shoe string budget.
Amtrak's one size fits all view of a rail corridor 500 miles or less is kind of a low hanging fruit, little effort as possible cop out. I think is a little shortsighted. Anyways, I am all for getting the trains off the taxpayer dole which I think can be accomplished with better management of marketing, cobranding, and new equipment that is better designed to differentiate between three classes of service. The challenge is finding a private company that is willing to step up.
Your not going to get the overnight trains off the dole the way they are running now or for that matter the LD trains that take 2-3 days to reach their destination.
Flintlock76 York1 I think I'm the one who may have gotten this thread off-topic again. Don't feel bad, we've all done it! Some more so than others!
York1 I think I'm the one who may have gotten this thread off-topic again.
Don't feel bad, we've all done it! Some more so than others!
In face to face conversations among friends and acquaintances does the conversation ever stay 'totally on point'? Why should a forum thread be any different?
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
York1I think I'm the one who may have gotten this thread off-topic again.
I think I'm the one who may have gotten this thread off-topic again.
I love the idea of the 1940s-1950s dining car with first-class meals. However, I think in this day and age, it's out of the question.
Unless I'm going on a rail cruise, I'm not going to worry about the food. I will use the train for the same reason I use the plane -- transportation.
That doesn't mean Amtrak should just serve junk. They can make compromises, just as the airlines do. No one (that I know) gets on a plane because of the food.
York1 John
Flintlock76... Staff altercations? Well, Lady Firestorm and I were VERY entertained by a waitress fight in a Shoney's in Maryland! If I remember right there were six involved! No fisticuffs but a lot of screaming.
Staff altercations? Well, Lady Firestorm and I were VERY entertained by a waitress fight in a Shoney's in Maryland! If I remember right there were six involved! No fisticuffs but a lot of screaming.
The 'entitled' are everywhere and resent being informed that they are not as special as they think they are.
Flintlock76Have you ever tried their trout with lemon butter sauce? WOW! I had it in three different CB's and it was great in all three!
I usually have breakfast, no matter the time of day, but my wife loves the spicy grilled catfish.
Actually, the main reason for her to stop at Cracker Barrel is so she can buy stuff at the store. You can't get into the restaurant without walking through the store. The designer of that system had my wife in mind.
York1 My wife's favorite when we're on the road is Cracker Barrel.
Have you ever tried their trout with lemon butter sauce? WOW! I had it in three different CB's and it was great in all three!
York1My wife's favorite when we're on the road is Cracker Barrel.
OK so there is some hope at least via your wife. I would rate Cracker Barrel definitely acceptable for coach but probably a little below what First Class standards should be.
BTW, on the Texas Eagle at least the Amtrak employees did not like the new meals either, most of them packed their own lunch and when I complained to the sleeping car attendent about the food she did apologize and insisted it was only temporary until the pandemic was over. So I am not sure if that was what she was told or if that is the actual plan.
zugmannThat stuff has to be scripted. Happned the one time I went to one in atlanta.
I've been to several in Atlanta.
The cleanest was the one at the Peachtree-Dunwoody exit off I-285. That was over 20 years ago, so I don't know if it's even still there.
I actually haven't been in a Waffle House for eight or nine years, other than the one several years ago on vacation. There aren't any in my part of the country.
My wife won't go into a Waffle House, so now when we travel, we have to find something else. My wife's favorite when we're on the road is Cracker Barrel.
York1 Last time I was there two years ago, the waitresses and the cook were having a disagreement, all played out right in front of me while I ate. It doesn't get much better than that.
That stuff has to be scripted. Happned the one time I went to one in atlanta.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
charlie hebdoI guess it takes all kinds.
Yeah, that's kind of what I say when I hear of people who don't like eating there.
I guess it takes all kinds. I didn't like the "Saturday night's all right for fighting atmosphere" or the food when I lived in Atlanta.
CMStPnPThere is your man Charlie Hebdo.....lol. There might be more than one.
Here I am. I love the breakfast and I love the atmosphere. Last time I was there two years ago, the waitresses and the cook were having a disagreement, all played out right in front of me while I ate. It doesn't get much better than that.
What's amazing is that a chain of dingy diners is now the subject of two simultaneous threads on this forum!
Flintlock76I have, and I thought it was pretty good! Besides, I like Waffle House! How can you NOT like a place where you have to show a pack of cigarettes to get in?
There is your man Charlie Hebdo.....lol. There might be more than one.
CMStPnP RailSpike and haven't had the pleasure of a delicious Amtrak microwaved meal. Hey, I'm just curious. Have you ever ate at Waffle House and if you have.....did you like their food?
RailSpike and haven't had the pleasure of a delicious Amtrak microwaved meal.
Hey, I'm just curious. Have you ever ate at Waffle House and if you have.....did you like their food?
I have, and I thought it was pretty good! Besides, I like Waffle House! How can you NOT like a place where you have to show a pack of cigarettes to get in?
RailSpikeand haven't had the pleasure of a delicious Amtrak microwaved meal.
OvermodThis nursing-home/assisted-living business has been terrifying me for months- here is another probably-demonstrable example. It's hell.
Some are better than others, amazingly so, but having made many visits to nursing homes to repair their copiers over the years, myself and the other techs all said the same thing.
We'd all rather suck on a shotgun than wind up in one of those places. Once you go in your life's over anyway, all your tomorrows are going to be just like today, and all your todays are like yesterday.
Flintlock76"The Last Post" for Johnny's last post.
This nursing-home/assisted-living business has been terrifying me for months- here is another probably-demonstrable example. It's hell.
Deggesty Overmod Deggesty You serve grits with pork sausage or bacon (perhaps also with eggs) at breakfast. You're not from South Carolina or Georgia. Breakfast shrimp is a big thing there. https://www.tasteofhome.com/recipes/southern-shrimp-and-grits/ Perhaps in the Low Country, but not in the Up Country (above the fall line). I grew up in South Carolina, 50 miles south of Charlotte, North Carolina.
Overmod Deggesty You serve grits with pork sausage or bacon (perhaps also with eggs) at breakfast. You're not from South Carolina or Georgia. Breakfast shrimp is a big thing there. https://www.tasteofhome.com/recipes/southern-shrimp-and-grits/
Deggesty You serve grits with pork sausage or bacon (perhaps also with eggs) at breakfast.
You're not from South Carolina or Georgia. Breakfast shrimp is a big thing there.
https://www.tasteofhome.com/recipes/southern-shrimp-and-grits/
Perhaps in the Low Country, but not in the Up Country (above the fall line). I grew up in South Carolina, 50 miles south of Charlotte, North Carolina.
"The Last Post" for Johnny's last post.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2weDBlOTgmo
RIP Deggesty.
JPS1 CSSHEGEWISCH Something to remember, it is well-known that dining car services were not profitable in the pre-Amtrak era and were viewed more as part of the overall service and not as a profit center. True! But the taxpayers were not on the hook for the losses. They were worn by the shareholders. I am 81. I cannot understand why some people insist on clinging to the past when for the most part it is no longer relevant. The day of the long-distance passenger train is mostly dead; it should be given a decent burial. The railroad buff in me says don't take away my Texas Eagle and Sunset Limited because I like to ride them, and they are the only “real trains” in Texas. The finance person in me chokes at the notion of throwing more good money after bad.
CSSHEGEWISCH Something to remember, it is well-known that dining car services were not profitable in the pre-Amtrak era and were viewed more as part of the overall service and not as a profit center.
True! But the taxpayers were not on the hook for the losses. They were worn by the shareholders.
I am 81. I cannot understand why some people insist on clinging to the past when for the most part it is no longer relevant. The day of the long-distance passenger train is mostly dead; it should be given a decent burial.
The railroad buff in me says don't take away my Texas Eagle and Sunset Limited because I like to ride them, and they are the only “real trains” in Texas. The finance person in me chokes at the notion of throwing more good money after bad.
My understanding is that no passenger service in the world is fare box profitable - why does the US think Amtrak should be fare box profitable?
Something to remember, it is well-known that dining car services were not profitable in the pre-Amtrak era and were viewed more as part of the overall service and not as a profit center.
I'd like to see Amtrak return to that level of service, which I also enjoyed, and believe it can be possible.
My daughter and granddaughter took a 29 hour trip on Amtrak 2 years ago. It was their first and presumably last trip on it. The train was over 6 hours late, it was dirty especially the restrooms, the Amtrak personnel weren't that friendly, and they said the food was lousy.
When I heard that I though of all the LD trains I took in the 1950's and 1960's. My experiences were very different. But back then the trains were operated by private railroads not government employees.
Lithonia, I was from Louisiana, too.
I'm probably wrong, but living in New Orleans, I found that grits were not nearly as common as found in Mississippi, Alabama, or Georgia. Maybe it was the French influence on restaurants in NO.
My brother and family live in Georgia, and it seems like a sin if breakfast doesn't have grits. Grits were common in New Orleans, but I don't remember them to that extent.
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