The Acela Express's schedule between Boston and New York is as fast as it can go with the present route. Newer thinner Acela Express trains will not result in appreciably faster schedules between Boston and New York. The route's total curvature between Boston and New York amounts to 12 circles, and the the route crosses several navigable waterways on bridges with moveable spans that must be opened at the demand of boat traffic, and at times that are not always scheduled or predictable. So it is necessary to factor in slow downs that are due to the sharp curves and the delays caused by the openings of the moveable span bridges.
For starters, what is needed is an entirely new route between New Haven and at least the Rhode Island state line that will do away with the sharp curves and the need for moveable span bridges. eventually an entire new line could be built between New York and Boston possible reducing the travel time between these cities to between 2 or 2 1/2 hours.
Phoebe VetIn the past week, I rode the Crescent between Charlotte and DC twice, the Regional between DC & Baltimore once, and the Acela between Baltimore and DC once. The Acela was the only one of the four that was not functionally sold out. It was pretty full, but it did have a few empty seats. On the other three
Phoebe Vet: It constantly appears that the Cresent is always sold out Charlottelville - WASH. Until the new WASH - Lynchburg train is started I believe that my idea of rotating the Carolinian equipment onto the Cresent for CLT - WASH may have merrit. Of course AMTRAK has to wait for some Amfleet I's to be overhauled.
In the past week, I rode the Crescent between Charlotte and DC twice, the Regional between DC & Baltimore once, and the Acela between Baltimore and DC once. The Acela was the only one of the four that was not functionally sold out. It was pretty full, but it did have a few empty seats. On the other three Amtrak crew kept telling people they were not entitled to two seats as gaggles of people kept walking up and down the aisles looking for empty seats after every stop.
Sure looked to me like meaningful numbers of people like to travel by train.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
Al-in-Chicago: You are right as it seems that the incremental approach is a money wise approach. Those lines cans be used for medium speeds if the US goes on to HSR. There is a political and with some citizens a mind set in this country that there will not be a large % of intercity travel by HSR. I believe that the example of BOS - NYC is still doubted and also LAX's Metrolink. I remember being out there and almost everyone said Metrolink would never work. Now its all about lack of parking and continued expansion. I cannot tell you how few politicians I've talked to say that US residents will never use HSR in any appreciable numbers. They just seem to close off their brain when I mention those two locations and others (Chicago, NY, SFO, SEA, even Dallas) as commuter rail examples. They have a very difficult time with the California HSR vote and say all sorts of irrational things. Once AMTRAK can get the 231 miles BOS - NYC down to three hours by getting new acelas that are narrow enough to use tilt from NH - New Rochelle and the NYC - Wash 226 miles down to two hours then we can really see how many people will ride the HSR. For those two routes each mile reduction of the total route will save 25 seconds. Every slow section that is removed will save 2-3 minutes.
I do feel that April 16's announcement was the biggest non event. What did we learn new???? .
Ummm, I don't like to gamble. Except maybe the greyhounds in Kenosha.
FWIW I don't like it when some of the "deficits don't matter" brigade from just a few years ago instantly become deficit hawks and get all sanctimonious about budget restraint. I wouldn't welcome marriage advice from Zsa Zsa Gabor, either.
PV, please PM or e-mail me if this thead does get locked.
I see someone wants to return to fiscal restraint of the last three Republican administrations...lol.
Sooooooo Who wants to organize the pool guessing when this thread will get locked?
First of all a politician will announce many ideas strictly for the positive press and that is as far as they go. Next, eight billion won't get them out of Chicago let alone to any of the destinations. Then there is the fact that the times proposed are all within ten to twenty minutes of drive times (according the the Chicago Tribune 4/16) and will dump you downtiown and nowhere near the suburbs where most businesses are today.Then there is the absolute fact that us taxpayers are fed up with federal spending and don't have any more money to give them. More pork for his Chicago friends. Who is going to pursue eight billion when he is giving away trillions?
RudyRockvilleMD I don't think constructing regional routes is a good first step toward true high speed rail. My concern is unless there is a strong committment toward true high speed rail it will never happen. True high speed rail demands a visionary approach not something that is cobbled together.
I don't think constructing regional routes is a good first step toward true high speed rail. My concern is unless there is a strong committment toward true high speed rail it will never happen. True high speed rail demands a visionary approach not something that is cobbled together.
But what really has to happen is a strong committment to rail passenger service overall. High Speed rail will succeed only if the subsidiary structure of of "regular" rail is available to feed and support it while giving the public a true system of service (service = quality, quantity and frequency, cost effectiveness).
RIDEWITHMEHENRY is the name for our almost monthly day of riding trains and transit in either the NYCity or Philadelphia areas including all commuter lines, Amtrak, subways, light rail and trolleys, bus and ferries when warranted. No fees, just let us know you want to join the ride and pay your fares. Ask to be on our email list or find us on FB as RIDEWITHMEHENRY (all caps) to get descriptions of each outing.
http://www.sehsr.org/default.html
RudyRockvilleMD I don't think constructing regional routes is a good first step toward true high speed rail. My concern is unless there is a strong committment toward true high speed rail it will never happen. True high speed rail demands a visionary approach not something that is cobbled together. True high speed rail requires dedicated tracks without interferences such as slower moving freight trains, moveable span bridges, or sharp curves. But more important, high speed trains must be capable of accelerating rapidly from stops that are few and far between, and their overall average speed from their initial point of origin to their final destination should be no less than 135 mph.
True high speed rail requires dedicated tracks without interferences such as slower moving freight trains, moveable span bridges, or sharp curves. But more important, high speed trains must be capable of accelerating rapidly from stops that are few and far between, and their overall average speed from their initial point of origin to their final destination should be no less than 135 mph.
Well from what I understand the Regional Routes are just the first phase of the plan for High Speed in the Country. Once those are developed then they plan to expand to routes that cross the country, from what I understand. I agree that High-speed trains need their own right-of-ways and it sounded like it would be a mixture of both. The fact the Acela now has to share it's route with slower trains is a real disadvantage. Obama wants to have the same High-speed train service has other countries have developed.
We have the example of highly industrialized Germany, which had neither the wallet nor the space to put up brand-new track and signals as the French did with their TGV's. When I was last in Germany in 1980, the InterCity expresses had just started running from their normal cruise of about 80 mph to about 110 mph in brief bursts, which were announced on the loud speaker so that all the passengers could appreciate it (and not freak out.)
Gradually the old experimental top speed of about 180 kph (110-ish) became the norm and then the IC's started running in brief bursts at around 140 mph (200 kph). And so on. The point is that incremental improvement can work. Straighten some curves, extend some sidings, electrify, upgrade the track, and repeat when passenger traffic picks up. Impossible? I've basically described the NEC from New Haven to Boston for about the past 25 years. - a.s.
I'm not sure we necessarily have to have the very fastest passenger trains in the world, but if they are true HSR, that will be a huge improvement, of course.
OTOH the drive may be there to be the fastest (AND SAFEST) in the world for the sake of bragging rights and or patriotism. Neither way will be cheap. - a.s.
Today President Obama Finally Announced his plan to build a respectable High-speed Passenger rail system in America. The first step is to construct Regional Routes and go from there. Are these the first steps to being able to dewaf other countries rail systems and become #1 in Railroading? Comments?
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