Metra is going to do an overhaul on the UP North Line up through Evanston. they want to convert the bridges down to two tracks. I've got a question. why don't they rebuild the bridges to hold three tracks and build a third main? they could run Express trains from the suburbs as well as locals through Evanston all the way into Madison Street terminal (I HATE calling it Olglvee trnsportation Center). I know it may involve the changing of all 3 UP schedules but the other two lines have a third main on most of their lines, all of it for the Northwest line. People from the suburbs would be really happy when the extra minutes are shaved off by going in run 8 all the way From Evanston.
Mr. Railman Metra ...want to convert the bridges down to two tracks. I've got a question. why don't they rebuild the bridges to hold three tracks and build a third main? they could run Express trains from the suburbs as well as locals through Evanston all the way into Madison Street. I know it may involve the changing of all 3 UP schedules but the other two lines have a third main on most of their lines, all of it for the Northwest line. People from the suburbs would be really happy when the extra minutes are shaved off by going in run 8 all the way From Evanston.
Metra ...want to convert the bridges down to two tracks. I've got a question. why don't they rebuild the bridges to hold three tracks and build a third main? they could run Express trains from the suburbs as well as locals through Evanston all the way into Madison Street. I know it may involve the changing of all 3 UP schedules but the other two lines have a third main on most of their lines, all of it for the Northwest line. People from the suburbs would be really happy when the extra minutes are shaved off by going in run 8 all the way From Evanston.
First question I would as from the UP perspective....are there clearances with the bridges that restrict the movement of 20 foot 2 inch double stack trains on any track?
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
if you mean intermodal. then...i think so, but UP cam't run any intermodal down the line because there's not a connection to the other UP lines up to Kenosha unless it's going south, then it's at Lake Bluff. if you're talking Metra cars, then my answer is definately.
The line in question is passenger only. Once upon a time, there used to be a connection with the 40th Street Yard up the Cragin Line and over the Weber Line via the interlocking at Mayfair. Both lines have been severely curtailed, and 40th Street has been gone for years. It was just north of what is now the diesel facility at M-19A. The third main on the Kenosha Sub went as far as Canal Tower in Evanston, only about 13 miles or so, vice the almost 30 miles out to Barrington on the Harvard Sub. I'm not overly familiar with the Geneva Sub because I don't have to be. It's not my operating territory other than as far as M-19A. I know somewhere past Kilbourn Avenue the Geneva reduces from three to two mains, but becomes three again around the west end of Proviso. I believe they're planning on putting a third track back in there. Freight traffic used to enter the Kenosha Sub between Davis Street Station and Central Street Station (there was a wye) and they also used to run passenger trains over the Cragin and Weber eons ago. I've seen footage of trains in the late 40's/early 50's, light Pacifics shoving cars tender first past Clybourn. There were wayfreight jobs that switched industries all up and down through there. The last business disappeared within the time I've been here (since 1995). All freight traffic now on the Kenosha Sub enters the main at Lake Bluff, coming over from the Milwaukee Sub at KO on the Lake Sub. That all used to be double-tracked mainline, but the Lake is reduced to one and the Milwaukee Sub (ex-CNW New Line Sub) is single track north of KO.
billio Mr. Railman: Metra ...want to convert the bridges down to two tracks. I've got a question. why don't they rebuild the bridges to hold three tracks and build a third main? they could run Express trains from the suburbs as well as locals through Evanston all the way into Madison Street. I know it may involve the changing of all 3 UP schedules but the other two lines have a third main on most of their lines, all of it for the Northwest line. People from the suburbs would be really happy when the extra minutes are shaved off by going in run 8 all the way From Evanston. Ask METRA. It was their (no, it was RTA's) planning geniuses who tore out the third main track back around 1980, AFTER RTA and CNW had concluded their purchase-of-service agreement.
Mr. Railman: Metra ...want to convert the bridges down to two tracks. I've got a question. why don't they rebuild the bridges to hold three tracks and build a third main? they could run Express trains from the suburbs as well as locals through Evanston all the way into Madison Street. I know it may involve the changing of all 3 UP schedules but the other two lines have a third main on most of their lines, all of it for the Northwest line. People from the suburbs would be really happy when the extra minutes are shaved off by going in run 8 all the way From Evanston.
Actually, RTA didn't tear out anything - C&NW owned the line, and UP owns it today. It was C&NW's operating department which figured out that, with some very minor schedule adjustments, the third track wasn't needed to support the service and could be removed. RTA at the time didn't have the expertise to work out something like this. RTA concurred and C&NW then tore it out. Keep in mind that a major reason for the third track on the Chicago-Evanston portion of this line had been the intensive, high speed intercity service that C&NW used to run over it. C&NW didn't want these trains delayed by commuter trains (which, in those days, made many more stops than they do today). By 1980, the intercity traffic was all gone. You don't pay to maintain infrastructure that you don't need.
By the way, most Metra lines don't have 3 tracks outside of track near terminals- most have 2 (IC Electric has more north of 67th street). Of the ones that have 3, the only line where this infrastructure is required just to support the commuter service is the UP Northwest Line. The UP West Line has 3 tracks, but the center track isn't normally used for commuter trains. The corridor, however, needs 3 tracks due to very heavy freight traffic.. The BNSF corridor also has 3 tracks, and all 3 are used for commuter trains. But, again, this corridor has heavy freight service, as well as Amtrak service, requiring this amount of infrastructure. In contrast, there is very little freight service on the UP North Line south of Lake Bluff (there may not be any on the portion of the line that used to be 3-tracked). In addition, the stations on the formerly 3 track portion of the line aren't very closely spaced, as many of the stations which used to be in this segment were closed in the late 1950's. A 2-track CTC line should be more than adequate to handle the traffic on this line now and into the future. Adding another track, with associated signalling (not to mention providing space for an additional track on the new bridges) would be very expensive, and Metra would have to pay for it. Why would they do that if they don't neeed the track? Of course, maybe they can just borrow the money from China.
uphogger The line in question is passenger only. Once upon a time, there used to be a connection with the 40th Street Yard up the Cragin Line and over the Weber Line via the interlocking at Mayfair. Both lines have been severely curtailed, and 40th Street has been gone for years. It was just north of what is now the diesel facility at M-19A. The third main on the Kenosha Sub went as far as Canal Tower in Evanston, only about 13 miles or so, vice the almost 30 miles out to Barrington on the Harvard Sub. I'm not overly familiar with the Geneva Sub because I don't have to be. It's not my operating territory other than as far as M-19A. I know somewhere past Kilbourn Avenue the Geneva reduces from three to two mains, but becomes three again around the west end of Proviso. I believe they're planning on putting a third track back in there. Freight traffic used to enter the Kenosha Sub between Davis Street Station and Central Street Station (there was a wye) and they also used to run passenger trains over the Cragin and Weber eons ago. I've seen footage of trains in the late 40's/early 50's, light Pacifics shoving cars tender first past Clybourn. There were wayfreight jobs that switched industries all up and down through there. The last business disappeared within the time I've been here (since 1995). All freight traffic now on the Kenosha Sub enters the main at Lake Bluff, coming over from the Milwaukee Sub at KO on the Lake Sub. That all used to be double-tracked mainline, but the Lake is reduced to one and the Milwaukee Sub (ex-CNW New Line Sub) is single track north of KO.
The UP West Line goes to double track between River Forest and Elmurst, and again between West Chicago and some point west of Geneva. Metra paid to have a third track installed on the segment west of Geneva when they extended commuter service to Elburn. I think tthe third track begins about a mile west of the Geneva station, but I'm not sure of this.
UP is planning to install a third track between River Forest and Proviso and on the double track segment from West Chicago to the beginng of the esxisting triple track west of Genevat. To my knowlege, the "passenger" track that runs arond the south end of Proviso Yard between the east end of Proviso and Elmhurst will remain double track. The triple tracking will require expansion of existing, major bridges across the Des Plaines and Fox Rivers (the Fox River bridge is particularly large). Fortunately, the bridge piers at both locations were designed to support the addtional spans.
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