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CNW F Unit Cab Photo

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Posted by cnwhighhood on Thursday, September 10, 2020 7:31 PM
I know cnw had e units too but I dont know if the cab interiors were the same as f units
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Posted by zardoz on Saturday, June 1, 2019 10:29 AM

CNW lover: Just for reference, this is a photo of the cab of a CNW (Metra) suburban F7 (#414 sitting in the Chicago Passenger Terminal awaiting departure, in case you care).

 F7 cab in CNW Chicago depot by Jim, on Flickr

 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Saturday, June 1, 2019 9:57 AM

And thank you for the kind words!

So many times a poster will ask a question which will garner a number of responses, and then disappear without a "thank you" leaving us to wonder if our responses were adequate.  Mildly frustrating, to say the least.

Let me speak for all and say we're glad of whatever assistance we could be to you.

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Posted by CNW Lover on Saturday, June 1, 2019 6:10 AM

I just wanted to thank everyone who replied to my original post.  While we didn't come to a definitive locomotive type that my grandfather's picture shows, I enjoyed reading your replies and learning more about the locomotive's interior construction and various control placement. 

You're the best!

Ed

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, May 28, 2019 7:05 AM

The nearest C&NW station to Crivitz would be Marinette.  I have cousins who used to run a grocrey store in Crivitz and my aunt and brother and I took the "Peninsula 400" to Marinette one year where they met us at the train.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by CNW Lover on Tuesday, May 28, 2019 2:05 AM

My grandfather lived in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.  But, according to my mother, he used to go to the CNW shops in Milwaukee and catch a ride on a locomotive to Chicago, where he would pick up his assignment and run the train from there. 

We don't know if he operated freight or passenger routes.  And, unfortunately, my father passed away years ago so I can't ask him. 

The few recollections I do have are of my father being able to get free rides on CNW trains from Milwaukee to a station near Crivitz, Wisconsin, because his dad (my grandfather) worked for the CNW.  We had a camping spot near Coleman, Wisconsin, and my dad would come up every other weekend.

My grandfather also furnished me with ball bearings of various sizes so I had the best collection of "steelies" for playing marbles of any kid in my elementary school.

 

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Posted by jeffhergert on Monday, May 27, 2019 10:32 PM

zardoz

 

 
jeffhergert
I believe the box over the window is the headlight control switch..... Jeff 

 

Any idea what that black gizmo is that is mounted between the Engineer and the automatic brake valve? Perhaps an old-style feed valve?

 

 

I found a illustration in a Rock Island 1955 train handling instruction book.  It appears to be a DSE-24-H brake valve, Electo-Pneumatic Brake, 24-RL equipment.  The black gizmo is labled as "self-lapping portion".  The feed valve would be out of the picture towards the floor.

Being an Electro-Pneumatic brake, I'm thinking it might be an E unit.  At least something that, at least at one time, was used in passenger service.  

Where did your grandfather live?  It would narrow down which routes he may have ran.  

Jeff

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Posted by zardoz on Monday, May 27, 2019 12:29 PM

jeffhergert
I believe the box over the window is the headlight control switch..... Jeff 

Any idea what that black gizmo is that is mounted between the Engineer and the automatic brake valve? Perhaps an old-style feed valve?

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Posted by jeffhergert on Sunday, May 26, 2019 8:21 PM

Overmod

 

 
Miningman

 

I am not an expert on the appearance of C&NW two-speed automatic train control, but I have to think I'm looking at something very like it.  Is that white roughly cubical box at the side window corner part of the ATC?  Can anyone read or does anyone recognize the box over the window, with the two jewel lights and the handle facing directly down in the half-circular part, with several labeled positions? 

 

I believe the box over the window is the headlight control switch.

The ATC cab signal would be placed between front windshields so everyone in the cab could easily see it.  The GRS ATC box had 4 lights. A green light (clear aspect) with a white motion light underneath it.  The motion light would (should) be on at speeds over about 6 mph. To the right of those would be a red light over a yellow light.  Both would illuminate to display the restricting aspect.

Jeff 

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Posted by zardoz on Sunday, May 26, 2019 11:03 AM

Overmod
I am not an expert on the appearance of C&NW two-speed automatic train control, but I have to think I'm looking at something very like it.  Is that white roughly cubical box at the side window corner part of the ATC? 

Wow, that is a seriously old photo, I do not recognize any of the devices in the cab. Other than generic descriptions of equipment (automatic brake, headlight control, etc), nothing looks familiar--all of the F7s and E8s I was ever on were configured for suburban service with different equipment. The F7 cabs were upgraded to include 26L and other more 'modern' appliances. The E8&9s were mostly unmodified, and still had their 24RL automatic, along with the old-style control stand, still equiped with a (non-functional) transition lever.

My guess would be perhaps an F3 or E6.

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Posted by Overmod on Saturday, May 25, 2019 8:07 PM

Miningman

I am not an expert on the appearance of C&NW two-speed automatic train control, but I have to think I'm looking at something very like it.  Is that white roughly cubical box at the side window corner part of the ATC?  Can anyone read or does anyone recognize the box over the window, with the two jewel lights and the handle facing directly down in the half-circular part, with several labeled positions? 

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Posted by SD70Dude on Saturday, May 25, 2019 6:52 PM
All I can say is that this is definitely an EMD unit, based on the windows and controls behind the engineer's head.  While the headlight control switch (rounded bottom, to the left of the engineer's head) is a fairly universal Pyle-National part, the rectangular breaker/switch panel is a EMD part.  Our F3A looks very similar, but those parts were common across many EMD models.
 
The brake stand strikes me as odd, I don't quite recognize it.  It does not look like the 24RL, 14EL, or 6BL setups that most road diesels from the 1940's and 50's had, so I believe it is a D22L, or HSC (high speed control).  This was a very early electro-pneumatic (today known as ECP) system that was used on 1930's streamliners, and was also found on some passenger units.  The Illinois Railway Museum's E5A and Nebraska Zephyr may be the only operating example left, as you need a matching trainset of cars equipped with HSC brakes.
 
A cab ride in CB&Q 9911A at the IRM, with some good views of the control stand:
 
 
The standard EMD F-unit cab layout, with a 24RL brake system and drum control stand:
 
 
As the C&NW had a large fleet of passenger F and E-units of many models, more detailed info from a Northwestern history buff will be required to narrow this down.
 
I'll post the photo over on RYPN as well.

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by kgbw49 on Thursday, May 23, 2019 5:43 PM

Dilly dilly!

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Thursday, May 23, 2019 2:24 PM

Well, since on-one else has ventured an opinion...

From the information available from the photograph I think it's almost impossible to determine just what your grandfather's in command of.  Most of the EMD F and E cabs were pretty much "cookie-cutter" standard set-ups with little or no variation.  It looks like every other EMD F and E unit cab photo I've seen.  Of course that, and excellent interchangeability of parts was the secret to EMD's success after all. 

Were I you I wouldn't agonize over this.  anyway you look at it it's a wonderful picture of your grandfather, a great keepsake. 

Whoever took the picture concentrated on the man,  and not the machine.  

If you're a rail modeler or toy train fan a framed copy of the photo would be a great addition to the decor of your train room!  

Opinions, anyone?

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Thursday, May 23, 2019 2:20 PM

Double post, see below.

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, May 22, 2019 8:42 PM

No problem, glad to help out.

Certainly hope someone can can solidly identify the locomtive model from its control stand features. 

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Posted by CNW Lover on Wednesday, May 22, 2019 3:08 PM

THANKS SO MUCH!!!

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, May 22, 2019 2:38 PM

Here we are! 

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, May 22, 2019 10:33 AM

Here is the situation as I currently understand it:  the link, which is

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipOkZaIgXaIAHFv67cUbm9FImsLQBCbNOttKo3J9

is available only to people who sign in using a Google account. 

UPDATE: as it turns out, both my phone and 'main' computer are, in fact, signing into Google to retrieve the image, and Google is saying it can't find it.

So please copy and post the image URL again; something might be missing in the transcription.  I'll probably be able to see it when a 'good' URL is there.  Note that Google is not saying access is restricted to the photo -- they can't find it 'by that name' at all.

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Posted by CNW Lover on Wednesday, May 22, 2019 10:26 AM

I've contacted Miningman, as he kindly offered to help, and sent him the picture.  Hopefully, he can get it to post on this forum.  (Strangely, the link works for me....perhaps because Google recognizes my computer????)

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 7:48 PM

I get nothing but a 404 error clicking that Google Photos link -- can you check, and edit the link as required?

I believe from the E7 on, the functional curves of the upper bulldog nose and windshields were common between the E and F (the pilots could be notably different).  A story, possibly apocryphal, is that the windshield glazing or pattern in some of those EMD cabs is taken from a pair of contemporary automobile windshields - I think I remember '35 or '36 Chevy.  All in the family!

I think if any part of the brake control gear is visible, you might tell from that.  At least some passenger units used a different valve setup

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Posted by CNW Lover on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 7:08 PM

My grandfather worked for Chicago Northwestern his whole career.  Starting as a fireman and working his way up to engineer. 

I don't know anything about E vs F locomotives.  I just assumed (you know what that can lead to!) it was an F unit based on the curvature of the front window that is partially in the picture.  But, when I searched online for pictures of E units, they seem to have the same shaped locomotive front.  So, I'm lost! 

If anyone on this forum can help me figure this out, I sure would appreciate it! 

I tried contacting the CNW Historical Society but they didn't have any information about which routes my grandfather worked.  All they could tell me was that he WAS a CNW employee.

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Posted by CNW Lover on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 7:01 PM

I uploaded the photo to Google Photos.  The link in the previous message will get you the photo.  I just don't know how to get it to show up in this message box.  SORRY!

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Posted by CNW Lover on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 6:59 PM
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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 5:59 PM

I use Imgur to put pics on the Internet. It's free. Select hidden and not public when you download your pic, then it will upload it to the Internet when completed ( seconds), then use the insert image button on this site. 

If you still can't do it for sone reason send me a private message on this site and I will forward my email and post it for you when received. 

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 2:01 PM

CNW Lover
]I have a photo of my grandfather sitting in the engineer's seat of what I believe to be an F unit locomotive.  However, I do not know which type of F unit it is.  F7?  F8?  F9?

There is no "F8" locomotive.  Changes comparable to those between E7 and E8 were rolled into F7 production and by the time of a 'major upgrade' went straight to parity with the E9s.  Or so went the tale as I heard it.

In the absence of the photo itself: what tells you this is an F unit (rather than, say, an E or some other cab unit)?  If for example you can see the road number painted on the cab wall, and have even a short list of roads your grandfather worked for, there are people here who would know...

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Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 12:02 PM

Upload the photo to a 3rd party site.  Use the link of the photo from the 3rd party site to have it display on the trains site.

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Posted by CNW Lover on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 10:56 AM

Is there a "magical" way to insert photos to these posts?  I've tried using the Insert tab, but it doesn't work.  I'd like to be able to show you the photo I have, just to make sure. 

I've searched online for interior pictures of F units but none of them look like the locomotive my grandfather is sitting in. 

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, May 21, 2019 10:06 AM

If it's on the Chicago & North Western, it's probably an F7A, especially it was in suburban service.  A variety of secondhand F's were puchased in the 1970's for freight service.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul

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