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Trackside Lounge: 2Q 2010

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Posted by CShaveRR on Friday, June 4, 2010 7:04 AM
Willy2

Sounds like you're having a good trip, Carl! Just out of curiosity, what is the Erie-Sistable? It must not be so irresistible if you resisted.

Next stop is Omaha, right? Cool

Willy, the Erie-Sistable is a small pleasure boat, blue and white, very ancient (I think it's actually wood, and not fiberglass or whatever they use nowadays). It used to sit outside a good-sized factory near the CSX (C&O)/NS (NKP) diamond at Fostoria, which was my favorite location for watching the action in town. They're talking about building a railfan park in that area, and the old factory was leveled, and I had assumed that the boat had been destroyed. But it hadn't. It is a cute little thing, almost cartoonish.

More interesting things in the city. A couple of lots down Main Street from the antique shop we visited was a piece of sidewalk, where asphalt had been paved over some dark red glazed clay blocks, presumably from the Nelsonville (Ohio) Block Company. The red/brown glaze was needed, as the brick would have been a dull gray in color otherwise. The same style of blocks was used on the platform at the station in Marion. Even more interesting, the curb between this sidewalk and the street's pavement was wooden! Slightly mossy in places, too.

Omaha? Not this trip, I'm afraid. We just realized that we should have been going to Galesburg, where we need to pick up a quilt that Pat had lent them for display at Bishop Hill. That will be our next day trip--soon, I suspect!

Carl

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Posted by CShaveRR on Saturday, June 5, 2010 8:10 AM
There is a railfan brochure for the Fostoria area that I should have read before yesterday's post--it mentioned the Erie-Sistable, and also the possibility that it might be returned to the railfan park when it's done!

Yesterday wasn't supposed to be a trip for trains, but these things have a way of filling in. We decided to go a little further than we'd expected to search for more quilt shops, and saw an ad for one in Wyandotte, a town along the Detroit River south and west of Detroit. The ad gave directions to get there that included "cross four sets of railroad tracks", and that the house was on a corner just beyond the tracks. How could we pass that one up?

I had expected that there might have been just a grade crossing with four tracks, two or three of them having not been used in a while, but this time "four sets of tracks" was really four distinct, parallel main lines! The crossing tags identified them as CN, CR, CR, and CN (obviously in either direction). There was an attractive, but abandoned, stone station between the two "CR" lines, and an NS coal train went through soon after we arrived.

Back in the home office now...the four tracks, tracks, west to east, were the Detroit & Toledo Shore Line, Lake Shore & Michigan Southern, Michigan Central, and Detroit, Toledo & Ironton.

Coming back closer to the bank of the river, we drove past defunct steel mills (and evidence of the railroads that once served them, and the deer that reclaimed their areas). About the only major industry that we saw along this road was the BASF Corporation (formerly Wyandotte Chemicals)--everything else appeared to be locked up or bombed out. And once one entered Detroit, the other buildings (bars, houses, stores, etc.) took on the same appearance.

We actually saw a people-mover in motion in downtown Detroit, before heading out via freeway to the suburbs that thrived because of their proximity to Woodward Avenue (Michigan Highway 1) and the Grand Trunk Western, which offered or hosted commuter service well into the 1970s. Amtrak currently makes stops in Royal Oak and Birmingham, and those are two of the best-looking suburban downtowns on this side of town. They put me in mind of Oak Park or Evanston, here at home.

Carl

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Posted by CShaveRR on Monday, June 7, 2010 1:09 PM
Dusting and cleaning the place just to send a birthday greeting to our engineering guru, the Mudchicken! Hope you're having an enjoyable day (forgive me for forgetting it every year--it should be easy to remember since you share it with my energetic and impressionable four-year-old granddaughter).

Let's see...mail resumed, car's oil changed, shopping lists all set, library books returned, grass about to be cut. Now if only I could remember where it was I had to go again Wednesday morning...

Carl

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Posted by nanaimo73 on Monday, June 7, 2010 1:19 PM

CShaveRR
Now if only I could remember where it was I had to go again Wednesday morning...

To O'Hare, to welcome the Stanley Cup Champions home?

Hey, its close to work, isn't it?

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Posted by CShaveRR on Monday, June 7, 2010 2:48 PM
I like the way you're thinking, Dale! Though I probably should just go to work and watch the fireworks from there.

Carl

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Posted by nanaimo73 on Monday, June 7, 2010 3:16 PM

You might have to wait until Thursday. Game 7s are good.

Meanwhile, is your line through O'Hare going to be affected if the airport expands to the southwest?
http://wikimapia.org/#lat=41.9641811&lon=-87.9222536&z=15&l=0&m=b

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Posted by CShaveRR on Monday, June 7, 2010 6:46 PM
I guess Game 6 isn't until Wednesday night. Statistics suggest the Hawks may lose that one, but they also give the odds to the Hawks to win the Cup, because they won last night's game. I actually saw a few minutes of the beginning of the game--it was still scoreless when we left the party for home, but it seemed to the untrained eye (mine) that the Hawks had control of the puck most of the time.

As for the O'Hare expansion, our line has already been modified to accommodate the expansion--the curve has been altered to give the UP more distance parallel to CP south of the junction at Bryn Mawr. The good news is that it was done without reducing the 50-mph speed limit for freights here. I haven't been anywhere where I could see much more than the area around Bryn Mawr, so I can't be sure exactly what was done, but the shift was accomplished in two phases, each involving both tracks.

Carl

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Tuesday, June 8, 2010 2:47 PM

This one's for Mookie, from today's Wall Street Journal (hope at least one of these links work - if not, you may have to 'search' for it to get the full-text version - there's also a short video - 2 mins. 34 secs.).  It was also mentioned on NPR's Morning Edition today.

Big Cats Obsess Over Calvin Klein's 'Obsession for Men'   

A Certain Animal Magnetism Makes the Fragrance a Hit With Zoos

By Ellen Byron - June 8, 2010 - Page One

 http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704513104575256452390636786.html? 

 http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704513104575256452390636786.html?mod=WSJ_World_RIGHTTopCarousel_1 

 Big Cats Prefer 'Obsession For Men' - " . . . proving that herding cats is possible if you find the purr-fect scent", at -

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127555004

- Paul North.   

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by CNW 6000 on Tuesday, June 8, 2010 7:17 PM

CShaveRR
I guess Game 6 isn't until Wednesday night. Statistics suggest the Hawks may lose that one, but they also give the odds to the Hawks to win the Cup, because they won last night's game. I actually saw a few minutes of the beginning of the game--it was still scoreless when we left the party for home, but it seemed to the untrained eye (mine) that the Hawks had control of the puck most of the time.

Not a gian Hockey fan...but there's just something "wrong" with rooting for a team from Chicago living where I do.  Doesn't stop me from rooting for two other Philadelphia sports teams though (Football and Baseball).

Dan

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Posted by CShaveRR on Tuesday, June 8, 2010 7:21 PM
Well, Dan, I guess we need the Green Bay Puckers so you have a good team to root for!

Carl

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Posted by CNW 6000 on Tuesday, June 8, 2010 7:23 PM

CShaveRR
Well, Dan, I guess we need the Green Bay Puckers so you have a good team to root for!

If you say so...I don't root for 'em.  I've been a Philadelphia Eagles fan since I was a little kid.  4th down and 26, anyone? Smile,Wink, & Grin

Dan

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Posted by CShaveRR on Tuesday, June 8, 2010 7:26 PM
CNW 6000

CShaveRR
Well, Dan, I guess we need the Green Bay Puckers so you have a good HOCKEY team to root for!

If you say so...I don't root for 'em.  I've been a Philadelphia Eagles fan since I was a little kid.  4th down and 26, anyone? Smile,Wink, & Grin
Uh...that was a joke, son!

Carl

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Tuesday, June 8, 2010 9:08 PM
CNW 6000
I've been a Philadelphia Eagles fan since I was a little kid.  4th down and 26, anyone? Smile,Wink, & Grin

"Gee - that's too bad." Back in the mid and late 1960's days when Joe Kuharich was the coach of the Eagles and Jerry Wolman was the owner, some of those home games at the Univ. of Pennsylvania's Franklin Field stadium would get pretty hopeless early in the 2nd half. So while my dad and his friends suffered through the carnage and froze in the stands, I'd go out to the upper deck walkway esp. on the east side - and watch the PRR action, esp. on the freight 'High Line' which was only a few yards away. If I was lucky I'd catch a glimpse of a mainline passenger train entering or leaving 30th Street Station. But usually the charter bus ride on the nearby portion of the Schuylkill Expressway provided a better view of that action, plus the B&O across the river, and the Reading further out.

- Paul North.

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Posted by CShaveRR on Wednesday, June 9, 2010 8:11 PM
I'll get the news (good or bad) about the Blackhawks on my way to work tomorrow--unless the neighbors decide to set off illegal fireworks or something tonight.

________________

My first day back to work after vacation was uneventful, in the good sense. There's going to be a major rebuilding program going on at our end of the yard--we've had ballast and ties stockpiled already, now a few carloads of rail have joined them.

Good news, though--the hump is now permanently back to its traditional full-time schedule (twenty shifts per week, with Monday mornings off for maintenance). Two CRO jobs have been restored, and the routine need for our extra board is now reduced to zero (there used to be certain days of the week that someone from the board could count on getting out--now it's just if someone else lays off).

Carl

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Posted by CNW 6000 on Wednesday, June 9, 2010 8:24 PM

Paul_D_North_Jr
CNW 6000
I've been a Philadelphia Eagles fan since I was a little kid.  4th down and 26, anyone? Smile,Wink, & Grin

"Gee - that's too bad." Back in the mid and late 1960's days when Joe Kuharich was the coach of the Eagles and Jerry Wolman was the owner, some of those home games at the Univ. of Pennsylvania's Franklin Field stadium would get pretty hopeless early in the 2nd half. [snip]- Paul North.

Paul,

I was referring to the NFC Championship Game in 2005 when the Packers were ahead by a slim margin and had Philly backed up to 4th and 26...but we converted for the go-ahead touchdown and PAT.  Around here (WI) I mention those numbers and still get dirty looks!   HEHE!

Dan

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Posted by CShaveRR on Thursday, June 10, 2010 5:08 AM
Still don't know the score of the game...but the fireworks woke me up last night! Had to sleep in a little this morning. In the half-hour or so that I've been up, we've had four freights go through(I love quiet mornings, before the traffic drowns out the noises!).

Carl

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Posted by mudchicken on Thursday, June 10, 2010 12:46 PM
Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Thursday, June 10, 2010 2:49 PM

The Greeley Tribune article said the car was a 1995 Ford Probe, and that the train was pulled by a "2009 General Electric locomotive".  What's next - identifying the locomotive model, such as a "Dash 9-44CW" ?

- Paul North.  

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Posted by CShaveRR on Thursday, June 10, 2010 3:45 PM
Perhaps they'll get the railroad right--I don't see how a 2009 locomotive could be found on the BN.

_________________

Got the nicest compliment from a co-worker today: "Carl, we're not going to let you retire until you tell us how you do that!" "That" was giving the conductor a bit of advance warning that the sheet wasn't going to line up (lots of extra cars), figuring where the extra cars came from and noting where they fit in, then (on the other train) figuring out ahead of time how they "shuffled the deck". That saved a few in-wrongs, and probably a lot of time that would have been needed to separate improper cuts.

Sorry, Russ, that's all there is to it: keep your eyes open, remember what you've seen before, and make good use of the resources available to you.

(By the way, I did this without being logged in on the computer.)

I think they're gonna miss me...

Carl

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Thursday, June 10, 2010 4:31 PM

Maybe the lead locomotive was a run-through, leased, power pay-back, or otherwise from a railroad other than the operating railroad.  I could see that confusing or giving pause to a trooper or PR person who's unfamiliar with the railroad business.

Carl, on your 'correct-ordering the sheet' trick above - could you elaborate a little bit on that ?  I gather this was the 'hump list' of the cut of cars inbound to you to be humped, and somehow at least extra cars were 'added-to' it - and maybe some 'subtracted from' it as well ?

Either way, as the hump guy/ pin-puller is trying to match his list up with the cars, I can see his consternation when there's either a car that's not on the list, or one missing that should be.  But I suppose the worst he can do is just cut-off any extra cars separately from the others anyway, and let them roll down the hump to be sorted by someone else - i.e., you.

So I sense where and when the real trouble would be is at with you and your fellow Car Retarder Operators, when all of a sudden a surprise car is there rolling down the hump - less so when one that's supposed to be there, isn't.

I doubt the boys in the inbound yard shuffle the cars just for the fun of it.  Do you normally hump all of the cars from train or track A, then all of them from Train or track B, etc. ?  Or, is there some picking and choosing or certain cars, cuts, or blocks that might have priority for getting through and out of the yard, or otherwise have something in common, such as either destination or commodity, such as haz-mats - though too much of that could amount to pre-sorting by flat-switching, it seems to me.  In any event, as a result could a couple of cuts, blocks, or tracks have gotten mixed in with another track's or train's cut of cars to cause that potential confusion ?

And then how do you sort it out "Keep your eyes open, remember what you've seen before, and make good use of the resources available to you" sounds just a little too glib to me, with all respect - there has to be more to it than that - especially since you're doing it in your head or just by looking over a couple of sheets of paper.  Are you on such a 'first name' basis with all your car 'friends' that you just know that certain reporting marks and car types, etc. just don't belong in with what's currently being humped ?  Or is this a case of, "If I told how, then anybody would be able to do it" ? [after a Tom Clancy novel character]

Mischief  Besides, Carl, if you can do that 'on the fly' without a computer, then maybe you have a lucrative future - in the casinos !  You know, as a card counter - they seem to use pretty much the same skill set as you mentioned above . . . Cool

- Paul North. 

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Posted by mudchicken on Thursday, June 10, 2010 4:45 PM

I had hoped, before I vented, to get either a video clip from one of two news outfits that put "breaking news" on the air with some horribly misleading data that seems to now not show up anywhere.

(1) One television news floozie on site was stating in a leading fashion that there were no gates or crossbucks at the crossing where the accident happened and that the railroad killed the motorist.Angry

There in the background, was the standard 13-B private crossing sign with a stop sign over the top.Sigh (It's been around since the 1960's, use started in CA...now BNSF 3067-01-06 No. 67 sign)

Sorry the guy died, but he killed himself. I wonder what bunch of ambulance chasers is paying off that reporter under the table to generate that crap?

(2) This is out on the Colorado high plains where trees are rare and wonderful things. You may not see any for miles at a time. Crossing sounds to be DOT# 094672P (MP 497.98 on the Brush Sub) which had an injury incident in 1999. There was a double fatal near here two years ago IIRC.

I would hope BNSF can go after the private crossing user/owner (commercial Sod Company) and force removal or locked gating of the crossing. There are two other ways into the sod farm off county roads. Close the crossing  - If it's inconvenient, so what?SoapBox

Can't figure out or identify the railroad? Reporter needs to find a new line of work!

(PS - Burlington Northern died and thankfully went away 14 years ago...."what's green and white and goes ka-boom in the night?".....started right here in nearby Wiggins.)

I think I'm done venting. You can return to your normal forum activities....

Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by Deggesty on Thursday, June 10, 2010 6:20 PM

"Driver killed after being hit by train." Was someone mad at him because he was hit by the train and killed him?

This header is not surprising, considering the current tate of education. Ricki agrees that it is quite misleading.

Johnny

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Posted by AgentKid on Thursday, June 10, 2010 6:53 PM

CShaveRR
keep your eyes open, remember what you've seen before, and make good use of the resources available to you

In the years after my Dad passed I would run into railroaders who worked with my Dad and knew who I was. When they would reminisce about his abilities, I used to think to myself that he could do that because I don't think he ever forgot anything he ever did at work.

He seemed to remember everything, from back in steam days at Lake Louise and Stephen on the big hill, to very laid back branchline operations at Irricana, to almost twenty years dispatching in Calgary. He could look at a train sheet or a list of cars and seemed to be able to spot the problem right away. Sometimes even before he was close enough to read it, it just didn't look right. It seemed like he seemed to know "everything old is new again".

I seemed to have that ability in my jobs, but strangely, as the jobs got more computerized, the less I was able to remember. There is something about doing a job with pen and paper that seals it into your brain forever.

Paul's comment about cars being added in or missing brought up something else I always found amazing. How RR's were able to keep track of tens of thousand of cars by hand. I've always wanted to go into more detail about this, but I will just mention one example.

Everything Thursday at Irricana my Dad would have to walk the length of the back track and siding and record the numbers and types of cars present. He would then read this list over the dispatchers phone to someone in the Alyth Yard Office, who would copy this down by hand. "Irricana, xx High Forties, xx Low Forties, and xx Fifties", and then the cars' numbers. When you consider the number of Station Agents reading the numbers of that many cars, it is incredible that anybody was able to get anything done. I understood the logic of spreadsheets and e-mail from the get go.Smile

Bruce

 

So shovel the coal, let this rattler roll.

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"O. S. Irricana"

. . . __ . ______

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Posted by CShaveRR on Thursday, June 10, 2010 6:53 PM
Paul_D_North_Jr

Carl, on your 'correct-ordering the sheet' trick above - could you elaborate a little bit on that ?  I gather this was the 'hump list' of the cut of cars inbound to you to be humped, and somehow at least extra cars were 'added-to' it - and maybe some 'subtracted from' it as well ?

Either way, as the hump guy/ pin-puller is trying to match his list up with the cars, I can see his consternation when there's either a car that's not on the list, or one missing that should be.  But I suppose the worst he can do is just cut-off any extra cars separately from the others anyway, and let them roll down the hump to be sorted by someone else - i.e., you.

So I sense where and when the real trouble would be is at with you and your fellow Car Retarder Operators, when all of a sudden a surprise car is there rolling down the hump - less so when one that's supposed to be there, isn't.

I doubt the boys in the inbound yard shuffle the cars just for the fun of it.  Do you normally hump all of the cars from train or track A, then all of them from Train or track B, etc. ?  Or, is there some picking and choosing or certain cars, cuts, or blocks that might have priority for getting through and out of the yard, or otherwise have something in common, such as either destination or commodity, such as haz-mats - though too much of that could amount to pre-sorting by flat-switching, it seems to me.  In any event, as a result could a couple of cuts, blocks, or tracks have gotten mixed in with another track's or train's cut of cars to cause that potential confusion ?

And then how do you sort it out "Keep your eyes open, remember what you've seen before, and make good use of the resources available to you" sounds just a little too glib to me, with all respect - there has to be more to it than that - especially since you're doing it in your head or just by looking over a couple of sheets of paper.  Are you on such a 'first name' basis with all your car 'friends' that you just know that certain reporting marks and car types, etc. just don't belong in with what's currently being humped ?  Or is this a case of, "If I told how, then anybody would be able to do it" ? [after a Tom Clancy novel character]

Mischief  Besides, Carl, if you can do that 'on the fly' without a computer, then maybe you have a lucrative future - in the casinos !  You know, as a card counter - they seem to use pretty much the same skill set as you mentioned above . . . Cool

- Paul North. 

Well, here's how it went down this time, Paul:

Our hump conductor is a busy guy, with lots of stuff to do during and between hump shoves. He usually knows what the next shove is going to be, but can't always tell us too long before we're ready to go on it. So when I see a shove coming at us, I check the first car against the hump sheets I have (that could be anywhere from zero to four or more), just to see whether I've got the right sheet. In this case, there were three hump sheets, and the shove coming up didn't (in my opinion) fit any of them, because the first car wasn't right. Note to that: there are times when the hump sheet is just "flipped", and we work "bottoms up". That would be the second check I'd make, if necessary. It also didn't work.

No, I can't read the reporting marks or numbers from my distance to the top of the hump or beyond. I just go by car type (refined by knowledge of thousands of series of "friends", as you put it). I used to use binoculars, but they aren't necessary. So this time, I looked further in to the shove to see if I could see any patterns that fit the cars showing on the sheet. I did, and from that it appeared that we had four extra cars on the point.

Armed with that knowledge, I looked through the sheets I had to see whether I had another piece of the same train on a different sheet (usually when there are extra cars on one end, I suspect that a bad cut number was reported when the train was yarded, and the extra cars will be found at the other end of that shove). I found the other half of the train, and, sure enough, the four cars at the opposite end were the ones on the point--but not in the right order. I mentioned my suspicions, with the admonition to "watch the numbers" because that out-of-order thing, and me not reading actual numbers, left a bit of doubt.

Well, I'd called that one correctly--then a little later in the shove, another extra car showed up. Easy to see because it was a center-beam car where a tank car should have been in the order. At this point, I had to look through my sheet to see whether a center-beam car showed where it shouldn't be (by this time I could see the entire remainder of the shove on the lead). All Center-beams on the sheet were accounted for--so I went to the other sheet again, and found a possible candidate near the other end of the train. It was the correct car again.

Enough? No. There were three cars between this one and the new end of the other shove: a corn-syrup tank car and two more center-beam cars. I informed the conductor that he should be on the lookout for three more extra cars, then I looked at the shove on the lead. Tank cars aren't easy to distinguish from each other at a distance, so, since this was a CRGX car, I looked on my list for, and found, another CRGX car, and a count of that and nearby tank cars confirmed that there was an extra car. I knew from that that the extra car was on one side or the other of the car in the sheet, so that was close enough for a heads-up.

However, the conductor forgot (until I yelled at him), and we had to stop so the pin-puller could separate the cars in the master retarder. That's a tricky operation, especially since the second car (a load) forced the first one (an empty) up out of the retarder and onto the beams. I had to handle the split very gingerly so the empty could settle into the rerailers at the end of the retarder (had it not, we'd have been out of business, with at least a truck on the ground and at most rail and switch damage besides, and both leads fouled). So we got through that...

The two center-beam cars stood out like a sore thumb, so I could tell everyone where in the consist they showed up. So, we had the first piece of this train humped, augmented by eight cars from the other half, randomly placed. Since all eight of those cars had come from one end of the hump sheet, I hoped that would be the end of the story. But no...

Second half of the train (that other hump sheet) comes up--short enough so I could see the whole thing. First car (an ARMN 700000-series reefer) is missing. Second and third cars show up, then two strangers (box cars, where no box cars existed on the sheet). Found them later in the sheet (almost at the end of the consist), and could see no box cars there in the actual shove. There was another car missing from the end of the train (another center-beam), which I found further up. And, sure enough, I found two ARMN 700000-series reefers where there should have been one--that was the missing first car. By that time I had the conductor and other CROs listening really, really closely.

It is rare that there is a car showing up that is totally out of place in a given consist; most of our trains can include a little of everything. But yes, I'm on enough of a "first-name basis" to be able to identify a consist by the combination of cars usually found, or to, if given a reporting mark and number, be able to tell whether the car is small enough to fit on this end of a nearly-full track. If people want to know how I do it, who can say? I just do it, and that should be enough. I doubt that anyone else can, or ever will, be able to do it the way I do. But that bad-cut-number theory, though it wasn't really the problem this time, happens often enough that people should know about it (the brighter ones do).

I didn't need the computer this time because I had both of the hump sheets involved (the General Yardmaster usually sends them to our printers when he's getting ready to shove them to us--there have been times that I've told him to please send us the right sheet...and sometimes, with the help of the computer, I know which one it should be). I've also been able to use the computer to figure out entire cuts of cars that don't even show in the yard inventory because somebody somewhere wasn't doing his job. Others can do that, but I do it quicker.

It sounds involved, and it usually is--but the thought processes are nearly instantaneous: if I see this, I do this, and if this doesn't work, I do that. One has to think fast, because this is a dynamic operation--I still have to retard and classify the cars coming at me. And in the case of the totally strange cars, I have to be able to come up with accurate weights as well as destinations. Today wasn't flawless--I misplaced one of the cars because I was trying to keep the lower towers up to date on what was coming, based on the fact that I could see that they weren't lined up (yes, I check that when I can, too--which makes my in-wrong all the more embarrassing!).

There was a little bit of luck in the equation today, too. In both cases, after I'd looked over the hump shoves and made notes of my theories, another shove came up the other lead and completely blocked my view of the cars!

Oh, and now that both of my arms are broken (I didn't mean to pat myself on the back so hard, but you asked...), I'll mention that the railroad that sent us that goofed-up train is a major eastern railroad which must have used thoroughbreds to enter the data.

And as for cards, I have to be able to see something recognizable to make it work!

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Thursday, June 10, 2010 9:37 PM
Carl, thanks much for that detailed, thorough, well-organized, and comprehensible explanation. I had no idea your tale was that involved and complicated - I know how long it takes me to write up something like that, and I didn't intend to put you to so much effort and trouble.

That said, I'm nevertheless glad that I did, because anyone reading this thread now has a Jim-dandy glimpse into "A day in the life of a CRO", and we're all indebted to you for that. And maybe someday your grandkids will read it too and see how sharp you are. It really is having a 'sixth sense' and the ability to think quickly on your feet - and lots of experience. As the saying goes, 'You do something for 10,000 hours, you should get pretty good at it" - and I know you've got a lot more time than that in the CRO position. Plus, you're interested in and really care about the work - I knew your intimate knowledge of the cars figured in the puzzle someplace - and that shows, too, and well as making it more fun. Now you've got the makings of a pretty good "Railroad Reading" story for the print edition of Trains, I think. Let's see if we can get Kathi Kube interested in publishing it, eh ?

Thanks again. I hope the rest of your 'days' this week will be as satisfying.

- Paul North.

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by blue streak 1 on Friday, June 11, 2010 9:02 AM

CShaveRR
Oh, and now that both of my arms are broken (I didn't mean to pat myself on the back so hard, but you asked...), I'll mention that the railroad that sent us that goofed-up train is a major eastern railroad which must have used thoroughbreds to enter the data.

Gosh Carl; That is really a chess game. A question. Has any thought or maybe a trial of installing AEI sensors on the hump lead for checking the hump sheets been tried? I can see problems with that but an alert to the operator sooner might aleivate to some degree any problems.

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Friday, June 11, 2010 10:31 AM

I suppose a giant ''STOP'' or ''HOLD'' button might be useful in some of those situations, at least until things get sorted out . . . Whistling

As 'Kenny' the operator in the Muscatine, Iowa tower said in a 1980's article in Trains in response to a dispatcher's inquiries and complaints about how long certain switching and routing moves would take - "These ain't tiddlywinks we're playing with here, you know.''  See -

R.I.P., DY
Trains, April 1986 page 26
Culver Tower, Muscatine, Iowa
( "BRUNNER, EDWARD J.", REMINISCENCE, RI, TOWER, TRN )

And, even though I below to and sometimes epitomize a technocrat culture that likes to think and believe that almost everything can be systematized, organized, regimented, folded, spindled, and mutilated until it runs seamlessly like a well-oiled machine and that it can then be run automatically by a computer - yes, even John G. Kneiling, whom I usually admire - this demonstrates that random events, mishaps, and screw-ups can make it futile to get too carried away with that, and that's there almost always going to be a need to have smart people on the scene to recognize and recover the operation when things go wrong . . . go wrong . . . go wrong . . . Smile,Wink, & Grin . . . such as at Three Mile Island, Apollo 13, etc.  I don't suppose they teach that kind of thing in the various training schools for railroaders, whether run by the Class I's or the private or community college ones . . . Confused  All that being said, nevertheless blue streak 1's suggestion above seems sensible to me - and / or having a yard clerk doing a 'walk-through' track check from time

Much later last night It occurred to me that what you're doing is very ad hoc - like a lawyer doing a preliminary or zoning hearing without the benefit of any of the 'discovery' procedures (I wonder what the answer to this question will be - and then what do I do, which position do I take, what question do I ask next ?), or maybe more aptly, like a musician 'sight-reading' aand playing a piece of music as she's seeing it for the first time.  In fact, what I concluded is that you, Carl, are improvising as you go along, in response to what the other players are sending your way - in other words, what you're doing is like playing jazz with railroad cars !  Cool  Feel free to share that one with your music-major daughter Smile,Wink, & Grin

I hope you take a look at the time-lapse video of the European hump yard - SBB's Limmattal humpyard in Spreitenbach, Switzerland, serving the Zurich area - which beaulieu just posted over on this thread here - Timelapse video of a Humpyard in operation - at - http://cs.trains.com/trccs/forums/t/175295.aspx 

See any familiarities, and differences ?

Thanks again, Carl.

- Paul North. 

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Friday, June 11, 2010 10:37 AM

AgentKid
  [snip] Everything Thursday at Irricana my Dad would have to walk the length of the back track and siding and record the numbers and types of cars present. He would then read this list over the dispatchers phone to someone in the Alyth Yard Office, who would copy this down by hand. "Irricana, xx High Forties, xx Low Forties, and xx Fifties", and then the cars' numbers. . . .

Good recollections, story, and example, Bruce - thanks   Thumbs Up

One small question - what is the significance of / what do the ''Forties'' and ''Fifties'' mean in the list that you quote above ?  Are those the car lengths in feet, or some other attribute, such as capacity in hundreds of cubic feet, etc. ?  Thanls in advance.

- Paul North.  

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by CShaveRR on Friday, June 11, 2010 4:26 PM
AEI sacnners: I'm not sure what the story is on those. Our yard is supposedly surrounded by these, so that trains going in or out (or around) the place go past one. I would think that those would be the most effective way possible of assuring an accurate consist. But for some reason, the railroad doesn't see it that way. We have trains that can go clear across the country with the notation "Consist Not Validated by AEI". Yet is the printed consist altered? Nope.

Keep in mind that yesterday's example was one of the more extreme cases, and I was actually surprised to see a train like that coming from NS (it's usually CN that does that to us). CSX usually sends us trains in their proper order, but with cars that don't belong to us at all. On our sheets, they come up with a destination of "NOTUPCA" (Not a UP Car). I usually picture some podunk town like Notupca, Kentucky, that has to be absolutely full of cars that CSX has no idea what to do with.

If we pushed a panic button to stop the operation, we wouldn't get anything done! The cars have to get up to the crest to be checked by anyone competent. And...uhhh...what's a "clerk"? I haven't seen one of those in years!

Today, things went smoothly, for the most part--the problems cropped up elsewhere, such as chocks by the pin-lifters to keep cars together that we needed to separate. We did have one improper case of cut-number reporting that resulted in a car missing from one of our shoves (it was in the middle of a shove, which I recognized as pieces of two trains shoved up together). Since it was the last train we were humping, I chose to say nothing about my thoughts. But we had a sheet on the other piece of the train in question, so I just wrote the reporting mark and number at the bottom of that sheet, where I expect the car to magically appear in the order. We'll let somebody else wonder how I did that!

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

  • Member since
    June 2001
  • From: Lombard (west of Chicago), Illinois
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Posted by CShaveRR on Friday, June 11, 2010 4:28 PM
Paul, I watched the humping video, and posted comments over on that thread. I was later able to see the whole thing. We don't have anything like those "mules" in our yard--making room on the tracks is done by a locomotive.

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

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