TRAIN HIT BY LIGHTNING

[upchuck]

[?]What can happen when railcars are struck by lightning, particularly those containing volatiles?

[coborn35]

"Hey Bill, what the h*** do think that was??"
Or BOOOOM!
Or nothing. I dont think that is a common problem though!

[cnw4001]

Perhaps someone with more experience can offer a better answer. I would think they'd simply ground out but that's a guess.

[zardoz]

If the current gets to the locomotive, all sorts of interesting (mostly bad for the electronics) things can happen. A direct hit to the locomotive would likely fry the unit, and would not do much good for the crew if they happened to be touching metal and complete a circuit (just like in your car). A lightning hit to the rails would send current for a distance until the charge had been bled off by various grounding objects, and would likely short the signals (I've seen that happen). I do not know what a strike to the train cars would do; probably send some current to the cars coupled to it, and some charge to the rail.

BTW, other than a specially-built safe-room, or a deep basement covered by reinforced decking, a stationary locomotive (especially down in the nose by the toilet, to avoid flying objects) is one of the safest places to be in a tornado.

[stmtrolleyguy]

Thats just about the first (and only) good thing I've hear about anything remotely having to do with locomotive toilets.

[Anonymous]

so if the tornado scares the*** out of you you'll be right there...

[zardoz]

QUOTE: Originally posted by stmtrolleyguy

Thats just about the first (and only) good thing I've hear about anything remotely having to do with locomotive toilets.

I know, it's a crappy subject.....

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

QUOTE: Originally posted by stmtrolleyguy

Thats just about the first (and only) good thing I've hear about anything remotely having to do with locomotive toilets.

I know, it's a crappy subject.....

Wow, Z, aren't you in rare form tonight...


Don't most volatiles' fumes do the burning? It seems if the car is full and there aren't any leaking fumes there shouldn't be any problem. If it really was a problem, we would have heard about it more often. I'm sure they get hit a lot, 'specially when they have storms out on the great plains.


mike

[GP40-2]

QUOTE: Originally posted by zardoz

If the current gets to the locomotive, all sorts of interesting (mostly bad for the electronics) things can happen. A direct hit to the locomotive would likely fry the unit, and would not do much good for the crew if they happened to be touching metal and complete a circuit (just like in your car). A lightning hit to the rails would send current for a distance until the charge had been bled off by various grounding objects, and would likely short the signals (I've seen that happen). I do not know what a strike to the train cars would do; probably send some current to the cars coupled to it, and some charge to the rail.

BTW, other than a specially-built safe-room, or a deep basement covered by reinforced decking, a stationary locomotive (especially down in the nose by the toilet, to avoid flying objects) is one of the safest places to be in a tornado.

Fry the locomotive????[(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D]Having been there, done that, I can assure you that won't happen.

[coborn35]

Maybe a few scorch marks, but otherwise nothing would happen I wouldnt think.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by upchuck

[?]What can happen when railcars are struck by lightning, particularly those containing volatiles?

The lightning current striking the railcar would instantly be directed along the exterior skin and steel skeletal structure down along the 8 wheels (for a standard railcar). The steel wheels make contact with the rail and the rail makes contact with electrical ground somewhere along the way. This is unlike an automobile where the rubber tires insulate, separating the vehicle's body from ground. The volatile contents inside a railcar should be fine.

Lightning is not something brand new. Neither is lightning protection on the rails.

[zardoz]

QUOTE: Originally posted by GP40-2
Fry the locomotive????[(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D]Having been there, done that, I can assure you that won't happen.

Then we have had similar events happen with dissimilar results.

An average bolt of negative lightning carries a current of 30 kiloamperes, transfers a charge of 5 coulombs, has a potential difference of about 100 megavolts and dissipates 500 megajoules. An average bolt of positive lightning carries a current of 300 kiloamperes, transfers a charge of up to 300 coulombs, has a potential difference up to 1 gigavolt (a thousand million volts), dissipates enough energy to light a 100 watt lightbulb for up to 95 years, and lasts for tens or hundreds of milliseconds. A bolt of lightning can reach temperatures approaching 28,000 kelvins (50,000 degrees Fahrenheit, 5 times hotter than the surface of the sun) in a split second.

I can assure you that there is sufficient power in a lightning strike to "fry" the electronics in any device, including a locomotive.

[tatans]

Just in passing , has a train EVER been struck by lightning?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Jim_White

QUOTE: Originally posted by upchuck

[?]What can happen when railcars are struck by lightning, particularly those containing volatiles?

The lightning current striking the railcar would instantly be directed along the exterior skin and steel skeletal structure down along the 8 wheels (for a standard railcar). The steel wheels make contact with the rail and the rail makes contact with electrical ground somewhere along the way. This is unlike an automobile where the rubber tires insulate, separating the vehicle's body from ground. The volatile contents inside a railcar should be fine.

Lightning is not something brand new. Neither is lightning protection on the rails.

this is correct, as long as the rails are properly grounded, a lightening strike against a train would just pass harmlessly through it. trains have been struck, planes have been struck, houses have been struck, and as long as all have been grounded right, nothing happens.

[zardoz]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tatans

Just in passing , has a train EVER been struck by lightning?

I have not had my locomotive directly struck, but I did see lightning hit a lineside signal box about 50 yards in front of my train. The signals immediately went dark, the ground relay on both of my units tripped, and after a few seconds both locomotives stopped running, electrically dead.. Fortunately, the locos were of the pre-dash2 models, so I was able to get them restarted, and with a little jury-rigging, get them funtional again.

[Randy Stahl]

Having worked on locomotives most of my life I have experience with lightning strikes on locomotives. It is true that lightning may not "fry" a locomotive, however rest assured there is a great deal of damage done. Problems with engines after a lightning strike may hide for several weeks, the most obvious things like the radio, EOT , cab electronics often fare badly . Semi conductors are permenently damaged and may not be noticed immediatly. Perhaps two or three weeks from the lightning strike you start seeing blown diode fuses indicating shorted rectifiers. Other semi conductors are as succeptable to damage as well , for example the diodes in the SA panel that control directional sanders. Locomotives indeed to some baffling things after a lightning strike!
Do not make the assumtion that railroad tracks are in any way "properly grounded" this is simply not true. If possible stay clear of railroad tracks when a thunderstorm is in the area. A lightning bolt will travel many miles until it finds a suitable ground, that ground could be your ankle if you are standing on the tracks.
I have seen lightning strike a switch broom sticking next to a switch stand , forsaking the nice metal switch stand.
Randy

[eolafan]

QUOTE: Originally posted by upchuck

[?]What can happen when railcars are struck by lightning, particularly those containing volatiles?

[oops] The crew would make a quick trip to the closest laundramat to wa***heir underwear!

[zardoz]

QUOTE: Originally posted by SteamerFan
The steel wheels make contact with the rail and the rail makes contact with electrical ground somewhere along the way. This is unlike an automobile where the rubber tires insulate, separating the vehicle's body from ground. The volatile contents inside a railcar should be fine.
Lightning is not something brand new. Neither is lightning protection on the rails.

this is correct, as long as the rails are properly grounded, a lightening strike against a train would just pass harmlessly through it. trains have been struck, planes have been struck, houses have been struck, and as long as all have been grounded right, nothing happens.

[Anonymous]

In my mind, one of the greatest problems would be from the heat of 30 kA going through the locomotive's frame--pretty hot!

[Anonymous]

Most airplanes have lighting attracking rods on the top and bottom of the plane that direct the lightening through them, such as not to disrupt the internals of the plane.

[morseman]

i was on the sw chief Chicago to LA several years ago
Middle of the night I was wakened by a loud bang.
In the morning, the conductor asked if my scanner was okay
as the car was either hit or nearly hit by lightning
and it blew alll the circuit breakers on the car.
Luckily I had removed the AC cord on the scanner
before retiring.