fuel oil and grease

[Anonymous]

this if for all you locomotive mechanics, or anyone who hangs with such people

questions about locomotive fluids of all sorts.

1. What exactly is the fuel used for diesel locomotives? Is it the same diesel fuel you would use for cars and trucks?

2. what kind of motor oil is used in such large diesel engines? Is it the same kind of oil used in cars?

3. what kind of grease is mostly used for greasing wheels, axles etc?

[CSXrules4eva]

Diesel engines this goes for all diesel engines will not and do not use the same oil as what you would put in a gasoline car. The oil in diesels is thicker and heavier than what you would put in a car. The thicker oil will seal the rings better and protect the bearings more efficently.

The diesel fuel used in a locomotive prime mover is just about the same as what you would find at the service pumps at your local gas station. There are different grades used for specific conditions. The one that is used the most is grade # 2 diesel, which has a medium viscosity (thickness), this provides proper opperating traits for the widest range of conditions. Sometimes railroads will use grade #1 diesel which is thiner than grade #2 and therefore is recommened as a winter fuel to prevent the paraffin (wax) in diesel fuel from separating and causing it to cloud up, thus cloging the fuel filters and preventing engine operatation.

I'm sorry about the last one I'm not all that up on grease technology too much. All I can tell you here is that grease is mainly based off of the thickener it has. Many of those thickeners are alkali metals of Calcium, Lithium, Sodium, and Aluminum.

[Anonymous]

thanks, that has been very helpfull

You say the oil is heavier than that for cars? Does that include diesel cars too? ( lots of european cars have diesel engines, even the smallest city cars)

Now, what can you tell me about engine maintenance procedures with diesel locomotives?
How often is the oil changed? How often are axles re-greased? etc.
What else needs to be done periodically on a diesel locomotive?

[CSXrules4eva]

Here are the typical diesel prime mover maintence prceedures
Replacing the fuel filters, oil filters or cleaning, draining oil, replacing air filter elements, inspecting engine and related systems, adjusting (if needed) valve and injector timing, um...... and servicing emission control systems.

I'm not too sure what the actuall maintence intervals are they vary (spelling) in terms of what type of prime mover is equiped in the locomotive.

Um... lets see here. You are correct anything that has a diesel engine is going to requirer heavier duty oil than a typical gas engine.

It almost seems as if you need to send me an e-mail lol.

[Anonymous]

thanks,

There is one more thing. In a pentrex video I've seen something like this: a guy going around from wheel to wheel on an electric locomotive and puting some lubricant. The pentrex narator mentioned it, but it didn't really explained it.

What was that guy doing and is this done today too?

p.s. What did you mean about an e-mail? You think we should continue this by e-mail?
I think this might be helpfull for others when they search archives, don't you think?

[chad thomas]

QUOTE: Originally posted by electro-ortcele



p.s. What did you mean about an e-mail? You think we should continue this by e-mail?
I think this might be helpfull for others when they search archives, don't you think?

[}:)]yea Sarah, Ve vill not stand for zecrets here.[;)]

[Anonymous]

You mean that figure in the picture is a woman? I always did think the man on the picture looks kind of funny (I guess that's a compliment) :-)

[Anonymous]

I can't say for sure about locomotives, but we use the same engines in large tugs. Typically EMD 16-567's or 16-645's. The lube oil we use is Rotella T-40 or equivalent, or Mobil Guard 40, or equivelant. The Rotella and equivlent are petroleuom based oils with special additives for heavy diesel engine use. The Mobil Guard and equivalent oils are synthetic. The synthetic oils are "much" more expensive, but the engines run much cleaner and longer with them. Our oil change intervals run anywhere from 500 to 1500 hours of operation, depending on the type of oil and filteration systems that are installed.
The diesel fuel is the basically the same as you get at the filling station. It has been dyed to signify that no road taxes have been paid on it. You get caught with it in your vehicle and you can get a big fine for tax evasion.

[edbenton]

In the axle bearings it is probaly extremly high pressure grease ont he roller bearings. The one I hauled a load of looked to have some form of axle grease. For the gears off of the traction motors standard heavy duty gear oil.

[chad thomas]

Pssst....Hey electro, Check out Sarah's (csxrules4eva) picture in her profile.[:P]

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the tip, I rarely look at profiles.
Yea, she looks like a woman on that picture, and a real pretty one too.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by capt_turk

I can't say for sure about locomotives, but we use the same engines in large tugs. Typically EMD 16-567's or 16-645's. The lube oil we use is Rotella T-40 or equivalent, or Mobil Guard 40, or equivelant. The Rotella and equivlent are petroleuom based oils with special additives for heavy diesel engine use. The Mobil Guard and equivalent oils are synthetic. The synthetic oils are "much" more expensive, but the engines run much cleaner and longer with them. Our oil change intervals run anywhere from 500 to 1500 hours of operation, depending on the type of oil and filteration systems that are installed.
The diesel fuel is the basically the same as you get at the filling station. It has been dyed to signify that no road taxes have been paid on it. You get caught with it in your vehicle and you can get a big fine for tax evasion.

You mean it's dyed blue like for tractors (well at least it's blue over here)?

[CSXrules4eva]

QUOTE: Originally posted by chad thomas

Pssst....Hey electro, Check out Sarah's (csxrules4eva) picture in her profile.[:P]

<big time blushes> [:I] hehehehe

[chad thomas]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CSXrules4eva

QUOTE: Originally posted by chad thomas

Pssst....Hey electro, Check out Sarah's (csxrules4eva) picture in her profile.[:P]

<big time blushes> [:I] hehehehe

[;)][:D]

[rvos1979]

I think everyone's right on the diesel fuel, one extra point is that high sulfur diesel fuel is also dyed so that the two aren't mixed. Low sulfur diesel in an engine designed for high sulfur fuel usually means seized up injectors or injection pump. The color dye here is red for both, I believe.

Lube oil, I believe, is usually like a 15W-40 viscosity, I believe EMD requires synthetic lube in their engines as a condition on their warranty.

Axle bearings get gear oil, I think it's 80W90 gear oil, at least on the serviceable ones. Sealed bearings get some sort of grease, possibly like Mobil 007 lube.

Traction motor gearcases get what's called crater, at least that's what it was called when I worked for the WSOR. It comes in packets, you just toss the entire packet in, plastic bag and all, and let the gears break open the bag and spread it around. It is also difficult to get out of clothing (ask me how I know!!)

Randy

[trainboyH16-44]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CSXrules4eva

QUOTE: Originally posted by chad thomas

Pssst....Hey electro, Check out Sarah's (csxrules4eva) picture in her profile.[:P]

<big time blushes> [:I] hehehehe

Heyyyyy.....Uh, I mean, LET'S KEEP OUR EYES ON THE TRAINS!!!

On a somewhat related topic, what do flange greasers look like?
Trainboy

[Anonymous]

On a somewhat related topic, what in the world is a flange greaser?

[trainboyH16-44]

It's something that greases either the wheel flanges, or the rail, I don't know which.
It's used to lesen the resistance of sharp curves.

[chad thomas]

Here is a flange oiler:

[Tulyar15]

QUOTE: Originally posted by electro-ortcele

thanks, that has been very helpfull

You say the oil is heavier than that for cars? Does that include diesel cars too? ( lots of european cars have diesel engines, even the smallest city cars)

Now, what can you tell me about engine maintenance procedures with diesel locomotives?
How often is the oil changed? How often are axles re-greased? etc.
What else needs to be done periodically on a diesel locomotive?

Having owned a couple of diesel cars, I can tell you that the oil changes have to be done more frequently than on a gasoline engine. My first diesel car was a Rover Maestro which needed and oil change every 5000 miles; on the gasoline version the frequency was 6000 miles. Then I had a Seat Ibiza diesel; the relevant figures were 10,000 miles and 12,000 miles respectively.

[Anonymous]

I don't know about the RR's, but I DO know that we almost NEVER replace th oil in our power plant. We have several dual fuel diesels and we have etensive oil filtration equipment, plus we have our oil tested regularly. When the numbers are off we "freshen" the oil by adding a pack of additives such as detergents and stuff.

Our oil is basically plain old SAE30. Cost is about #2 a quart. The last time we changed oil on a unit the oil was +20 years old.

The largest enging is a 10,000 HP Enterprise. Impresses the snot out of visitors when it's running.

Mark in Utah

[oltmannd]

Fuel oil: #2 diesel, 37 cetane minimum, cloud point and pour point in winter are usually specified by the individual RR and supplier ususally meets specs by blending with #1 fuel oil.

10 years ago the lube oil was usually straight 40 weight with additive package designed specifically for RR diesels. The RRs were starting to tinker with multi-wt oils at that time. I don't know if they've becomse std or not. Additive package is very high in detergents and buffering agents to keep the pH in range. The GE FDL is harder on oil than the EMD 645/710. It's harder on the pH, dirt load and sheer.

There aren't a lot of grease fittings on locomotives. In fact, I can't think of one off the top of my head. I think most bearings are "greased for life". The toughest grease application is the traction motor gearset. Most new locomotives now use oil, but older ones would take a lithium based grease with an EP additive (usually molybdenum)

-Don

[broncoman]

Are railroads able to get diesel that still has higher levels of sulpher in it than does the #2 for roaded vehicles, or doe the injector systems on the bigger units not need the sulpher as much?
I had heard that the diesel in UPs Roseville CA yard and a couple of yards in L.A. use the low sulpher stuff.

Dave

[trainboyH16-44]

Thanks chad, but how does it get to the wheel?
trainboy

[chad thomas]

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainboyH16-44

Thanks chad, but how does it get to the wheel?
trainboy

I think there is a pump that the up and down motion of the rail (from the weight of passing axles/trucks) pumps oil onto the inside of the rail as a train passes over it.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd

Fuel oil: #2 diesel, 37 cetane minimum, cloud point and pour point in winter are usually specified by the individual RR and supplier ususally meets specs by blending with #1 fuel oil.

10 years ago the lube oil was usually straight 40 weight with additive package designed specifically for RR diesels. The RRs were starting to tinker with multi-wt oils at that time. I don't know if they've becomse std or not. Additive package is very high in detergents and buffering agents to keep the pH in range. The GE FDL is harder on oil than the EMD 645/710. It's harder on the pH, dirt load and sheer.

There aren't a lot of grease fittings on locomotives. In fact, I can't think of one off the top of my head. I think most bearings are "greased for life". The toughest grease application is the traction motor gearset. Most new locomotives now use oil, but older ones would take a lithium based grease with an EP additive (usually molybdenum)

-Don

you say GE is harder on oil than EMD, what do you mean by that? What does "harder on oil" mean?