Strange derailments?

[Boyd]

What are the strangest derailments you have seen or heard about? I think it was on this site many years ago I saw the picture of the steam locomotive on top of another one like it was driven there.

[BaltACD]

Inertia is a funny master....it follows the paths for least resistance which present surprising results.

[Anonymous]

From the Railroad Gazette:

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January 1892

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15^th, on Atchison, Topeka & Santa Fe, near Brenham, Tex., a passenger train of 6 cars was derailed, and although there were a large number of passengers aboard, only 7 of them were injured.  It appears that the rails had been loosened for a considerable distance by the cutting out of the spikes by a derailed freight car in a train which had passed a short time before.  This derailed car, after running about 2 miles, was rerailed at a road crossing, so that the injury done by it to the track was not promptly discovered.

[The Butler]

Bucyrus

From the Railroad Gazette:

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January 1892

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15^th, on Atchison, Topeka & Santa Fe, near Brenham, Tex., a passenger train of 6 cars was derailed, and although there were a large number of passengers aboard, only 7 of them were injured.  It appears that the rails had been loosened for a considerable distance by the cutting out of the spikes by a derailed freight car in a train which had passed a short time before.  This derailed car, after running about 2 miles, was rerailed at a road crossing, so that the injury done by it to the track was not promptly discovered.

So that is where Tyco got its idea for the rerailer/grade crossing HO track section!

[henry6]

What you're referring to Boyd is called telescoping and not uncommon in head on but more so in rear end, collisions. 

As to my experiences: One morning while driving to work from Apalachin, NY to Owego I heard an EL train coming west but something bothered me about it.  When I turned onto the ramp leading to NY17 west off NY434 was facing directly across the Susquehanna River and watched as several rail cars tumbled toward me!  Today that ramp is a full bridge across the river and the now single tracked NS Southern Tier Main.

...Upon leaving Bingahmton's Liberty Street yard, just before crossing the bridge over Route 11, I was aboard a NYSW passenger train headed for the Marathon, NY Maple Festival back in the 80s.  I was in one of the last two cars, the domes, when I realized the rails were too bumpy and the train stopped abruptly. The trucks of the last car apparently picked the switch and all remained upright with no injuries.  Moved the passengers forward to cramped quarters, uncoupled the two cars, and left a little late.

Common story on many roads and in many decades is a late night train through very remote areas.  Train goes into emergency, crew walks the train and finds everything on the rails but there is an unattached hose between two cars.  Couple it up and move on with no apparent problem but upon arrival at the destination it is discovered they are minus one car.  Car is found off to the side of the right of way by a later train or in daylight or by trackmen or whatever.  What happened?  Supposedly the car jumped the tracks out of the train setting the brakes.  Two parts of the train run together with the couplers locking.  Too dark for the crew to have seen to the side...and probably the stopping spot further ahead of the actual supposed derailed car.  An engineer  freind of mine reported it had happened to him in the Grand Canyon of PA, there was a report in one of the magazines about that happening on the Rat Hole Division in KY, and there have been numerous other such reportings.  True or not? 

[rixflix]

On the Reading's Newberry-Reading Catawissa main the crew came up a car short. Apparently a  mid-train covered hopper derailed on a downgrade fill and momentum recoupled the train. Emergency - reconnect the air --proceed - scratch heads at Reading yard office.

From James L. Holton's "The Reading Railroad the Twentieth Century" with a little interpretation as he is unclear as to location and date (between 1968 and 1970?).

Ah, the sad demise of the Catawissa with it's growling FT's, once the pride of the Reading. and NYC's gateway to Philly.

RIX 

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

"Urban legend", I think.  On a slow-moving train, the derailed car won't go that far, and would still be 'in the gage' of the track and tearing it up.  In a fast-moving train, any impact or forces that would throw a car that far out will also derail one or more other cars on either side of it.  It might have happened once or twice with really light cars - such as a flat or a gondola - in the middle of heavily loaded cars, but not that often.

On the other hand, there have been several documented instances of cars - and even locomotives - derailing and then rerailing from a short distance to several miles farther on, such as at either a trailing-point switch, a road crossing, a center-guardrail at a bridge, etc.  A couple years ago there was an article in Trains about an early BNSF Detroit- St. Louis RoadRailer that derailed and re-railed itself a couple times at night while approaching the Mississippi River bridge in southeastern Illinois, as I recall.

- Paul North. 

[tree68]

I recall a story in Trains about a derail/rerail that was discovered only because it had clipped some track control component, causing it to fail.  A dispatcher or CTC operator reported the problem because they weren't getting some indication they should have.

I'm sure the track forces would have found the damage eventually, but if the car hadn't hit that one item, that's exactly how it would have been discovered.

[Kootenay Central]

About thirty five years ago a section foreman and crew were patrolling their section on a Fairmont motor car when they passed the West switch at Mc Gillivray, B.C.

In the clear, derailed, in the siding was a lone four-wheel roller-bearing freight car truck.

He got on the Magneto Phone at the siding, called up the station at the Crow on the Divide, Three Long Rings, and reported same as from an Eastward train.

There was an East in the yard awaiting crew rest and someone went out to check the train.

One empty tank car was missing a truck and was held up at that end by the couplers to the tank car coupled next.

No big pileup with tanks.

A better ending than could have otherwise occurred.

Train passed that switch in the dark and the tail end crew did not notice anything amiss re sparks.

This was entering the horseshoe curve Eastbound at that location and is briefly 2%.

Back in the Sixties, CPR had the track bolts in the joint bars inserted with the nuts all on the outside, a CPR spotting feature, as CNR had them staggered in-out.

One could drive up to a crossing at grade and tell by the bolt pattern whose track it was back in those simpler times.

In early 1969, one of those then-newish 100-ton cylindrical roller bearing covered hoppers harmonic-rolled one set of wheels off the track between Mayook and Tokay on the-then cinder and sand ballast from the days of 2-8-0s.

( In all fairness, this portion of the sub was abandoned in 1970 and maintenance had slid. Some of the rail and the turnouts were still 85 lb. and a message from the Supt. was required with the Train Orders to operate 5 small units, or twenty driving axles. )

Anyway, a wheel flange sliced off many the nuts on one rail for miles, leaving some of the joint bars virtually boltless.

Tore out many of the farm crossing planks in addition.

Soon after, CPR emulated CNR in that regard and staggered the bolt pattern on new work or repairs.

Many CP branch lines will still have the all-on-one-side bolt pattern if not yet torn up.

In the spring, the section used to go along with two men and two power bolters, IF available, loosen off, then retighten track bolts on jointed steel, and use a steam engine oil feeder to oil the joint bars on top inside and out.

They would note and mark any defects they found.

Kept many men busy.

Many years ago.

Thank You.

[trainboyH16-44]

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

tree68

  I recall a story in Trains about a derail/rerail that was discovered only because it had clipped some track control component, causing it to fail.  A dispatcher or CTC operator reported the problem because they weren't getting some indication they should have.

I'm sure the track forces would have found the damage eventually, but if the car hadn't hit that one item, that's exactly how it would have been discovered. 

That was likely the BNSF RoadRailer acccount that I mentioned above - it ran over and damaged a power switch machine so that it would not return a proper  indication when the Dispatcher tried to operate/ throw it to the opposite position. 

- Paul North. 

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

Kootenay Central

  [snip]  Back in the Sixties, CPR had the track bolts in the joint bars inserted with the nuts all on the outside, a CPR spotting feature, as CNR had them staggered in-out.

One could drive up to a crossing at grade and tell by the bolt pattern whose track it was back in those simpler times.

In early 1969, one of those then-newish 100-ton cylindrical roller bearing covered hoppers harmonic-rolled one set of wheels off the track between Mayook and Tokay on the-then cinder and sand ballast from the days of 2-8-0s.

( In all fairness, this portion of the sub was abandoned in 1970 and maintenance had slid. Some of the rail and the turnouts were still 85 lb. and a message from the Supt. was required with the Train Orders to operate 5 small units, or twenty driving axles. )

Anyway, a wheel flange sliced off many the nuts on one rail for miles, leaving some of the joint bars virtually boltless.

Tore out many of the farm crossing planks in addition.

Soon after, CPR emulated CNR in that regard and staggered the bolt pattern on new work or repairs.

Many CP branch lines will still have the all-on-one-side bolt pattern if not yet torn up.

[snip] 

Thank You. 

Which is exactly why the staggered inside-outside bolt pattern was adopted - I'm surprised that CPR held onto the all-on-one-side pattern for so long.  Thanks for that real-life story to corroborate the theory, which otherwise was based on events long ago in the mists of time.

- Paul North.

[caldreamer]

I was in the Santa Clara,California tower watching an H12-44 doing some switching.  One boxcar would not couple no how hard the engineer tried.   Finally the brakeman signaled the engineer to back up.  He came back so hard the the car jumped up and just rolled on its side with a tremendous crash.  The yardmaster came on the radio said he heard a crsah an wanted to know what happended.  When he was told he use language that wouyld make a sailor turn grren.  The operator and I laughed so hard we thought were going to wet our pants.  

The yardmaster had to explain to the trainmaster why he needed the big hook from the Bayshore yard.  The engineer was suspended for 30 days.  Strange to see a car roll over instead of just derailing.

[CShaveRR]

I've seen some lulus, but the strangest derailment I can think of was one that I didn't see.

We were humping a train that included a large block of gondolas for somewhere on the back lead (presumably headed for Sterling).  They were loads, so we were shoving them over (otherwise this whole big block would have had to be cut apart into pairs, per instructions).  I set my retarders to keep the speed under control, and kicked back.  All of a sudden Henry was yelling from Tower B to stop shoving.  I grabbed my retarders to help them stop, but didn't know what was going on.  Henry said that one of the gons was on the ground, but I couldn't see it.  The RCO, who was on the point, walked back, and found nothing on the ground.  However, there were marks on the rails and by the rails that suggested that something had, indeed, derailed and rerailed.  A cut was made, and the suspect area was opened up and inspected before things resumed.  I can't recall whether anything needed to be done, or whether one of my switches had been involved (it worked fine as soon as the cars were clear of it).

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

CShaveRR

  [snip]  All of a sudden Henry was yelling from Tower B to stop shoving.  I grabbed my retarders to help them stop, but didn't know what was going on.  Henry said that one of the gons was on the ground, but I couldn't see it. [snip] 

 

Might the retarder 'beams' have pushed sideways hard enough to re-rail the errant car ?

[CShaveRR]

Paul_D_North_Jr

CShaveRR:

  [snip]  All of a sudden Henry was yelling from Tower B to stop shoving.  I grabbed my retarders to help them stop, but didn't know what was going on.  Henry said that one of the gons was on the ground, but I couldn't see it. [snip] 

 

Might the retarder 'beams' have pushed sideways hard enough to re-rail the errant car ?

No, Paul, this happened well outside of the retarders (below mine, above his).  My lowest switch might have been involved; as I said, I can't remember.  I do know that I had a good switch indication on both the board and ground, unlikely if the switch had been picked.  (I knew I wasn't in trouble, because the presence detector would prevent the switch from throwing under a car even if I had bumped the toggle.)

We did have quite a bit of trouble with the presence detector on that switch for some time after this incident, so it's likely that wheels on the ground might have moved the loop that provided the protection.

[Anonymous]

 

Here is a classic telescope wreck where one train ran into the rear of another:

 

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/wrk_rutland1.jpg

 

Here is one like Boyd described.  This happened on many occasions:

 

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/wrk_823.jpg

 

Another variation:

 

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/wrk_prr443.jpg

 

This is a bit unusual:

 

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_wrk_ce.jpg

 

Here is one that happened at Chaska, MN.  This is only 20 miles from where I live, and I have researched it extensively.  The distant engine was pulling a pile driver and its tender, and shoving its caboose in the lead.  They were running wild hoping to get into the clear at Chaska ahead of an opposing local freight (seen in foreground).  It would not have been too risky except for the fact that a sudden thunderstorm turned off the daylight just when they were almost in the clear.  The caboose was full of about twenty workmen who jumped at the last instant.  One of them did not get off in time.

 

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/wrk_mstl1904.jpg

 

[K. P. Harrier]

A reliable contact forty years ago told me that on the AT&SF a whole train turned over the rail underneath it!  That must have been fun to upright the rail so they could re-rail the train!

[Anonymous]

From the Railroad Gazette:

 

February 1896

 

12^th, 3 a.m., on New York & New England, near Bristol, Conn., an eastbound train broke apart in two places and the three sections continued running for a mile or two when the third section ran into the second, derailing 4 cars; some of the forward cars kept running, however, after going some distance a part of them were derailed by a piece of timber falling on the track; some of the foremost cars still kept on and ran into the forward section of the train, derailing three more.

[zardoz]

Paul_D_North_Jr

"Urban legend", I think.  

- Paul North. 

Indeed.  

However, for those of you that believe those stories (which I think are told to most new-hires just to test their gullibility), I have some prime real estate to sell you at a bargain price--I'll even include a customized astrology chart and some dowsing rods.

[cx500]

Paul_D_North_Jr

"Urban legend", I think.  ......

- Paul North. 

No, the car jumping out of the train did happen.  One occurrence I am aware of was about 1975 on CP's Mactier Sub about 60-70 miles north of Toronto.  A southbound train with a piggyback flat, and I recall the trailer was loaded with sides of beef.  Lots of curves, and still jointed rail at that time.  As the conductor walked up he saw the car down the embankment, and expected it was going to be a long day.  There was minimal damage to the other cars, perhaps bent or broken stirrups and grab irons, so they just coupled the two halves of the train and continued.  It was thought the particular track geometry must have started a unified harmonic motion by the hanging sides of beef, and of course the center of gravity would be rather higher due to the nature of the load.

And with regard to the bolting pattern, I believe it was about 1964 or 1965 that CPR changed to the staggered bolts.  A derailed axle on the Belleville Sub east of Toronto was dragged for many miles breaking bolts before one of the joints opened up and caused a derailment further back in the train.  I saw some correspondence resulting from that derailment discussing the benefits of going to staggered bolts.  The change required a minor modification to the flanger blades of the wedge snowplows to clear the nuts and threaded end inside gauge.  There was no program to change existing joint bars, but new installation used the staggered pattern.

John

 

[Anonymous]

I would not jump to any conclusions about things being urban legends.  Here is an instance of a hopper car jumping out of a train.  I wondered if the couplers of the cars on each side of the gap actually re-coupled or if it was just on a down grade, and the cars closed the gap by gravity, but did not re-couple.  This was in the link and pin coupler era, so re-coupling under such a circumstance seems far more implausible than merely losing a car.  But the description does say that had the trainmen not discovered the derailed car, they would have left it behind.  If so, they would have had to have been coupled up. 

 

From the Railroad Gazatte:

 

March 1884

On the night of the 20^th, near Stairway, N.Y., on the New York, Lake Erie & Western road, a loaded coal dump in the center of a freight train jumped the rails, clearing the rest of the train, and mounting the west bound track, dumped itself on the outside of it in the ditch.  The train ran together again without a jar and the accident was only discovered by the steps of the caboose scraping against the derailed dump as it passed by.  Had a west bound train been passing at the time a serious wreck would probably have resulted.  Had not the men in the caboose discovered the dump on the westward bound track as they passed by, it would have been left there by the train, as no one knew that it had left the track. 

[Great Bear 72000]

     I have seen the photo of the engine on top of the other engine in a book about train wrecks.  The bottom engine is suppose to have been pushing a snow plow and when the collision happened the top engine simply ran up the slope of the plow!

                                                                                               David

[nbrodar]

I had an OTTX Front Runner disintegrate on me.    Too much trailing tonnage, the running gear shoot out from under it.  We found the car hanging between the shelf couplers of two tank cars.

Nick