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[quote user="IRONROOSTER"][quote user="futuremodal"][quote user="IRONROOSTER"] <p>I understand and have sympathy for your point of view. But unfortunately for some problems, by the time it's obvious and convincing it is too late or excessively expensive to correct. The evidence of Global warming is pretty overwhelming.</p><p>[/quote]</p><p>What is your evidence of <em>anthropogenic</em> global warming? </p><p>[/quote]</p><p>Evidence of Global warming:</p><p>[url]http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/12/1206_041206_global_warming.html[/url] </p><p>[url]http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/16/science/earth/16gree.html?ex=1326603600&en=b018c85a1b03d90f&ei=5090[/url]</p><p>[url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4857832.stm[/url]</p><p>Not exactly extremist outfits either. Anthropogenic is your word not mine</p><p>[/quote]</p><p>"Anthropogenic" is <em>my</em> word?!</p><p>"Anthropogenic" literally means "man-caused", which of course is what you are espousing with your anthropogenic solutions to a *problem* that is only a *problem* due to the supposed anthropogenic causal factors. If this whole climate change debate wasn't predicated on an anthropogenic cause, the current observed climate change would not be hyperbolized as a *problem*.</p><p>As for whether the New York Times and those others are extremist or not, you can use this simple test: Do these outfits <em>include</em> all comprehensive and critical variables in deriving their conclusions, or do they purposefully <em>omit</em> crucial variables in deriving their conclusions? </p><p>I'll ask you this - Can we agree that for the sake of this discussion, those who omit such variables should fall into the extremist category, while those who are inclusive of comprehensive variables are the mainstream advocates?</p><p>Assuming you agree.......</p><p>[quote] </p><p>[quote][quote]</p><p>What the effects are and what we can to do to successfully affect it are not clear. But waiting is also a choice with consequences not well understood. I favor trying to reduce or prevent our impact on climate change. I think the risk on this is too great to do otherwise - I just hope we're not late.</p><p>[/quote]</p><p>CO2 from smokestacks and tailpipes as a percentage of the entire greenhouse effect potential: < 1/10 of 1 %.</p><p>What does <em>that</em> tell you?</p><br /><p>Significant surface warming has now been observed on the other planets and moons in our solar system.</p><p>What does <em>that</em> tell you?</p><p>[/quote]</p><p>Back to you for your evidence and relevance.</p><p>[/quote]</p><p>CO2 as a percentage of all greenhouse gases and the total greenhouse effect:</p><p><a href="http://mysite.verizon.net/mhieb/WVFossils/greenhouse_data.html">http://mysite.verizon.net/mhieb/WVFossils/greenhouse_data.html</a></p><p>Observed warming of other planetary bodies in our solar system:</p><p><a href="http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html">http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html</a></p><p><a href="http://motls.blogspot.com/2006/05/global-warming-on-jupiter.html">http://motls.blogspot.com/2006/05/global-warming-on-jupiter.html</a></p><p><a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1720024.ece">http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1720024.ece</a></p><p>Now, if you can discern which side is omitting information that is relevent to the discussion, perhaps you will finally realize that you are on the wrong side, unless of course if comprehensive factualization means nothing to you......</p><p>[quote]</p><p>[quote] </p><p>Please, for the sake of the survival of our representative democracy and our Western way of life......will you people in the global warming cult who ostensibly love the country at least <em><strong><u>try</u></strong></em> and put two and two together?</p><p><span class="smiley">[banghead]</span></p><p>[/quote]</p><p>We're talking survival of the world here, democracy and the Western world included. Can <em><strong>you </strong></em>at least <em><strong>try</strong></em><strong> </strong> to understand the magnitude of the problem.<span class="smiley">[banghead]</span></p><p>[/quote]</p><p>I do understand what the problem is, you do not. The problem is one of a quasi-religious faction that has hijacked legitimate science for the sake of a political end game. It is <em>not</em> one of a *man-made* disaster waiting to kill us all.</p><p>2 + 2 =_______________<span class="smiley">[?]</span></p>
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