yard access for railfans

[Anonymous]

Hi, all,

 

I work in Harrisburg, PA and I drive by an entrance road to Norfolk Southern's Harrisburg Yard every day.   Might be a naive question, but I probably wouldn't be allowed to drive down to the yard and park the car to watch the activity, huh?  There's never anyone around, it's an auxiliary entrance it looks like.  No warning signs saying you can't drive in.  I'm not sure how the railroads are with railfans being around while business is going on.  

 

Thanks,

Mike Brubaker 

[zugmann]

A railroad yard is private property. If you have no business there - STAY OUT. And no, railfanning does not count as business. If you do go there, the nice man with a gun and badge will be more than happy to greet you.

[Erie Lackawanna]

You want to watch trains from public property.  Although I haven't been to Harrisburg in 30 years, my memory was that you could see action from public areas in both H'burg and Enola.  Might not be true anymore.

 

[TimChgo9]

Going into the yard is probably the fastest way to big trouble. Most railroads are pretty touchy about having railfans inside the yard proper.  Like Zugmann said, it's private property, and if you don't belong there, you should stay out. It's tempting because it's an "auxilliary entrance", with no warnings, but, it is safe to assume that the "No trespassing" is implied, since it is probably posted at many other places around the yard.  Find a nice, safe, public place to do your railfanning from......you'll be better off.  Having to take time off of work for a court appearance because you got cited for a trespassing violation would be a pain in the ***.

 

 

[SFbrkmn]

This always troubles me when I read something like this.First, going onto rr property is blunt tresspassing and nothing less than than, plus it creates a high safety risk. There are so many different locations one can watch activity on the trks from public property, either public streets where you can safely pull off the side of the road, parking lots, parks, etc. Here in the middle of town, we have a large flour mill that the BNSF 202  mill job switches about supper time M-F. This job brings out camera bugs because of the older 3800 slugs and a caboose are normally  used  which creates attention. There is an excellent location from a public street where folks will park, be in a safe location to shoot  their pics and not cause any concerns at all. This is using good common sense.

[Lord Atmo]

you really shouldnt go into the yard via the entrace. are there any spots around the yard where you can stand and see everything from? i mean yards are big. a lot of spots around them are public property from which you could see something going on from.

Altoona, for example, is bordered by a rather suburban setting. there's a storage rental facility at the east end of the yard with a large parking lot open to the public. and the spot where all the yard switching is done is right next to that parking lot. although Altoona isn't that big of a yard and they arent so touchy about a railfan wandering around there.

how big is the harrisburg yard? the bigger the yard, the tighter the security and therefore, fewer spots that are considered "public fanning zones"

[Anonymous]

I knew it was probably a no-go, not trying to get arrested.  It seems to me that railroaders would be excited that someone wanted to come watch them do their job, however, I get the impression that most of them are annoyed by railfans.  But, I'm new to the whole railfan hobby, can't you tell?  I guess I had this Mayberry vision of them saying, "Sure, son, we don't mind you sitting there watching the trains go by."  :)

[Erie Lackawanna]

It's really not a matter of rails liking railfans at all.  Like any industry that has people who also watch it, some of the rails will be annoyed and others will enjoy it.

The issue at hand is 100% pure safety - both your safety and the safety of the folks working on the railorad.

There are so many great places to watch trains in your area, it's not that big a loss that you can't get into the yard.

[zugmann]

I knew it was probably a no-go, not trying to get arrested.  It seems to me that railroaders would be excited that someone wanted to come watch them do their job, however, I get the impression that most of them are annoyed by railfans.  But, I'm new to the whole railfan hobby, can't you tell?  I guess I had this Mayberry vision of them saying, "Sure, son, we don't mind you sitting there watching the trains go by."  :)

 

Sorry, but most of us do not get excited.  It is more a of a novelty.  Besides, we know you just like us for our engines.  But, a yard is a dangerous place - esp. an intermodal yard like Harriburg.   You have trains, shove moves, big cranes, and all the truck jockeys.  

RRers have enough to worry about regarding routes, switches, other movements, radio traffic, other employees, managers, and truck drivers, WITHOUT having to worry about some railfan playing "human banner". I work for the RR, and I don't even like being in the yards!

[trainboyH16-44]

For myself, I take the situation into account no matter where I am, with a bit more caution away from home. I frequently trespass on the yard property at my largest local yard BUT...it is very common for railfans to do so, and it is safer than staying beside the road. (Might get hit in the head by a small stone whipped up by a passing pickup )

Anyways, this is what I do.

Don't cross fences.

Stay away from the tracks.

Stay out of congested areas.

Make sure that the 'no trespassing' signs are small an infrequent

Stay away from what look like they could be sensitive areas

Oh, and make conversation with the friendly-looking employees!

I'm fairly sure that the railroad employees would agree with these points. 

At my local yard, there is a road about 80' away from the tracks. In between, there are a series of railway parking lots as well as a fueling station. It's like the railfanning mecca of anyone in Calgary. Great views from the two parking lots, as well as being able to stand on an access road quite close to the main shops. (Heck, I once got invited in for a short tour of them while standing there!) http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=160920

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b274/trainboysd40/alythlineupwabw.jpg

Over at the parking lots the view looks like this: http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b274/trainboysd40/5590atcrewchangeofficelowquality.jpg
You're seperated from the tracks by a  yellow-painted rail, and I have NEVER crossed it.

So, it all depends on the situation. If you can find nice spots like that (There are no fences in that area, mind you) and you haven't heard horror stories about the local RR police torturing railfans, I'd say (cautiosly) go right ahead! (But BE CAREFUL...) 

 

[al-in-chgo]

For myself, I take the situation into account no matter where I am, with a bit more caution away from home. I frequently trespass on the yard property at my largest local yard BUT...it is very common for railfans to do so, and it is safer than staying beside the road. (Might get hit in the head by a small stone whipped up by a passing pickup )

Anyways, this is what I do.

Don't cross fences.

Stay away from the tracks.

Stay out of congested areas.

Make sure that the 'no trespassing' signs are small an infrequent

Stay away from what look like they could be sensitive areas

Oh, and make conversation with the friendly-looking employees!

I'm fairly sure that the railroad employees would agree with these points. 

At my local yard, there is a road about 80' away from the tracks. In between, there are a series of railway parking lots as well as a fueling station. It's like the railfanning mecca of anyone in Calgary. Great views from the two parking lots, as well as being able to stand on an access road quite close to the main shops. (Heck, I once got invited in for a short tour of them while standing there!) http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=160920

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b274/trainboysd40/alythlineupwabw.jpg

Over at the parking lots the view looks like this: http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b274/trainboysd40/5590atcrewchangeofficelowquality.jpg
You're seperated from the tracks by a  yellow-painted rail, and I have NEVER crossed it.

So, it all depends on the situation. If you can find nice spots like that (There are no fences in that area, mind you) and you haven't heard horror stories about the local RR police torturing railfans, I'd say (cautiosly) go right ahead! (But BE CAREFUL...) 

 

 

Trainboy makes some very valid points in a pragmatic mood.  (And BTW, GREAT long-lens shot of CP 9866!) 

The guiding principle seems to be not to present yourself as a safety risk, an intruder, or any other kind of unknown quantity who might be perceived as a pest at best or even a source of trouble. There is always some risk involved, but unless you're  not intimate in the ways of the local action as Trainboy indicates, the chief "risk" IMO is taking the time and tact to approach the authorities for permission, to be proactive and honest and to accept "No" as a valid answer.  (Believe me, it could go much worse even if you hadn't asked beforehand, because if you deliberately trespass, are caught, and then go on to claim any kind of railfan amateur-expertise or familiarity with the industry, it could go worse for you and land you into a situation that transcends "Ignorance of the law is no excuse." ) This does not rule out Trainboy's sometimes approach in areas he knows really well, but obviously, in the USA at this time in our nation's history, heightened awareness of security is the order of the day, even if it means saying "No" in borderline conditions.    

This is not to say that tactful compromises cannot be delicately worked out.  One should consider the RR co's specific culture. My second-favorite RR, the NS, derives a lot of employee loyalty, goodwill and publicity oomph from the fact it wins the Harriman safety award more often than not.  "Safety First" is no mere cliche for them.  If that's more important to them than a bent toward publicity that might mean supplying railfans with a venue for photography, who's to blame them?  

I'm not promising anything, and I can't give financial advice, but I may have gotten a little help from being an NS shareholder.  By going thru Norfolk (NS' HQ), I got some tips from a guy who obviously was more than a little acquainted with the city of Roanoke, VA, as most of you know the Norfolk & Western's pre-merger HQ and also my intended venue for photography. I was cued in on the most intriguing and generally legal local photo ops, interestingly-angled grade-crossings, overheads and the like.  

If this puzzles you, the principle is that being a shareholder makes it more difficult to make an arrest for trespassing stick because being a shareholder makes you a part-owner of the company, at least in an abstract way.  (Does anyone besides me remember the episode of "King of the Hill" where Hank Hill entered a beer co's HQ?  The first thing security asked him was "Are you a shareholder?"  Hank replied "No," and THEN he got the heave-ho!)  

It may have helped that I am a shareholder in NS; it may not have.  I did ask for and received a free 2007 NS wall calendar. Now that I KNOW was a benefit of owning shares!