CISX 500, a rambling attempt at a scratchbuilt depressed centre flatcar

[SeeYou190]

Bear, I don't know much about four truck depressed center flat cars, but that model looks really good.

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Congratulations.

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-Kevin

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["JaBear"]

Thanks for the link to the “new” photos and the extra information they provide, Tom.  I still have yet to make a load for the car, so….

Cheers, the Bear. 

[mlehman]

Very interesting. Thanks for the find! None of the comments made to that page so far suggest that they know about the car's heritage.

[tomd81]

Found a couple more photos of the CISX 500 depressed flat car. Four photos about half way down the page

 

 

[mlehman]

gmpullman

I found a William G. Simon that had owned a pulpwood car?

Ed,

Yeah, came across that, but realized it didn't fit because it was too recent, as well as the typo issue with reporting marks.

What could help here is if someone had a more complete collection of ORERs. I have a 1944, 1953 (NMRA edition), and a 1960. Can anyone check any of the intermediate issues to try and spot it. One handicap is that the list of heavy-duty flats is composed of RR-owner cars soesn't include privately-owned cars. You have to look those up in each o the private car listings.

[gmpullman]

mlehman

Instead, USAX belonged to Willam G. Simon.

I found a William G. Simon that had owned a pulpwood car? Perhaps the same fellow? Perhaps being a lawyer in Ravenna, Ohio he was in charge of the receivership of a bankrupt company? 

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/rsList.aspx?id=USCX

It has reporting marks of USCX. [edit]

Upon closer examination of the photo of the pulpwood car it would seem that the CAR is lettered UCSX ! Even more curiouser? I'm guessing it is simply a typo at RR Picture Archives.

UCSX is Union Camp paper company.

Ed

[tomd81]

Bear: Excellent work on the CISX car! Please contact me off list, my email is on my webpage. Tomd

[mlehman]

If anyone comes across new information regarding this car, please feel free to chime in

Bear,

Spent some time today looking around for anything new I could find. Nothing much really. I did look up the newer reporting marks, USCX. With that set of initials, you might start thinking it might stand for US Steel Carnegie Works, given the companies making up US Steel were merged together after the war. This included the Carnegie Works.

But no not that.

Maybe something related to the US government? It's close to several other US government reporting marks, like USAX (Army) and USNX (Navy).

Nope not one of those.

Instead, USAX belonged to Willam G. Simon. Huh? Doesn't sound like either a RR or a private car outfit. Not even sure there's a connection, but there was a Willam G. Simon  who was head of the Los Angeles FBI pffice and had some other suggestive connections that in the context of the 1950s US nuclear program might be relevant. See this obit:

http://articles.latimes.com/1997/aug/14/news/mn-22332

The mystery certainly deepens, as does what happened to it.

["JaBear"]

Firstly, thanks for all the kind remarks.

herrinchoker

. !  Was impressed with the two holes in the cement wall, takes tunnel modeling to new heights-!!

Aaahh, the holes in the wall. The layout, in the video, belongs to a friend who is one of the founders of the local American Modellers Modular Group. On acquiring his new house, we had jokingly remarked that by “tunnelling” through the concrete block wall from “the train room” he could extend into and along the back wall of the 3 and a bit car garage so to have all his modules set up at all times. As evidenced in the video, he did so and started on helixes at both ends of the layout in order to allow for a second deck for even more modules. However due to a change in employment, the train room work bench has become his new business venture work bench, and as his business is taking off, more work space is required, so much so, that the “train room” looks unlikely to continue to exist in that capacity!!

 

Loads?! 

 

After I had applied the deck and bottom to the frame I cut two rectangular holes in the bottom and slipped in two pieces of .040” panel steel, cut to size, and using some silicone sealant affixed them in place. This was because I suddenly got an attack of the “clevers” and thought it would be a good idea, that by placing small magnets in the bottom of the loads, it would not only hold them in place but also make them removable. It’s just a pity I hadn’t thought of it at the appropriate time in the build process, it would have been a lot quicker!! 

 

As for the actual loads, I think that one of the large ingot moulds, used to produce ingots of steel for amour plate, that the car appears to have been built to transport for in the first place would be appropriate.  Though I have it on good authority that moulds that size, were unusual in that they were far larger than “normal” and would have created problems in processing into the final amour plate sheets.

My surmise is that perhaps the whole “big ingot” idea was one of those “bigger is better” ideas, a war time expediency, that actually wasn’t better. This could have explained why the car, in early 1945, the car was transporting “Jumbo” from Ohio to New Mexico, though again, acquisition of the car for “Top Secret” war work may have been viewed as far more important war work than the production of amour plate.

 

That said I don’t have any real desire to model “Jumbo” as this relates to a very specific historic episode, that wouldn’t fit into my proposed layouts mid-50s layout.

 

Now having the car still in service in the 50s may be a false premise because I haven’t been able to ascertain how long CISX 500 remained in service, part of the confusion may be because its reporting mark changed to USCX 500 at some time.

 

I would have also thought (a dangerous thing in itself ) that with the apparent reluctance by railroad companies to scrap any useful rolling stock unless they’re forced to by AAR or FRA rules, and being a specialist car, that CISX 500 / USCX 500 would have had a long working life, unless, of course, it proved to be too expensive to maintain in service.

 

However, on my fictional railroad the above doesn’t really matter, because CISX will be in revenue service, transporting (yet to be determined) oversize loads as required.

 

If anyone comes across new information regarding this car, please feel free to chime in.

Cheers, the Bear. 

[mlehman]

Bear, It's long anticipated, but well worth the wait! Looks phantastic! The decals look great, too.

What kind of loads do you have planned?

BTW, speaking of such loads, for hardcore nuclear nostalgia buffs, Lawrence Livermore National Lab just relased a large batch of testing films this week, the first major group of these in about 20 years to see the light of day, err, to MAKE the light of day. This looks like slo-mo, but it's not, just 8 Mt at 12,000 feet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_jFQw78uzo&index=14&list=PLvGO_dWo8VfcmG166wKRy5z-GlJ_OQND5

[herrinchoker]

JaBear,

A fine looking product---quite a nice job. !  Was impressed with the two holes in the cement wall, takes tunnel modeling to new heights-!!

herrinchoker

[doctorwayne]

...I am quite pleased at what I’ve both achieved and learnt though the project....

And well you should be, as that's a great-looking and well-running car. 

I am curious, though, to know how your next door neighbour feels about having your trains passing through his basement? 

Wayne

[hon30critter]

Bear!

Well worth the wait! That is a really nice looking flat car! I'm curious to see what you will add for a load. That could be a neat project just in itself.

I just re-read the whole thread. Great tutorial! I might just put one on my project list.

Cheers Bear!!!

Dave

["JaBear"]

Well I’ll never get an award for “Speedy Modeler”, but have finally got to the “almost” finished stage.

 

As I’ve said before, I have difficulty while making parts in accurately duplicating them to a standard that I’m pleased with, and the truck mounted brake reservoirs proved the point, again! Don’t get me wrong, I’m quite prepared to cheat in as much that I’ve paired them in so much as they are on opposite sides of the car and can’t be observed at the same time, and while the discrepancies may be minor and Bearly barely discernible, they’re not to contest quality.

 

The stirrups, hand rails, and brake staff were fabricated from .020” brass, the 4 stirrups needing five attempts, and I shouldn’t have used the .020” brass for the brake wheel shaft, because it’s too thick for the Tichy brake wheels I’ve used. .0125 phosphor bronze wire, also available from Tichy, and of which I have some, I should have used!!! The grab irons are Tichy.

 

 

This is not a criticism of Tichy, rather a reflection on my big paws, and that my rolling stock should be able to be handled, as in going to the Club and to shows, and as a result I’m looking into “metal” brake wheels as a more robust replacement.

 

While researching the font that the decals would be printed in, and deciding that Railroad Roman looked about right, I then found that the Railroad Roman font appears to have changed over time, and possibly with different railroads. Just a heads up to those who may actually care about such matters.

 

 

I still need to apply some subtle weathering, especially to make those brake reservoirs “pop”; after all the effort you don’t really notice them; and of course a load or two. But I am quite pleased at what I’ve both achieved and learnt though the project, just have a make sure I don’t repeat the same mistakes on future projects.

Thanks for looking,

Cheers, the Bear. 

[hon30critter]

gmpullman

Why do I have the "munchies" after watching that video?

Ed:

I hadn't bothered to look closely at the other cars in the train. (Actually I was waiting for the flat car to side swipe something!)

Now you have me headed for the pantry!

Dave

[gmpullman]

Why do I have the "munchies" after watching that video?

Let's see, a D&RG Cookie box car, Coors (on ice I hope), Cold Cuts form Oscar Mayer, Candy from Baby Ruth and Cheese from Kraft! You have all my favorite "C" food covered!

I'll need the depressed-center flat car just to haul my bloated carcass around!

Thanks for the "eye-candy" Bear...

Ed

[hon30critter]

Very nice Bear!

It handled the 'S' curves beautifully.

Dave

["JaBear"]

gmpullman

However, I can also relate to how quickly a redundant task can become very tedious... especially at "our" age!

Very true Ed, and cussedness coupled with being a slow learner doesn’t help.

Anyhow I got the opportunity to give the car a test run on a layout.......

 

 

 

.......now I’ve got to finish it.

 

Thanks for looking,

Cheers, the Bear.

[gmpullman]

Plus I have, for better or worse, a rather large streak of cussedness

Hi, Bear—

Re: The above quote, I can relate!

However, I can also relate to how quickly a redundant task can become very tedious... especially at "our" age! 

Have fun with your "little" project. I admire your abilities and hope it inspires others.

regards, Ed

 

["JaBear"]

Gidday Ed, thank you very much for your generous offer. 

Making my own brake cylinders may be taking scratch building to the nth degree but as I’d looked at various brake cylinders on my selection of diesels for inspiration and a pattern, none seemed to be quite what I was looking for. Plus I have, for better or worse, a rather large streak of cussedness so I need to prove a point more often than not.

The irony is, of course, that anyone who actually sees the finished car as a part of a consist is not going to realise that CISX 500 was a real car, and that it was scratch built, let alone that the brake cylinders were mounted on the trucks!!

I joined this forum to have the ability to ask the occasional specific question about the prototype American railroads. The greatest thing, which I didn’t even expect from the forum, was that I would get to “meet” and interact with some great blokes.

Cheers, the grateful Bear.

[gmpullman]

Now I’ve just got to rustle up seven more!!

Hi, Bear—

I just happened to stumble upon your latest post and couldn't help thinking about your brake cylinder quandry.

Then I remembered seeing several sets of Stewart brake cylinders from their Blomberg trucks. I have several spare sets that I'd be glad to contribute to your project...

The mounting pin is 1.2mm.

If you think you can use them, say the word!

Regards, Ed

[mlehman]

Great stuff, x8 soon!

Very well done

BTW, Frank's close enough he may of heard of them, but locally we have a sort of oldies band called Captain Rat and the Blind Rivets.

["JaBear"]

mlehman

-- at least in terms of heft

I am hopeful Mike.

 

Taking the time to study the available photos of this car, it became obvious that the brake cylinders mounted on the trucks was a spotting feature and even though I’ve played fast and loose with the underside of the auxiliary cars, I would have to address this.

While I was happy with my first attempt, in the cold light of the next day, it didn’t make the cut, so back to the drawing board. After a couple of false starts and revisions, I think I’ve finally got it, especially when it’s painted the same colour as the truck, which incidentally differs slightly from the prototypes Buckeyes.

 

Now I’ve just got to rustle up seven more!!

Thanks for looking.

Cheers, the Bear.

[mlehman]

Bear,

Things are looking great. She's going to be the Queen of the Rails -- at least in terms of heft

["JaBear"]

zstripe

You're going to love this LOL.....a rivet nut aka blind nut, rivnut, etc.:

You’re a hard man Frank, but you may rest assured that when at w**k I use the correct Part Number or an approved alternative.

 

I’ve got to the stage of having completed the depressed centre body apart from the painting and decaling.

                                            

 

Here’s a look at the underneath of the auxiliary cars which look anything but prototypical. The sides are .060” styrene and the centre beam and “bolsters” (?) is laminated styrene to the correct height, including the “blind nuts ( OK, T nuts), to allow for the proper coupler height. The deck is .040” styrene. The reason I’ve made it like this is that it’s darn hard to see under the cars and I wanted to stuff in as much weight as possible. I may yet give the underneath a quick flick of matt black paint to really disguise the lack of detail.

 

Thanks for looking,

Cheers, the Bear.

[tankcarsrule]

You sir, are a REAL craftsman!!!!! Regards, Bobby

[zstripe]

Bear,

You're going to love this LOL.....a rivet nut aka blind nut, rivnut, etc.:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rivet_nut

Take Care! 

Frank

["JaBear"]

Ahhh!! I would never doubt your integrity Frank but I certainly wouldn’t call it a rivet nut. This is a rivnut......

 

 

 

Cheers, the Bear.

[zstripe]

LOL, Not to make a big thing out of nothing....but the correct term is T-nut...AKA blind nut, rivet nut and a couple others. Here in the Midwest, they are known as T-nut. In My 74 yrs. I don't recall them being called anything else...not around here anyway!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-nut

Take Care! 

Frank