bnsf1There's a potential downside in putting sound in all locomotives, but it may mean lower costs through economy of scale. As for those who don't want it, I believe most decoders use F8 as a mute.
Again I'm afraid I have to disagree. You are now breaking down to market into three groups: those who are happy with sound; those who like DCC but don't want sound; and those who neither want sound or DCC.
I don't believe that the manufacturers are going to sell the sound locos cheaper to subsidize non-sound DCC or non-DCC locos. So that makes the sound lovers unhappy because they don't want to pay an additional $90 per loco.
Then the DCC non-sound folks are unhappy because they don't want to pay the difference between the sound decoder price and the non-sound decoder price. Yes they can press F8, but why should they have to?
And the non-DCC folks are unhappy because they view the addition of any decoder as jacking the price up unnecessarily, and then they have to rip the decoder out anyway.
So, what is the manufacturer to do?
IRONROOSTER Without getting into the quality involved I see on modeltrainstuff.com Bachmann 4-4-0's for sale with DCC with sound and DCC without sound. List is $140 difference Discount is $105 difference Sale is $80 difference Their Bachmann old time 4-4-0's are DCC and sound vs DCC ready List is $80 difference Discount is $57 difference Sale is $50 difference So the sound adds significantly to the price for those who don't want sound (or don't like the sound the manufacturer chose). I think the option of the DCC ready decoder 8 pin socket (as in the old time 4-4-0) is the way to go. That way you can easily add the DCC or DCC + sound decoder of your choice. Or stay DC if DCC isn't for you. Enjoy Paul
Without getting into the quality involved I see on modeltrainstuff.com Bachmann 4-4-0's for sale with DCC with sound and DCC without sound.
List is $140 difference
Discount is $105 difference
Sale is $80 difference
Their Bachmann old time 4-4-0's are DCC and sound vs DCC ready
List is $80 difference
Discount is $57 difference
Sale is $50 difference
So the sound adds significantly to the price for those who don't want sound (or don't like the sound the manufacturer chose).
I think the option of the DCC ready decoder 8 pin socket (as in the old time 4-4-0) is the way to go. That way you can easily add the DCC or DCC + sound decoder of your choice. Or stay DC if DCC isn't for you.
Enjoy
Paul
I agree that sound does add a significant cost to a locomotive.
However, the question I posed in my original post was, would the cost of sound be decreased or at least held down by manufacturers using sound decoders in all models with decoders installed?
Obviously they have the option of offering the units with no decoders at all, as in the Atlas HO GP 38/40s.
In that case, you can order one without a decoder and do what you want.
But, there are still models out there with non-sound decoders installed.
Let's look at it this way.
A manufacturer decides to release a model. For arguments sake they expect to sell 1,000 of them.
If they figure half will sell with a sound decoder, the other half with a standerd decoder, the cost of the development of that sound decoder is spread across 500 units.
I'd be beyond surprised if they can't get a better price per decoder with an order of 1,000 as opposed to 500.
Which is back to the original point of this post.
Would it reduce the per unit cost if manufacturers installed them in all models with decoders?
bnsf1As for those who don't want it, I believe most decoders use F8 as a mute.
And they pay for a item they do not want?
Ever wonder why there is DCC Ready,DCC equipped and DCC/Sound? That fills the current market requirements.
BTW.History does repeat its self.. This same discussion was debated on the old Atlas forum except it was for DCC equipped locomotives.
And we still have DCC ready locomotives.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
maxman bnsf1 There's a potential downside in putting sound in all locomotives, but it may mean lower costs through economy of scale. As for those who don't want it, I believe most decoders use F8 as a mute. Again I'm afraid I have to disagree. You are now breaking down to market into three groups: those who are happy with sound; those who like DCC but don't want sound; and those who neither want sound or DCC. I don't believe that the manufacturers are going to sell the sound locos cheaper to subsidize non-sound DCC or non-DCC locos. So that makes the sound lovers unhappy because they don't want to pay an additional $90 per loco. Then the DCC non-sound folks are unhappy because they don't want to pay the difference between the sound decoder price and the non-sound decoder price. Yes they can press F8, but why should they have to? And the non-DCC folks are unhappy because they view the addition of any decoder as jacking the price up unnecessarily, and then they have to rip the decoder out anyway. So, what is the manufacturer to do?
bnsf1 There's a potential downside in putting sound in all locomotives, but it may mean lower costs through economy of scale. As for those who don't want it, I believe most decoders use F8 as a mute.
I think you meant to reply to someone else.
My original post questioned whether or not the cost of sound decoders would be reduced if all models with decoders installed had them instead of non-sound.
It didn't involve DCC vs DC.
BRAKIE bnsf1 As for those who don't want it, I believe most decoders use F8 as a mute. And they pay for a item they do not want? Ever wonder why there is DCC Ready,DCC equipped and DCC/Sound? That fills the current market requirements. BTW.History does repeat its self.. This same discussion was debated on the old Atlas forum except it was for DCC equipped locomotives. And we still have DCC ready locomotives.
bnsf1 As for those who don't want it, I believe most decoders use F8 as a mute.
Unfortunatley, this post has gone in a direction that's a long way from the original.
The whole point was, would sound be cheaper if manufacturers selling decoder equipped models used sound decoders in all of them?
It had nothing to do with forcing anyone to take anything they don't want.
It had to do with being able to negotiate a better price per unit with a larger order.
For those with no interest in sound, they could offer models with a plug and the modeler could do what they want.
That's what Atlas has done with the models I mentioned.
You have two choices, with a decoder and without.
But, if you get the decoder installed, it has sound.
Obviously they could have offered the models with no decoder, a standard decoder and a sound decoder.
They didn't.
I doubt it's because the idea didn't occur to them.
I'm sure that was a marketing decision that took the costs of offering each possibility into account.
Which brings us back to the original post.
Would sound be cheaper if all deocder equipped units had a sound decoder?
They may have already given us the answer with that model.
hornblower DCC sound decoders seem to average around $100. Non-sound decoders seem to average around $30. Thus, we are paying around $70 for a typically 1 watt (RMS, max, peak?) amplifier and a memory chip to hold the sound files. Even if we subtract another $20 for the sound chip, $50 per watt is not much of a deal for an amplifier. Anyone can buy a Carvin DCM2000L two channel power amplifier with 325 watts RMS per channel at 8 ohms for $399. That's 61 cents per watt for a touring quality amplifier that is so robust it can safely drive a 2 ohm load for hours. Just see how long your $50 1 watt amplifier will live driving a 2 ohm load. It certainly won't produce 20 to 20K Hz at <.1% distortion either. Before you counter with the old market volume response, keep in mind that Carvin is selling to a rather limited market, too. Their market is so small, you probably haven't even heard of them!
DCC sound decoders seem to average around $100. Non-sound decoders seem to average around $30. Thus, we are paying around $70 for a typically 1 watt (RMS, max, peak?) amplifier and a memory chip to hold the sound files. Even if we subtract another $20 for the sound chip, $50 per watt is not much of a deal for an amplifier. Anyone can buy a Carvin DCM2000L two channel power amplifier with 325 watts RMS per channel at 8 ohms for $399. That's 61 cents per watt for a touring quality amplifier that is so robust it can safely drive a 2 ohm load for hours. Just see how long your $50 1 watt amplifier will live driving a 2 ohm load. It certainly won't produce 20 to 20K Hz at <.1% distortion either. Before you counter with the old market volume response, keep in mind that Carvin is selling to a rather limited market, too. Their market is so small, you probably haven't even heard of them!
You are basing your calculations strictly on the physical item alone. Also added into that cost of the sound decoder is numerous hours of employee travel to make the original recordings, then the sound editor spends a whole lot of hours taking those raw recordings and converting them into use-able files which then have to be pieced together into a rather complex sound schedule to make everything work as expected by the end user. All this time and effort also has to be factored in to every decoder, multiplied by how many different sound files the manufacturer has created. This can easily translate into thousands of dollars per sound file by the time everyone has done their part.
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
bnsf1Would sound be cheaper if all decoder equipped units had a sound decoder?
No.. A good example would be Athearn's RTR SD40-2 that is DCC ready versus the RTR DCC/Sound equipped SD40-2.
RTR DCC Ready is $134.98
DCC/Sound is 184.98.
The manufacturer will charge you for that DCC/Sound decoder and at extra cost for installing it. Somebody will be paid to install that decoder.Labor is passed on to the end consumer.
The prices wil go up not down especially if the manufacturer of the dcc/sound decoder keeps jacking his price due to supply and demand..
JEREMY CENTANNIWhy would they say Tsunami is dead while rolling out the Economi without a replacement for the Tsunami? I might be missing something but isn't that about the dumbest business decision you ever heard of?
Well, perhaps it has something to do with the fact that the Tsunami is 10ish years old (maybe more), and they are loosing their market share to other manufacturers with better sound, better motor control, and fewer reliability/overheating issues (TSU-750s are notorious for overheating, and the 1000s are not much better)? The business decision here was probably to capture a niche market with the Econami, and float on the remaining stock of Tsunamis (I imagine these are not selling very fast, due to the above listed reasons) until the release of Soundtraxx's new full featured decoder.
BRAKIE bnsf1 Would sound be cheaper if all decoder equipped units had a sound decoder? No.. A good example would be Athearn's RTR SD40-2 that is DCC ready versus the RTR DCC/Sound equipped SD40-2. RTR DCC Ready is $134.98 DCC/Sound is 184.98. The manufacturer will charge you for that DCC/Sound decoder and at extra cost for installing it. Somebody will be paid to install that decoder.Labor is passed on to the end consumer. The prices wil go up not down especially if the manufacturer of the dcc/sound decoder keeps jacking his price due to supply and demand..
bnsf1 Would sound be cheaper if all decoder equipped units had a sound decoder?
Of course they'll charge for supplying and installing it. They also charge more for supplying a model that's already assembled than a box of parts.
Actually, paying an extra $50 for an installed decoder, sound or not, seems pretty reasonable.
If the only installed decoder they offer is one with sound, that would seem to lend weight to the assumption that this is the way things are headed.
If that's true, it also suggests that manufacturers are finding it more cost-effective to go this route.
If the buyer doesn't want sound, they still have the option of no decoder.
mlehman I think the fundamental answer is there's more profit in a sound-equipped loco. The profit in non-sound units is likely a lot closer to break-even than most suspect. Depending on who you ask, sound makes up 50% or more of the market. In some ways, those of us who favor sound may be subsidizing those who do not. Some may see that as a bad thing. I suspect whatever extra profit there is in sound helps support less profitable, but still necessary aspects of the hobby. Take those away, however noble the intentions may be, and you may simply starve the hobby fatally. Like high profit products at the grocery store, they help make the selection it carries wide and deep. Otherwise you might be eating cornflakes and hamburger everyday.
I think the fundamental answer is there's more profit in a sound-equipped loco. The profit in non-sound units is likely a lot closer to break-even than most suspect. Depending on who you ask, sound makes up 50% or more of the market. In some ways, those of us who favor sound may be subsidizing those who do not. Some may see that as a bad thing. I suspect whatever extra profit there is in sound helps support less profitable, but still necessary aspects of the hobby. Take those away, however noble the intentions may be, and you may simply starve the hobby fatally. Like high profit products at the grocery store, they help make the selection it carries wide and deep. Otherwise you might be eating cornflakes and hamburger everyday.
Really? Again, having worked in this business, I seriously doubt that any of these companies are selling anything at a "break even" price.
I agree that the market for sound is likely 50% or more, but I also suspect that the manufacturers have learned that non DCC users will simply not buy DCC locos with sound.......at any price.
And every indication is that DCC, and sound with it, is still only 50-60% of the market.
To the OP - F8 is meaningless to those of us who still run DC - I don't want sound or DCC - dual mode decoders don't work on my DC throttles. I only buy DCC locos that are easy to remove the decoders from - like Bachmann locos that come with jumper plugs to remove the decoder
Sheldon
bnsf1 BRAKIE bnsf1 Would sound be cheaper if all decoder equipped units had a sound decoder? No.. A good example would be Athearn's RTR SD40-2 that is DCC ready versus the RTR DCC/Sound equipped SD40-2. RTR DCC Ready is $134.98 DCC/Sound is 184.98. The manufacturer will charge you for that DCC/Sound decoder and at extra cost for installing it. Somebody will be paid to install that decoder.Labor is passed on to the end consumer. The prices Will go up not down especially if the manufacturer of the dcc/sound decoder keeps jacking his price due to supply and demand.. Of course they'll charge for supplying and installing it. They also charge more for supplying a model that's already assembled than a box of parts. Actually, paying an extra $50 for an installed decoder, sound or not, seems pretty reasonable. If the only installed decoder they offer is one with sound, that would seem to lend weight to the assumption that this is the way things are headed. If that's true, it also suggests that manufacturers are finding it more cost-effective to go this route. If the buyer doesn't want sound, they still have the option of no decoder.
BRAKIE bnsf1 Would sound be cheaper if all decoder equipped units had a sound decoder? No.. A good example would be Athearn's RTR SD40-2 that is DCC ready versus the RTR DCC/Sound equipped SD40-2. RTR DCC Ready is $134.98 DCC/Sound is 184.98. The manufacturer will charge you for that DCC/Sound decoder and at extra cost for installing it. Somebody will be paid to install that decoder.Labor is passed on to the end consumer. The prices Will go up not down especially if the manufacturer of the dcc/sound decoder keeps jacking his price due to supply and demand..
The prices Will go up not down especially if the manufacturer of the dcc/sound decoder keeps jacking his price due to supply and demand..
The down side and its one that keeps sales department manager awake at night is how many sales will be lost? A extra $50.00 could be a deal breaker for the budget minded modeler with a family,mortgage and car payments, taxes and utility bills..
If they could get a DCC/Sound locomotive with minimal details in a budget price range at street(like Bachmann) then they could have a winner.
There is a lot of hosing the end consumer in lot of model railroad products. Go check prices not even ten years old in magazines and look at the same thing now.
Last time I checked my house isn't worth 50% more and my grocery bill is not 50% more either they have gone up, but nowhere near the same rate.
You want to know why prices are going up? Wages in China have been rising rapidly. A little blurb from "China Daily" written about 5 years ago: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/2011-04/19/content_12353372.htm.
New York Times article from June, 2010: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/08/business/global/08wages.html?_r=0
China's average wage has just about tripled in the last 10 years: http://www.tradingeconomics.com/china/wages
So how are you getting hosed? And by whom?
Andre
I collect other things as well, just as complicated and probably moreso than HO scale cars and engines. Prices there haven't gotten stupid in the same time frame? They would also be included on the limited scale of things sales wise at least on the Takara side for Masterpiece Transformers. Also made in China.
50 cents to $1.50 a day isn't much of an impact on price either.
I think there is another circumstance which needs to be taken into account. That is, what if I don't like the decoder that the manufacturers' decide to put into a particular locomotive? In that case, putting sound decoders into everything simply raises my costs because I will have to buy another more suitable decoder to get the sounds/functions/performance that I want.
I have stopped buying sound equipped locomotives because I have run into a few situations where the factory decoders didn't do what I wanted. For example, I have several Intermountain F7s and F9s that came with factory supplied Loksound decoders. I wanted to install reverse lights but the decoders did not have a reverse light function wired in. For almost exactly the same amount of money I could have purchased DC locomotives and installed Loksound Selects myself with all the functions available.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
ATLANTIC CENTRALReally? Again, having worked in this business, I seriously doubt that any of these companies are selling anything at a "break even" price.
Sheldon,
I didn't say "break even" but at considerably less profit than some imagine there is in a DC loco. Very different things.
The OPs premise is still insensitive to the considerable difference in complexity between a DCC control only decoder and a sound decoder. Obviously, some folks think a chip is a chip, ignoring the extra costs that accrue once sound come into the picture.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Basically, we are back to the age old discussion of "I like/dislike DCC" and "I like/dislike" DCC/Sound". We have had that discussion minimum once a year since I joined this forum and we have mutually come to the conclusion that we agree to disagree, especially to the opinion voiced by Sheldon (no offense meant).
Manufacturers will go a long way to "add value" to their products, which in effect means boosting the margin by adding a gadget for a few bucks which may sell for a lot bigger bucks in the market. Apparently, that proves to be the case with those discussed sound features. If it weren´t, sound would surely be just another after market feature.
It is like it is - and no discussion in a forum will change a successful marketing policy.
Lord.
Look, model railroad equipment is a luxury good, not a necessity. The way you price a luxury good is "raise the price until the revenue curve levels out." Obviously the revenue curve has not yet leveled out, so they keep raising the prices.This is in any introductory level economics textbook in the universe. It's only slightly less fundamental a rule than the law of supply and demand, inflation, and elastic vs inelastic demand.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
Hi Ulrich,
Yes, the OP's question has brought out some fairly strong opinions on DCC and sound with regard to costs. However, I have to disagree with your implication that the discussion is not worthwhile. I think the OP asked a very straight forward question "would costs go down if...." and I think that it is an interesting question. As I stated, I am totally opposed to the concept, but the OP's question is no different than if he was asking "would costs go down if all manufacturers used the same motor...". (OK, that is probably a lame example). What the OP has hopefully learned is that his question cannot be answered simply. There are too many different opinions and desires. That's OK. Hopefully the OP has a better understanding of the implications of all manufacturers offering sound only locomotives if that were to actually happen.
My point is that we should not try to stifle discussion on the forums, especially when it is a newer member asking the question. The forums are here precisely to allow us to discuss model railroad topics and we have all said that more participation in both the forums and the hobby is a good thing. So what if the manufacturers aren't listening to every post? I am (almost). You are likely reading most threads too, and we would both be disappointed if Kalmbach told us to keep our opinions to ourselves.
No offense Ulrich! It's always good to hear your opinions.
Regards,
I have to kind of chuckle at the "economy of scale" argument being posted here. It's a nice try, but it's a different sort of universe to compare automobile wiring harnesses (Ford sells something like 6 million vehicles a year) to DCC sound decoders (where a big run of sound engines might be 5000 or as little as 3000).
Basically, there is no comparison. Ford can make 6 million identical wiring harnesses and save money by standardizing it, using mass production, and using robot assembly lines. Soundtraxx or Athearn still hand makes all their stuff. Mass production for them means hiring more women to build them (and they're almost always women as men just don't have the dexterity).
Just look at an electrical supply website like Mouser or Allied Electronics. They offer bulk purchasing discounts. At random, I found a DPDT sub-mini toggle at Mouser. Sure they offer a discount from $10.37 for one toggle to $7.56 for 500 toggles. But what's the unit price for 1000 toggles? $7.28. Yep, you only save 28 cents per toggle if you buy 1000 vs. 500. Going from 1000 to 3000 is not shown, but probably still over $7.00 ea.
So how much cheaper per unit would it be for a hobby company to offer all-sound vs. just some sound? The answer: not much. Not unless they start selling several million per year like Ford.
Paul A. Cutler III
Paul:
Very good point.
Make you eat dirt? Make everyone else pay more for it? Forced to pay for sound? Seriously? Gosh, I must have missed that meeting where model railroaders are told that they are forced to buy things against their will.
John M.,I thought you were all about steam sound and smoke? For the kids, you said...right? Or am I not remembering correctly?
The famous example of prices going down in this hobby, even after the initial announcement is the Athearn NS Heritage units. I think the per unit retail price dropped something like $20. Not because they over-produced them and were blowing them out, but because pre-production orders were so high they were able to negotiate a better deal with the Chinese.
Other famous examples (to me, anyways) are the prices that stay the same. The original $20 decoder was the Digitrax DH120 which came out in the last 1990's. It's successor, the DH126 (which is much improved), is still $20. By inflation alone it should be $30 by now. Now add in the improvements, it should be even higher. Yet it's still at the same price it was over 17 years ago.
Jeremy C., I talked with the owner of a hobby manufacturer, and he told me that the cost for doing one loco went from $50 to $150 in 5 years for the same model. And that's not his cost, that's what the Chinese were charging him. That's what people mean when the cost of labor has tripled. Hobby companies don't pay the Chinese workers directly (they aren't employees of theirs), they pay the Chinese factory. So it's not just the wages, it's what the Chinese companies can get. It's basic capitalistic behavior by the Chinese factories.
The Tsunami is dead because a major component is no longer available. Digitrax went through the same thing with the DT100. They had to come up with a stopgap DT300 until the DT400 was ready. This sort of thing happens from time to time in the electronics biz. You make something using common components that are widely available, and then as technology changes, those common parts become uncommon, then rare, then gone entirely.Paul A. Cutler III
Sir MadogIt is like it is - and no discussion in a forum will change a successful marketing policy.
I disagree..There was so much fuss raised over FVM N Scale Norfolk Southern GE ES44AC not having the headlights mounted correctly on a popular N Scale forum that FVM corrected the mistake on the second run.
Again that's why we still have DCC Ready instead of all DCC equipped locomotives. Modelers voice their opinion on forums.
Manufacturers reads forums. Its a method of getting feed back and production ideas.
mlehman ATLANTIC CENTRAL Really? Again, having worked in this business, I seriously doubt that any of these companies are selling anything at a "break even" price. Sheldon, I didn't say "break even" but at considerably less profit than some imagine there is in a DC loco. Very different things. The OPs premise is still insensitive to the considerable difference in complexity between a DCC control only decoder and a sound decoder. Obviously, some folks think a chip is a chip, ignoring the extra costs that accrue once sound come into the picture.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Really? Again, having worked in this business, I seriously doubt that any of these companies are selling anything at a "break even" price.
As a percentage, I suspect they make exactly ther same amount on both.........
The premise sounds great. Standardize a loco to include sound.
But the reality is far different. It would cost too much and discourage a lot of would be buyers.
Think about it. If the added cost is nominal, even the guy who simply wants a dummy locomotive would buy it and strip out the sound, the decoder, the motor.
If a manufacturer starts out with a chassis and a shell, it costs more to add a motor. It costs even more to add a decoder. It costs even more to add a sound decoder and a speaker.
Using the automobile analogy, why doesn't Ford fully equip all of its Taurus models so that the Taurus SE becomes a Taurus SHO? Let's see now, the MSRP is $27,110 while the Taurus SHO is $40,275. Hmmm, maybe that's why Ford doesn't do that.
Rich
Alton Junction
When the Japanese car makers entered the German market, their cars came fully equipped at a price below the bare entry-level models of our own industry, which usually sported a list of extras to be ordered more than a mile long. The list has grown into a full book of the size of "War and Peace", allowing the dear customer to easily double the price of the car he wants.
In the good old (early) days of the VW Beetle, you had the choice of a "Standard" model, or the "Export" model, which had more bling to it. Ah, yes, you also had to choose a color and the option of a radio, or a sun roof. Remember this inglorious ragtop, which became so brittle after only 15 years out in the weather?
Marklin has - if not completely, than to a large extent, taken away any choice. If the loco is offered with sound, that´s what you get and have to pay for. All of them have Marklin´s proprietary DCC system - basta!
Paul--
BLI forces you to buy the engine with sound, or not buy the engine at all. There is no other choice. Perhaps one or two other manufacturers do the same with at least some engines.
I was trying to keep my youngest son interested in trains, and he likes smoke, and has one BLI Santa Fe 4-8-4 with smoke/sound/lights and a purple/silver ACL E-7 with Rapido passenger cars...but is now more interested in video games...to my dismay.
Anyhow, it has come to my attention that some of the sounds are also not even close to the prototype, so not only are we being forced to buy sound, or not buy the engine, but we are being forced to buy incorrect sound at that.
Unfortunately in this hobby, items that were released 10 years ago cannot still be produced at the price point of 10 years ago--I get that. Transportation and manufacturing costs, particularly in China, have gone up since then. I said price decreases were rare, not impossible...
These are all reasons why some of the good, late model brass that is already here in this country can be a good buy for those willing to learn about them. You don't get lots of extra features you might not want, but you do get a good model, that will always require slightly more careful care, lubrication, and handling.
John
This topic reminds me of the dreams vs. reality sketch on the TV Series "Father Ted". Some things sound good in theory but just a guess on my part, if it could be done, manufacturers would have though of it long before people on model train forums. I guess it makes for a coffee table conversation.
People have already raised the logical arguments against the OP's proposal.
/topic. Move along, move along...
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Jim,Remember that several page long trashing,bashing and thumping the production example LL P2K GP38-2 got on the old Atlas forum and how LL redesigned it?
Nope..Lots for the manufacturers to see here..Nothing for us so,move along,there is nothing to see here!
For a few years, Broadway Limited kinda tried that. They offered DC engines equipped with sound decoders. If you wanted to run the engine on a DCC layout, you had to add your own decoder. It didn't last very long, I'm guessing it wasn't that popular. It's possible someday all engines will come with sound, but probably not until everyone is using DCC...if that day ever comes.
Also, not having sound in an engine when you buy let's you decide which decoder to put in. You might choose to spend $100 on a switcher that you use every day, but a cheaper decoder might be OK for an E7B that you only use once in a while, and that doesn't need a horn or bell sound. Plus, decoders get more features and better sound each year, so I'm sure many folks are replacing those c.2005 Soundtraxx "LC" decoders now with something better in their engines.
In HO, MTH is doing what the OP suggested. All their models come with ProtoSound 3 which is for use with their proprietary DCS system - with some DCC compatibility. Whether or not you want it. And they have some of the highest priced models around.
They look to do the same in S scale at higher price than S Helper charged for regular DCC with sound.