ATLANTIC CENTRAL Dare I replay to this thread? OK here goes. First - pick a theme, era, scale, local - and stick to it - don't buy stuff that does not fit the theme. March to your own drum - do you really like onboard sound? If not, them don't buy it - is it really worth $50 or $100 per loco to you? Do your operational goals really require DCC - learn what you like/need/want/enjoy before you spend a ton of money. Shop smart - I am building a big layout, to run lots of trains. My "theme" requires about 120 locos to put it into operation. (It invloves lots of pre-staged trains ready to apear/disapear to/from hidden staging) I have most of the locos I need for my plan - at a dollar cost average fiqure of about $100 each - sound and DCC would have doubled that cost - no thank you. How much detail do you really need? I have a fleet of 1000 freight cars - not every one needs to be a $50 RTR marvel - many are just lightly weathered Athearn Blue Box kits with a few up grades. All the money I saved on DCC and sound went into my fully intergrated advanced cab control system with sginaling and interlocking - those features were more important to me than sound or individual control of each loco. BUT, advanced cab control has a similar operator experiance to DCC - I have wireless throttles and with a dispatcher on duty engineers simply run their train and obey the signals - no evil DC "toggle flipping", dispite whatever lies you may have been told about DC. Don't collect model trains - that is a different and much more expensive hobby than building a model railroad. I have 120 locos, but not one UP Big Boy, PRR GG1, NYC Hudson, NKP Berkshire, or SP GS4, etc, etc - remember item one - if it does not fit the theme, don't buy it. Atlas turnouts for $12.00 work just as well as PECO turnouts for $20. But here is the one thing I don't skimp on - Nearly my intire fleet of freight cars is equiped with genuine Kadee couplers, Kadee or similar sprung metal trucks, and those Kadee sprung trucks have been re-fitted with Intermountain metal wheel sets. Why you ask? because it provides superior tracking and greatly reduced rolling resistance, allowing a given loco to pull longer trains - the layout is designed for an average train length of 40 cars, and longer trains are easily possible. But what do I know, I'm just a hick with a bunch of little trains with no brains. Sheldon
Dare I replay to this thread? OK here goes.
First - pick a theme, era, scale, local - and stick to it - don't buy stuff that does not fit the theme.
March to your own drum - do you really like onboard sound? If not, them don't buy it - is it really worth $50 or $100 per loco to you?
Do your operational goals really require DCC - learn what you like/need/want/enjoy before you spend a ton of money.
Shop smart - I am building a big layout, to run lots of trains. My "theme" requires about 120 locos to put it into operation. (It invloves lots of pre-staged trains ready to apear/disapear to/from hidden staging)
I have most of the locos I need for my plan - at a dollar cost average fiqure of about $100 each - sound and DCC would have doubled that cost - no thank you.
How much detail do you really need? I have a fleet of 1000 freight cars - not every one needs to be a $50 RTR marvel - many are just lightly weathered Athearn Blue Box kits with a few up grades.
All the money I saved on DCC and sound went into my fully intergrated advanced cab control system with sginaling and interlocking - those features were more important to me than sound or individual control of each loco. BUT, advanced cab control has a similar operator experiance to DCC - I have wireless throttles and with a dispatcher on duty engineers simply run their train and obey the signals - no evil DC "toggle flipping", dispite whatever lies you may have been told about DC.
Don't collect model trains - that is a different and much more expensive hobby than building a model railroad. I have 120 locos, but not one UP Big Boy, PRR GG1, NYC Hudson, NKP Berkshire, or SP GS4, etc, etc - remember item one - if it does not fit the theme, don't buy it.
Atlas turnouts for $12.00 work just as well as PECO turnouts for $20.
But here is the one thing I don't skimp on - Nearly my intire fleet of freight cars is equiped with genuine Kadee couplers, Kadee or similar sprung metal trucks, and those Kadee sprung trucks have been re-fitted with Intermountain metal wheel sets.
Why you ask? because it provides superior tracking and greatly reduced rolling resistance, allowing a given loco to pull longer trains - the layout is designed for an average train length of 40 cars, and longer trains are easily possible.
But what do I know, I'm just a hick with a bunch of little trains with no brains.
Sheldon
Not to be critical, Sheldon; but, your building a layout that is far beyond a person just getting started in the hobby should contemplate. Thinking $10,000.00 worth of locomotives is what it's going to take to be a in this hobby scares the heck out of me and I've been at this hobby a good long while, let alone someone who is just getting started!
I have no problem with your not wanting DCC, with 100 locomotives that is understandable; however, for the rest of us who maybe only need a few DCC equiped locos, $170.00 for a starter DCC system and less that $25.00 for a decoder, is not that scary of an investment. Yes, if sound is important to you, the decoders will be more expensive.
Your layout also requires a fairly large crew to operate. Planing for operations at your level, would also scare many people off! It's great, if you live in a place where there are many like minded people interested in helping you run your layout.
I will agree with you that replacing plastic wheels with metal ones is a good choice. However, I don't agree that cars must have sprung trucks!
Some of what you have to say is helpful to people wanting to get started. However, your layout ambitions are on far to grand a scale for beginners!
However, this comment really puts me off: "But what do I know, I'm just a hick with a bunch of little trains with no brains". This is an agressive put down to everyone else who may not agree with your point of view, serving absolutly no one and is very unwelcoming to anyone reading what you have to say!
NP 2626 "Northern Pacific, really terrific"
Northern Pacific Railway Historical Association: http://www.nprha.org/
richhotrain Bear, that is exactly what I had hoped to do, compress it to about 52" x 4" to fit the planned layout. As depicted in the photo or when it was in use? Also how close to the edge of the layout? Cheer, the Bear.
richhotrain Bear, that is exactly what I had hoped to do, compress it to about 52" x 4" to fit the planned layout.
As depicted in the photo or when it was in use? Also how close to the edge of the layout?
Cheer, the Bear.
My desire would be to model the freight house in the 1950s during its heyday.
The structure would essentially be centered in a 12' x 6' section of my Dream Layout.
Rich
Alton Junction
Rich,
I believe that freight house is where Lifschultz Fast Freight was...if so, I was in that building many times with my Father, who was a close friend of the family when their parents migrated from Russia in the beginning of the 20th century. Very interesting construction inside of it. All wood beam on concrete base and brick walls, like many buildings in that area. I would love to help You out...but unfortunately have too many irons in the fire now, working on my own trucking company buildings and trucks/trailers of that era. If You would like to know some info about Lifschultz, read this story:
http://hankstruckforum.com/htforum/index.php?topic=2382.0
Take Care!
Frank
richhotrainMy desire would be to model the freight house in the 1950s during its heyday.
To be honest I haven’t tried an actual building yet, and with the freight on detail parts to this side of the pond would probably make things a lot harder by trying to it myself. As food for thought though, have you looked at these....
https://www.tichytraingroup.com/Shop/tabid/91/c/ho_framed-windows/p/8047/Default.aspx
http://www.grandtline.com/products/arch/ho/ho_scale_architectural_doors.html
http://www.grandtline.com/products/arch/ho/ho_scale_framed_windows.html
http://www.rustystumps.com/products.asp?cat=2&pg=2
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
zstripe Rich, I believe that freight house is where Lifschultz Fast Freight was...
I believe that freight house is where Lifschultz Fast Freight was...
That freight house in the photo was the C&EI RR Freight House, but the Erie RR Freight House was right next to it. You cannot see the Erie RR Freight House very well in the photo, but it is to the rear (south) of the C&EI RR Freight House, right beyond that water tower.
Lifschultz Fast Freight had a huge facility there, just before the C&WI tracks turned west under the Rock Island tracks at Clark Street. The two freight houses are almost identical in appearance. For some reason, Lifschultz seemed to be closely associated with the Erie RR.
A good start for Your freight house...could be this one from Walthers. Same windows, change roof, add dock and doors to first floor:
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-2953
zstripe Rich, A good start for Your freight house...could be this one from Walthers. Same windows, change roof, add dock and doors to first floor: http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-2953 Take Care! Frank
Still, where do you start?
My photo with the pumpkin patch in WPF has examples of modeling on the cheap.
Starting in the foreground ....
Rocks are made from broken plaster pieces.
Tall grass is made from pieces of twine.
The pumpkins with vines were made by JTT and recently purchased on sale at a clearance shelf at Hobby Lobby.
Fence posts are half of round tooth picks with pointed ends down into scenery materal.
Fence wire is sewing thread.
Scarecrow was "kit-bashed" from half of a Q-Tip.
Crows were made from modeling clay and painted black. (Similar to clay pigeons. LOL)
Corn is a Busch product purchased when Walther Flyer had them on sale.
Backdrop at this location of my layout was painted, and a picture of barn was glued onto it. The barn picture is one I found in a cheap framed picture purchased at a thrift store. I touched it up a bit with paint.
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
Respectfully, who said this thread or its question was just about beginners? Seems to me that there has been considerable talk about other big layouts in this thread.
You can take my closing line any way you want, but from where I sit, it is just an advance acknowledgement that people like you will not agree with me, and I understand and accept that.
You don't have to agree about sprung trucks, but my experiance says that pulling trains in the 40 to 100 car range they make a difference - for two reasons, they do track better because they are "equalized", keeping all the wheels on the rail all the time - and - because they are metal, they add weight where it is needed most, allowing the rest of the car to remain lighter and have a lower center of gravity.
Everyones interests and goals in this hobby are different. Everyones resources of time, money and space are different. Everyone should taylor their modeling to those limitations.
I have no interest in only having a 3' x 10' ISL (industrial switching layout) Brakie loves them. But I do have the equal to several ISL's "inside" my layout.
The point of my post is this, the same point I have been making for years on here - learn what YOU really like and do it - don't just do stuff because everyone else is or because the model press says so.
I have been at this for 47 years, I have no interest in building any more "small" layouts - been there, done that. My post also speaks to the fact that large layouts need not be as expensive as many people think.
And my layout is designed for both operation and display running. One person can operate it just fine - five trains worth actually.
47 years, 120 locomotives, average price each $100, equals 2.5 locos per year, $250 per year.
Your really didn't think I bought 120 locos and 1000 freight cars in two weeks did you? I forgot to mention the 200 passenger cars.....
Sheldon .... You make a good point. Those of us who have been in the hobby for a lifetime, have accumulated sizable fleets of locomotives and cars.
Some of the trains no longer being used can be sold, and funds used for trains which fit into the current theme.
You are right about Kadee couplers. The cheap plastic couplers don't last long.
Regarding trucks, I have some old sprung trucks, but my experiences with new quality trucks with free-rolling metal wheels have been good too.
Those just joining the hobby should start small, and a small switching layout is a great starting point. Simple layouts can be expanded and sometimes evolve into large layouts when available resources allow it.
My current layout was started when after moving to this house in 2001. The layout is built one section at a time. This allowed me to operate trains early on completed sections with scenery. I don't like looking at just boards and track.
I converted to DCC about 4 years ago, and I'm pleased with it.
richhotrain For some reason, Lifschultz seemed to be closely associated with the Erie RR. Rich
Lifschultz handled almost all the Import business from Europe that was shipped by ship to this country, mainly clothing. Off loaded from ship to boxcar, sent by rail to Chicago to those freight houses and off loaded to the trucks/trailers that were backed into the doors on the other side of the building. Called cross docking and delivered by truck to all consignees downtown and all over Chicago and some out of state, delivered by truck. Marshall Fields and many other big business, used their own trucks to pick-up from those freight house's. I watched them do it. Working on the docks was a very good paying job back then.
The hardest part about scratch building that structure, will be cutting out all the windows and doors. So start looking into some good cutting tools, like inside corner cutting punches and such.
Model Railroading, on the cheap.
Got to have a plan and what to include on your layout.
Research: It's cheap, looking for idea's for free. Lot of free info out there....if You take the time to look. Might learn more than You thought.
Edit: Some pic's and info about the Erie Railroad and Lifschultz:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Lifschultz+Fast+Freight+Chicago+Images&espv=2&biw=1024&bih=653&tbm=isch&tbo
Sheldon, I did not know that you've been building model railroads for 47 years, I also don't know why you would think we should care!
Although not specifically pointed at beginners, this thread would be a very good place for them to start. Anyone who has been involved in model railroading for just a few short years hardly needs your; or, my help on how to stretch their hobby dollars.
The hobby, is what it is! The model railroading public has demanded the products that sell big in the market today, meaning highly detailed, RTR stuff that costs more than I (and maybe you) are willing to pay.
Many times out at the R/C flying people have come up to me and ask how much it costs to get into R/C. When I outline how much it costs to get into the hobby, they may well say: "Well, I could never afford that!" Then I ask them if they fish? Being from Minnesota, there is a very strong possibility that they do! Then I ask how much money they have tied up in boat, motor, trailer, rods, reels, tackle, license, motels and travel costs and it becomes very clear to them, that I am involved in the cheaper activitiy!
NP2626 Sheldon, I did not know that you've been building model railroads for 47 years, I also don't know why you would think we should care! Although not specifically pointed at beginners, this thread would be a very good place for them to start. Anyone who has been involved in model railroading for just a few short years hardly needs your; or, my help on how to stretch their hobby dollars. The hobby, is what it is! The model railroading public has demanded the products that sell big in the market today, meaning highly detailed, RTR stuff that costs more than I (and maybe you) are willing to pay. I really don’t feel I was criticizing you. You simply appeared to me to have missed the point of this thread! If talking about needing 100s of locomotives doesn’t scare people off, then I don’t know what will. Many times out at the R/C flying people have come up to me and ask how much it costs to get into R/C. When I outline how much it costs to get into the hobby, they may well say: "Well, I could never afford that!" Then I ask them if they fish? Being from Minnesota, there is a very strong possibility that they do! Then I ask how much money they have tied up in boat, motor, trailer, rods, reels, tackle, license, motels and travel costs and it becomes very clear to them, that I am involved in the cheaper activitiy! Best wishes!
My point about the size of my locomotive fleet was that if one does decide to build a larger layout, choices can be made so that every loco need not cost $350 - like so many today do.
As to how long I have been in the hobby, it simply speaks to the fact that I did not accumulate this much stuff in just a few years.
To expalin just a little further, Pulling long trains requires more power. The typical train on my layout is pulled by a three or four unit diesel lashup or by double or triple headed steam - average train 3 powered units x 30 staged trains = 90 locos, plus some switchers, self propelled passenger equipment and spares for operational power changes =120 powered units.
So in my "counting", an ABBA lashup is 4 locos, not one. No different than four GP7's on the head end is also 4 locos.
So you could say I only have locos for about 35 or 40 "trains".
Not really that many for a layout that can run 5 trains independently at once and can run 8 trains at the same time with a full crew.
I have my share of high priced RTR, and I build advanced craftsman kits, and everything in between - but again, for ME, not every piece needs to have "museum" level detail.
Another great deal, if you are into using your computer to modify photo graphs, make signs, make textures like brick and stone, make logos or do jsut about any kind of image manipulation.
Program is called GIMP. It's free. It runs on XP and later. It is extremely powerful. Anything you can do in Photoshop you can do with GIMP. It will enlarge, shrink, rotate, crop, adjust color and contrast, merge images (add smoke to a steamer's stack) and correct perspective. It will take a slant wise shot, and make it into a straight on broadside view. I was able take a tiny bit of stone wall, replicate it, and merge all the replicas together giving me a big piece of stone wall to use on a foundation.
Two gotcha's. The built in documentation sucks. I have not been able to find a decent bit of documation on the Internet. There is stuff out there, but it all tends to lead off with technical nouns such as "layer" or "alpha channel" with out defining them. The other is GIMP doesn't know how to work the printer on XP. You can do better by saving the image out to disk from GIMP, and printing it using Microsoft Paint.
But the price is right.
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
If Sheldon is building a layout at the 'lower middle class' expense level, I'm doing something very similar at the 'abject poverty' level.
I own about half as much motive power as he does. Equipping each unit with the least expensive of non-sound decoders would cost me more than it cost me to buy them.
I don't have sprung trucks - but my trucks are equalized. The sideframes can pivot on the shouldered screws that hold them to the bolster. As for wheels, try RP25 nickel silver on needle-point steel axles running in metal journal boxes - standard for Japanese products when I bought them.
My electrical system is similar to, but not the same as, Sheldon's. One operator can run several trains (some in a 'fire and forget' mode) or a crew can operate their trains by signal while the CTC op routes power and throws most switches. Or a single operator can walk along with a single train, swapping off to run sequence style with the fast clock off. Most of the parts I need (wire, toggle and slide switches etc.) were acquired as salvage many moons ago. I fabricate terminal blocks from machine screws, nuts and washers mounted on (through) scrap styrene or plywood - at about 1/100 the cost per wire connection of the store-bought variety (and infinitely more dependable than suitcase connectors.)
Since I consider freight cars simply as markers in the game of car distribution I don't want fussy little detail parts that can get damaged easily. Most of my roster consists of little tin boxes shaped like freight cars, purchased 3 for $5 equivalent in Yen. Their Kadees cost more than the cars did.
I do own some 'better' items - mostly fancy passenger equipment and a few modern (in 1964) freight wagons. Also, my locomotives, while inexpensive, are brass and have detailing comparable to contemporary PFM products.
The one thing I really save on is specialwork - I build my own from raw rail on wood ties, and move points with ancient KTM twin-coil machines or electrical switches acting as manual levers, connected by linkages including such exotic materials as paperclips, fishing line, expended ball pen cartridges (remember when they were brass?) and stripped automotive nuts. The miniature screweyes I use to guide the fishing line are the most expensive parts!
So, how big is my model empire. It's gradually using up all the floor space of a double garage, can handle two dozen freights (short trains of short cars) and the frenetic passenger traffic that ran on my prototype (JNR Chu-o--Nishi Hon Sen) in September of 1964. As far as I can determine, that's as much as I want or need.
[Not being a saint, I also have my 'collection' of a half-dozen US prototype steam locos (all of which I saw in revenue service) and a GG1 (ditto,) as well as a few US pattern freight cars decalled for clubs I once belonged to. They get to run on April Fool's Day and Halloween.]
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - inexpensively)
If any reader of this post is interested and has access to back isssue's of MR, from 35 plus years back, a colume that was a regular was called "Dollar Model" and or something close to this name. Just like Spike and Moe.
Slept a few times since and ate a chicken or two since.
The back issues of MR of this age range, are a excellent source of budget modeling, not like we see in the current MR.
Not everyone has a unlimited source of extra income and or the sky is the limit financial abilities.
With this said, new copies of back isssue of MR, some going back to around 1970, are still available from Kalmbach.
Some of the larger public libraries in Our Nation, have bound issues of the magazine and may have same now electroniclly, you know, the computer format.
If you are fortunate to reside in a area of the Country, which has a annual train show, this is another source for back issues.
But again, not everone resides in areas, where train shows are held annually. It's fine if you do, bad if you do not.
Not your fault, nor mine... That's the way it is...
Anyhow this leeds to another thought.
Reminds me of comments in this forum... as... on Athearn Blue Box availabilty and E-Bay bidding!, Examples let's say.
Bidding?
What are we general contractors bidding on building projects?
Shame, we do not have a web-site for these goodies, where, this is my fair market price, if interested, please forward payment.
With this,my comments are sure too do the following...
Incoming!
This is a great thread, so many good ideas and tips. Here are a few more:
Many hobby products are simply repackaged from other sources.
Use 0-20 weight oil instead of "hobby lubes". Same cSt viscosity value and you can buy a quart for the price of a ounce.
Use white lithium grease w/ptfe instead of "hobby grease". Same thing but you get a large tube for the price of a tiny tube.
3M super weatherstrip adhesive. Same as wathers goo except you get a large tube instead of a tiny one.
Buy 2/56 screws in bulk online or from a nut/bolt company and save tons over the small hobby packs. Same with LEDs and resistors.
Jim
Run Eight,
You ran up the flag. I'm saluting.
An awful lot of what I know about the almost-lost art of scratchbuilding came from building Dollar Models - or using those techniques to build what I DID want.
All of those articles (and a lot of other stuff) are on the 75 years of Model Railroader DVDs - and well worth the price. The only reason I never bought them is the shelves above this desk - holding almost every issue, and everything issued since.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with MR copies that were old in 1964)
zstripe richhotrain For some reason, Lifschultz seemed to be closely associated with the Erie RR. Rich Lifschultz handled almost all the Import business from Europe that was shipped by ship to this country, mainly clothing.
Lifschultz handled almost all the Import business from Europe that was shipped by ship to this country, mainly clothing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/7547061@N02/6434346337/
LION builds subway trains. Everybody knows LION builds subways.
Subways have pillars. Everybody knows subways have pillars, just like Ruffles have ridges!
LION build tunnel structirue with 1/16th inch welding rod. Comes a one pound tube for under six dollars, about 30 pieces. LION uses Coffee Stirrers, buy at Walmart 200 for a dollar or so.
The steel rod exdentds into the table, it is soldered at the base of the construction to keep things stable, Poke hole with awl into sub road bed, poke hole with awl into wall. insert base into hole in roadbed, push extra rod (top) into hole in wall. Paint bare metal, ad top to the tunnel. It is good enough.
If not is good enough then you are obviously rich enough to hire a professional model builder, or have the money time and patience to do it your self.
LIONS are not known for patience. Good enough is good enough, purrfect is a pain in the tail.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
LIONS build Subways
Subways have Signals. Lots and Lots of Signals.
LION must havbe lots and lots of cheap signals.
See how good it looks:
richhotrain zstripe richhotrain For some reason, Lifschultz seemed to be closely associated with the Erie RR. Rich Lifschultz handled almost all the Import business from Europe that was shipped by ship to this country, mainly clothing. Frank, here is the Lifschultz trucking facility at the Erie RR freight house at 16th and Clark, just south of that C&EI freight house in my photo. https://www.flickr.com/photos/7547061@N02/6434346337/ Rich
Frank, here is the Lifschultz trucking facility at the Erie RR freight house at 16th and Clark, just south of that C&EI freight house in my photo.
Yep! That's the one I'm referring to. That's Canal St., the overpass in the distance is Roosevelt Rd. Back in it's hey-day, about every dock door had a trailer or truck in it. Was in that joint many times, in the early 50's with My Dad and Uncle who drove for R&V Cartage, exclusively for Spiegal catalog warehouse. Memories
Frank, I just read where Lifschultz fronted the freight houses from 14th Street to 16th Street. So, I'll bet you were right about being in that C&EI freight house as a kid. The Lifschultz trucks worked the docks on the Clark Street side of the freight house.
Hello All,
Back to the topic at hand...
Doing it on the cheap!
The parent company of my railroad is The Consolidated Materials Group.
That means I look for items that can be re-purposed on the railroad.
I make my rolling stock out of ice cream sticks; available at some home improvement stores as “Hobby Supplies.” They also offer tongue depressors that don’t need to be sanitized.
I bought 1,000 5.5” wooden stir sticks for various projects from rolling stock to buildings.
For car weights- -cold rolled metal stock from you local hardware store and some double sided carpet tape works well. If you know any metal workers or welders ask for scraps.
I use BB's when I need to fine-tune the final weight of cars.
Water towers are constructed from various items such as Vienna sausage cans to mixed nut containers. Silos have been re-purposed liquor bottle sleeves. If your a fan of bake your own cinnamon rolls the sleeve and divider that some brands come packaged in make great storage tanks.
My wife works in the veterinary field and has supplied tubing and various fittings.
If you know or are a cyclist or paint ball enthusiast spent CO2 cartridges can be used in many applications from flatbed loads to industrial buildings.
Never underestimate the venerable PVC pipe. I’ve made everything from culverts to flat ended tankers, to refuelling facilities and of course flatcar or gondola loads.
Tire valve stem caps, available at auto parts stores, make great domes for tanker cars.
I’ve also used lip balm containers as removable domes for larger tankers. Drill a hole the approximate size of the lip balm container in a length of PVC. Cap the ends of the pipe with styrene and file/sand smooth the ends. Trim the lip balm container to just fit into the hole. Epoxy or CA the tube in place just below where the cap fits on. Sand, prime, paint and finish the tank and viola!
Dowels can be painted to resemble anything from sewer pipes to logs. Speaking of log loads...don’t be afraid to cut small branches from your trees and trim to fit your scale.
I haven’t even touched on electrical components and wiring that can be salvaged and re-purposed.
Hopefully this will help and get the post back on track...uh yeah!
Do it on the cheap!
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
richhotrain Frank, I just read where Lifschultz fronted the freight houses from 14th Street to 16th Street. So, I'll bet you were right about being in that C&EI freight house as a kid. The Lifschultz trucks worked the docks on the Clark Street side of the freight house. Rich
I believe You may be confusing Clark st. and Canal st. Canal st. bordered the rail yard on the west side of all the freight and passenger yards east to Lumber st. After lumber st, came the South Chgo river on the east side of the river was Clark st. with only two tracks on the west side of Clark. Look up Rooseveldt Rd. and Canal on Google and You'll see what I mean.
duplicate post
zstripe Yep! That's the one I'm referring to. That's Canal St., the overpass in the distance is Roosevelt Rd.
Yep! That's the one I'm referring to. That's Canal St., the overpass in the distance is Roosevelt Rd.
Frank. that's Clark Street, just to the east of the Rock Island tracks.
Canal Street is west of the Chicago River.
It's been fun reading some of these comments, takes me back to my "yout" in suburban Chicago (that railroadin' town) and the layout my dad built fold down benchwork for. It folded down from a frame on the wall, Murphy bed style, and though I had to remove the cars and locos from it, prior to folding it up, it was a great layout. Just the other day I bought a new can of Barbasol shaving cream (yep, just like Dad used) and upon taking off the protective cover from the nozzle button I recalled using that little part in several ways on my childhood layout. I think I made an army tank turret out of some, and ventilators for industrial buildings from others.
One comment regarding CAD programs for scratchbuilding though. I'm self taught in AutoCad and though I've gotten reasonably good at it, the real timesaving feature of it is the ability to copy, modify and duplicate drawings. Having learned drafting in High School, using CAD hasn't made the process that much quicker for a single drawing and will never substitute for the quick sketches I use as a machinist on some small jobs. If you need to change or modify the drawing though, what a benefit! There are some really good free CAD programs out there in the interwebs, but the learning curve can be dauntingly steep. I would encourage people to try them out, but it would be helpful to learn some basic isometric sketching techniques first. You don't need artistic talent (thank heavens) but isometric sketching helps you learn proportions and lays the foundation for CAD work. Just don't get so wrapped up in CAD you forget to build something.....
Kudos to Steven for opening this thread up, and I realize the narrow line he has to walk. His advertisers help keep the bills paid and they depend on our purchases, but at the same time he's trying to fill the need for a less expensive approach to the hobby. As in so much of life, it's all about balance.
Now get out there and hack away at something. Experience builds skills and skills build more satisfactory experiences. Happy modelling all.......
Lou
EDIT:
Post deleted - off topic.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!