rrinker Funny how everyone loves to hate PayPal. I don;t see why, I've used it for eyars and never had a single problem. I know people would try to get around auction fees by selling a $20 item for $1 and then charging $24 shipping, but I thought they cracked down on that one a long time ago. And if someone bid the $1 item up to $20 and still paid $24 shipping - well, a fool and his money. --Randy
Funny how everyone loves to hate PayPal. I don;t see why, I've used it for eyars and never had a single problem.
I know people would try to get around auction fees by selling a $20 item for $1 and then charging $24 shipping, but I thought they cracked down on that one a long time ago. And if someone bid the $1 item up to $20 and still paid $24 shipping - well, a fool and his money.
--Randy
The thing with PayPal is that it's a simple and effective way to pay a buyer and as a seller to recive guaranteed payment.
Up until a few months ago, I would have championed PayPl to the bitter end. I had always enjoyed a very satisfactory experience with them. An then one day it all turned to broken glass and the sharks began to circle. There was a misunderstanding on the part of all three parties involved - the buyer and the seller were prepared to reach an amicable agreement that would have seen the sale finalized to each others satisfaction. Then PayPal steped in and made a mountain out of a mole hill. They lacked any clear understanding of the situation they became involved in - their customer relations people were either pre-programed by an android or just wanted to be plain obtuse and un-helpful.
In the end, their interference and list of almost impossible demands for identification of the two interested parties and written verification of the items original purchase prior to it's listing on eBay saw this matter tumble headlong into an abyss of black tar and feathers. Like many entities, PayPal are just fine when all is going well and is a matter of routine, but when something happens that requires somebody in paypal to use even a small portion of their brain it becomes similar to the process of mud wrestling an eel.
A few weeks ago, I saw listed on eBay a poster of two SAL locomotives operating a phospahte train in Florida. The opening bid of .99 was a steel if I could get the poster at the price. However, and with reference to your point, Randy, the shipping amount was $34.00. Eventually the poster sold for six bucks or something. But there you have an example of how one person trys to manipulate eBay to make a bit extra money.
I've noticed that many sellers in China do, or have done, the same kind of thing on eBay
Cheers
Bruce
I have no problem with this has I only pay if its Pay pal
It's your choice to use it or not. No one is being forced to use Ebay or PP.
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Funny how everyone loves to hate PayPal. I don;t see why, I've used it for eyars and never had a single problem. The fee? Guess what, EVERY merchant who accept credit cards pays a fee like that. That's why some try to set minimum order requirements, even though the credit card companies generally don't allow it. On a small transaction, say less than $5, the credit card fees when you pay that person with a card eats most if not all of the seller's profit. When the individual used PayPal, they see the same thing any merchant running a store on any street or in any mall sees.
Every time I sell something on eBay, I specify PayPal. And when the auction closes, I usually have my money in a day or two, and can ship out right away. I NEVER accept personal checks - not only does paying with check give you no recompense if the seller doesn;t ship, but if I accept a check and put it in my bank and the person has written me a bad check, I'M the one who gets charges for it!
eBay has made some big changes over the years, and alot of them are stinkers, like the change in the feedback system. It needed change to prevent abuse, but they made it virtually useless. This particular change to no checks is not even in the same ballpark. Bonus for free shipping is not a good idea. And limits on shipping fees I don't particularly think is needed. I just never would bid on things with crazy shipping fees - if someone wasn't paying attention, well, too bad I guess. There's more than enough nanny attitude in this society, we don't really need more. I know people would try to get around auction fees by selling a $20 item for $1 and then charging $24 shipping, but I thought they cracked down on that one a long time ago. And if someone bid the $1 item up to $20 and still paid $24 shipping - well, a fool and his money.
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
I've seen extensive threads over ebay on MANY forums lately, and I always get a chuckle out of all the posts by those who don't know how to work the system !
Want a guaranteed way of protecting your financial information ? - simple .... Open another checking account at your bank and keep the minimum funding in it - less than $100 usually. To be able to make and receive instant paypal payments, you need to have your paypal account linked to your credit card. Don't want your credit card information on file at Paypal ? - simple .... right after you create your account (or any time for that matter), call your bank and tell them you lost your credit card - the bank will cancel the card and issue a new one. As long as you don't pay your paypal purchases through your credit card, Paypal never knows the card has been cancelled, you can still send and receive payments immediately.
As for ebay "forcing" you to use Paypal or "forcing" you to use a higher class of shipping - do any of you guys actually contact the seller ? Ebay cannot force you to use the methods of payment and shipping they give you. If you you and the seller / buyer agree offline to pay by check or money order, then that's how you pay. You and the buyer / seller can also agree as to how you want to ship it as well - offline. If both of you agree, you could have it shipped by pack-mule if you want !
How has it come to be that everyone is so up in arms over these Ebay "rules" ? Granted, these rules are being made to give the buyer / seller the utmost protection in their online transaction - which it does .... but you are by no means bound by them ! Just remember, if you opt to deal with the buyer / seller outside of Ebay's recommended practices, you won't be as protected, if at all, in case something goes awry. I've had numerous sellers approximate the postage to Canada, put some stamps on the package and just toss it in the post box - with no customs documentation what-so-ever .... I've received every one !
It all comes down to how willing you are to work outside the system. Are you a gambler with your purchases or not ? If you are, contact the seller and continue to pay by check or money order and go for the cheap shipping .... if anything happens, are you willing to just chalk it up to experience ? If so, go for it. Not a gambler ? - then follow ebay's rules .... they're put in place for a reason, not because they want to make things difficult.
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
Another money grubbing tactic of ebay is forcing sellers to use only one type of USPS mailing. I used the USPS site to see a 1 pound item sent to Canada by 1st class mail Int'l package is $4.76. Ebay (or the seller) now use Priority mail Int'l flat rate box and charge $15.00. Since when is a certified money order not a method of payment, seems most sellers prefer them as they are redeemable the same day. I will not buy from vendors that accept only paypal.
Remember the adage, "thems that own the company makes the rules"? Well, it applies. But since I don't buy from vendors that don't accept Paypal, it doesn't affect me either.
Marlon
See pictures of the Clinton-Golden Valley RR
Heartland Division CB&Q Ebay has created problems for itself, its customers, and its investors. (I invest in railroads. Returns are significant for railroads in recent years.) I would like to see constructive suggestions instead of jugmental remarks.
Ebay has created problems for itself, its customers, and its investors.
(I invest in railroads. Returns are significant for railroads in recent years.)
I would like to see constructive suggestions instead of jugmental remarks.
I don't know how much money your wife has invested in order to actually have any sort of leverage on ebay, but maybe just a well worded letter to the CEO or whoever is in charge to voice her concern might get the wheels moving in the right direction.
TONY
"If we never take the time, how can we ever have the time." - Merovingian (Matrix Reloaded)
loatharJust another scam to make you use THEIR bank.They've lost my business...
Dr. Frankendiesel aka Scott Running BearSpace Mouse for president!15 year veteran fire fighterCollector of Apple //e'sRunning Bear EnterprisesHistory Channel Club life member.beatus homo qui invenit sapientiam
No more checks or money orders bothers me somewhat:
A quote from the site...On eBay.com over 90% of transactions are paid with online payment methods and the use of offline paper methods has declined by 40% over the last 3 years.
On eBay.com over 90% of transactions are paid with online payment methods and the use of offline paper methods has declined by 40% over the last 3 years.
I guess you can't stop progress.
Bob Berger, C.O.O. N-ovation & Northwestern R.R. My patio layout....SEE IT HERE
There's no place like ~/ ;)
The last time I sold something to someone in Canada, it raised my fee by 8.00 because of the extra postage. There went 1/2 of my profit. Not to mention the extra b.s. paperwork at the post office. No more sales to Canada for me.
The last time I bought something from someone in Canada it cost me 10.50 for shipping for a 16.95 item. Why would I want to waste my money like that?
N Scale Diesels......I like 'em
dinwitty-States pretty clearly in the new rules that money orders and checks are ONLY permitted for high $$$ items like cars/boats/trailers/real estate.http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/accepted-payments-policy.html(down towards bottom.)
Just another scam to make you use THEIR bank.They've lost my business...
I emailed a vendor and they replied that EBAY can NOT refuse other methods of payment like money orders. They have a setting for an item "OTHER" "PICKUP ONLY", its pretty obvious to me their pushing the paypal is their promoting the paypal. So often when you buy an item and it had paypal or money order set that to get to the money order setting you HAD to click away from the paypal default setting. The new setup is another rather forced way to promote PayPal and the vendors are not allowed to promote other pay methods. Buyers should contact the vendor if they will accept money orders. I reccomend for buyers if they might accept other payments to have pickup set so the buyer can bid without paypal. I recall trying to bid on an item and it refused me because I don't have paypay setup, and I dont. I have no credit cards which is required for paypal. I don't want the easiness of someone stealing a credit card number off of me. phooey.
Life may be full of runt sellers or buyers, but I had success with money orders.
I think its rather bad business practice what they have done.
I have been selling on Ebay for over 10 years; done more than 600 sales; 100% satisfaction rate.
The first two years I ran a hobby shop; the last 8 years I have been slowly selling off inventory after I closed the retail portion. I have no expectations of selling anything at big profits. Most times, I start items at $0.99, with no reserve, and let the auction take its course. I am happy if I get what I paid, wholesale. I ship everything USPS priority mail, with delivery confirmation.
I am not happy at the changes at ebay. I can live with the Paypal only, although I have accepted money orders in the past. My observation is that about 25% of folks who pay with a money order have to be prompted to send a money order; whereas most folks pay with Paypal quickly. As I use the USPS automated postal center; I have literally shipped items within an hour of an auction end because someone paid me via Paypal.
What gripes me is that I can no longer give accurate feedback to someone who stiffs me. I have had four buyers not pay me in the last year. I didn't ship, but there is no way to warn other sellers. Yes, they get a "strike", but I believe a honest feedback reflecting actual events is more fair to all parties involved.
Sellers pay all the fees on ebay. One can argue that buyers are paying the fees, because they are the ones paying for merchandise, but the fees are netted out of receipts going to the seller. For a seller, it doesn't make much sense to sell an engine that costs $56.00 ($100 retail) in an auction for $50.00; netting about $44.00 after all the fees associated with Ebay and Paypal. That is assuming shipping costs are charged at actual cost. But wait, Ebay wants sellers to offer free shipping; so deduct another $8.00 for Priority Mail with delivery confirmation. Pretty raw deal. Yes, I know you can do a "Buy it now" at a higher price, but there is no assurance that those will sell at a higher price.
Factor in time. It takes a lot of time to run ebay auctions. Taking pictures; accurately describing the item; uploading pictures; storing merchandise; arranging boxes and packing materials. At auction end; invoicing, securing payment, and packing the merchandise. In my case, taking the package to the post office. Conservatively, I spend at least an hour on each and every item I list. I do try to pack my boxes well; I use bubble wrap, peanuts, grocery sacks (cheap, light filler) or a combination of all to safe pack. I have not had 1 item damaged in 10 years (although 2 boxes were damaged). What is your time worth? If I still had a retail shop, I would be paying someone to run the auction; I paid my help $7 an hour. So the net gets smaller....
I haven't closed my accounts, but I haven't sold anything on ebay in over 3 months. That is probably bad, because most of the stuff I sell is brand new, and somebody gets a bargain. And when something sells at a premium, I add extra stuff to make up the difference.
I bet some of the gaming of the shipping charges would come down if they enforced their rules and did not take paypal fees for the shipping charges. I started using flat rate boxes from the post office because it let me just list the shipping cost right out. The boxes don't cost me anything. I still take a small hit on shipping from paypal taking their cut for the transaction, even though it is broken out in their form. I can even see some sellers upping the cost of shipping a $1 for packing materials. I can live with that.
At first I was a bit disturbed by the whole no checks thing. But I am starting to come around. Using a credit card is not free to the retailer. They pay a fee plus a percentage of each charge. Lets the retailer get their money faster. They know right away the money is there. Same with Paypal.
I set up a Paypal account so I could take credit card payments. When I did the number of bids I got shot up. So did the final bid values. Ebay takes another $0.10. Same with Paypal. I am still ahead.
Still rubs me a little the wrong way that they are forbidding checks and money orders. Maybe they are tired of all the little old ladies and others who get ripped off when they get a money order for an extra $1000 and asking to send the difference back to them complaining all the time.
If your Paypal account gets hacked, exactly how is it different from getting your bank account hacked? Same problem. Same path to resolution. Don't keep lots of money in it. Paypal pays interest on accounts with $250 or more in them. Not a lot, but comparable to the big bank savings account. And it is available for instant use. More online retailers are adding the Paypal option all the time. I've seen one post here, and just seeing the two subjects together may finally get me to buy his videos, now that I have sold some stuff on EBay.
If you are selling and losing money on EBay you are doing it wrong. You need to reconsider what you are doing. If they are constantly cancelling your auctions you need to either better explain the shipping charges in the listing or figure out a higher cost for your opening bid to cover the increased cost to you.
I actually enjoy getting items online at the retailers or through my local hobby shops. Both of them are very good, first class and usually can get it for you. I cannot ask for any better.
When I learned to get OOP items direct using the stock numbers or factory numbers of the OOP item in question basically Ebay was out of consideration for me at that point. No longer any need to snipe or fight 10 people in the last 3 seconds on something that still costs 35 dollars somewhere with no tax.
Ebay for me has passed into memory. Im just glad I had a good run and good fortune finding homes for the train stuff.
Put me in that category as well. I have over 300 E-bay purchases and do not do business with any seller that does not take PayPal. It is the only way to go.
"LOOK" "BID" "BUY" "PAY" all from the old Puter, then just wait for the postman.
Thats my worth and just try and get a commission on that !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My only beef is with a few sellers who block our bids from Canada. You people really need to get into the real world. I.O.W. "Get a LIfe" or at least learn how to check feedback.
Johnboy out..........
from Saskatchewan, in the Great White North..
We have met the enemy, and he is us............ (Pogo)
From my perspective, eBay has become increasingly user-unfriendly for years now.
I used to use eBay to sell off unneeded items to someone who might have a use for them. Now I just put the stuff on the front lawn with a sign that says, "Free."
Craig
DMW
shawnee wrote: Ok, here's an example...checked out some cool out of production Ortner cars tosay on e-Bay, reasonable price at $30 bucks....then you go in and they want $14 for shipping and handling! Ridiculous. As a buyer, I'm glad E-bay is creating some standards for shipping cost gouging.
Ok, here's an example...checked out some cool out of production Ortner cars tosay on e-Bay, reasonable price at $30 bucks....then you go in and they want $14 for shipping and handling! Ridiculous. As a buyer, I'm glad E-bay is creating some standards for shipping cost gouging.
This has been a long-time method os sellers to circumvent some of ebay's final value fees. The seller really wants $40 for the item with $4 to ship, but by wording it that way, they save the final value fees on that $10. No matter how it's worded, you are still going to pay $44 to that seller. Asian electronics sellers are great for this - I've bought LEDs for $1.00 for 100, but the shipping was $13.75 .... still a good deal IMHO, but they are only paying final value fees on the one dollar. These are the things ebay will be attempting to stop.
Ultimately, we will see shipping costs come down to what they should be, BUT - the price of the item itself will go up even more as the seller attempts to compensate also for the increased fees.
Alco .. we do not make a profit on S&H.
Ebay makes more on its fees on many of our items than my wife makes selling them. Their fees are excessive.
She has helped several friends start with ebay, and has done a lot to foster more business for ebay. also, she invested in the company.
In return they act like bullies and lie to her. There have been other listings cancelled for false reasons not pertaining to S&H.
Stop jumping to conclusions.
Again, ebay needs competition.
Many other model railroaders have expressed disatisfaction with ebay.
I'm posting this to benefit other model railroaders who may need to buy and sell used trains.
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: You're from the bay area, and you like ebay. Is that a clue?
You're from the bay area, and you like ebay. Is that a clue?
It might come as a surprise to those in Kentucky, but not everyone in the bay area works for eBay. I've bought and sold on eBay a couple of hundered times. No other conenction. It's not perfect, but it works. It's the biggest market out there for pre-owned and out of production HO stuff, so I use it.
You don't have to.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: When we sell valuable items, we use more expensive packing materials and premium shipping services. Our flat fee for S&H exceeds their arbitrary boundaries and they cancel the listings.
When we sell valuable items, we use more expensive packing materials and premium shipping services. Our flat fee for S&H exceeds their arbitrary boundaries and they cancel the listings.
Right. You're not charging excessive S&H to increase your profit by avoid paying eBay fees -- you're just misunderstood.
In any case, got nothing to do with train stuff.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: Their fees (selling and paypal) are excessive and often amount to about 15% of the buyers total cost. All of that for just a few bytes in their computers
Their fees (selling and paypal) are excessive and often amount to about 15% of the buyers total cost. All of that for just a few bytes in their computers
I don't see how that can be except on things that cost a dollar or two. But I'm not the expert some are at gaming eBay fees.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: My wife's investment in the company stock has detriorated. The total return on Eaby stock in past twelve months is negative -33%.
My wife's investment in the company stock has detriorated. The total return on Eaby stock in past twelve months is negative -33%.
Yeah, my Intel stock is down about the same amount. I'm just sure its due to eBay not taking money orders.
I do get it. eBay doesn't let you play the game you want to with S&H and you're ticked off. Doesn't mean eBay doesn't work fine for others. Now that I understand your axe to grind I won't waste any more of your time. Rave on, brother.
Ebay is nit picking shipping costs and canceling listings. They send messages saying the tried calling on us on the phone which is a false statement. Ebay is not honest in that regard.
Ebay's changes evidently are not good for either its customers or its invetors.
They need some competition.
Yes, Amazon has much less HO. You can find non-HO trains in Ebay's HO category, also.
Currently, Amazon sellers have a good selection of Rapido passenger cars.
Ebay needs at least one strong competetor. It would be good see Amazon expand its service for the used trains market.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: The idea of Kalmbach being involved with internet auctions may have some merit.
The idea of Kalmbach being involved with internet auctions may have some merit.
Maybe not to Kalmbach, since that would put them in direct competition with many of the retailers and etailers that advdrtise in the magazine and on this site.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote:Perhaps, Kalmbach should have a joint venture with Amazon or some other large internet company. Currently Amazon has about 4,000 HO items VS. Ebay currently having about 23,000 HO items.
Perhaps, Kalmbach should have a joint venture with Amazon or some other large internet company. Currently Amazon has about 4,000 HO items VS. Ebay currently having about 23,000 HO items.
Thats apples to oranges. I took a look at the first few pages of Amazon's "HO" listings. Some of them are for Lionel fastrack, which is O. I guess maybe if your doing broad gauge. Some Thomas the Tank Engine. Soem books, eBay has a separate category. And nearly all the rest were just listings by etailers I already know about and can shop at directly at the same price. Lots of listings by Horizon Hobbies (Athearn distributor) at what looked like list price. Very little or none of the pre-owned and out of production items most of use eBay for.
You don't want to use eBay, fine. But amazon is no better and in some ways worse than just dealing with the etailers directly.
Oh and how are you guys gonna used your beloved money orders with amazon? Homey don't play that.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: I may try selling Railroad books on Amazon to try the mout for selling.
I may try selling Railroad books on Amazon to try the mout for selling.
Good luck. Take a good look at their fees and recognize that they dictate the amount you can charge for shipping, sometimes less than it will cost you.
Heartland Division CBQ wrote: Today, Ebay's "gestapo" cancelled yet another of my wife's listings without any valid reason other than to extort more fees.
Today, Ebay's "gestapo" cancelled yet another of my wife's listings without any valid reason other than to extort more fees.
Whatever, dude. Reminds me of the guy who was on here complaining a few years ago that eBay froze his account "for no reason". Somebody on here investigated and discovered that the guy had retracted something like 32 committed bids. Yeah, no reason.
I don't know, I have made it a practice to never buy from anyone I can't check on or know personally, and I have never lost any money or anything else. Of course, my attitude means I don't do Ebay, and somehow I have managed to live quite well for many years without Ebay.
It is a matter of choice, if you want to get bargains, sometimes you have to pay the price. I just choose not to.
Bob
The idea of Kalmbach being involved with internet auctions may have some merit. Perhaps, Kalmbach should have a joint venture with Amazon or some other large internet company. Currently Amazon has about 4,000 HO items VS. Ebay currently having about 23,000 HO items.
We already have an Amazon account, and if I find the HO item I want there I'm not doing ebay. Amazon is fixed price, but the prices look reasonable for some items I saw. I may try selling Railroad books on Amazon to try the mout for selling.
I for one will support a simple want/swap or shipping by money order only kind of thing for unwanted train items.
If Ebay fails the Model Railroaders because of these changes, I think there is a oppertunity to set up a good clean sub site dedicated to helping model railroaders dispose of unwanted trains.
Otherwise the unwanted trains might go into the trash. It's that simple.
Mark R. wrote:I belong to other model railroad forums that also have BUY / SELL / TRADE / WANT section. Seeing as how this is one of the busier model railroad forums on the net, I think it would be a good venue for us to use (?) All we need to do is convince the mods to create a sub-section for us to use as such.Mark.
I belong to other model railroad forums that also have BUY / SELL / TRADE / WANT section. Seeing as how this is one of the busier model railroad forums on the net, I think it would be a good venue for us to use (?) All we need to do is convince the mods to create a sub-section for us to use as such.
I would somewhat like Mark's idea, but I'm sure Trains doesn't want to expose themselves to the potential liability if someone gets burned, so at a minimum, I figure they will post a BIG disclaimer about not warranteeing anything sold here. I agree that I'm not fond of eBay's changes lately (especially the push for PayPal, for whom I have no lost love whatsoever, but that's another topic of its own...), but on the plus side, at least on eBay there is supposedly some recourse for the buyer if the seller doesn't live up to their description or is exceptionally slow in sending out the goods.
If there would be a place which had some clout to enforce/kick out/take action against the few unscrupulous sellers/buyers quickly and fairly, I'd love to find another place to compete against eBay as an auction site. Otherwise, if eBay continues to deteriorate, I'll be limited to train shows (and hope an item runs, if it's say an engine) or onlin not-so-LHS's for the occasional item that's out of production that I would like.
Of course, there's also the whole 'pre-order and/or pay in advance' trend with manufacturers, another potential for me...
Jim in Cape Girardeau (stepping down from the soapbox now...)
I decided to post on this thread because it looks like a rant about ebay.
I've been disturbed by the new ebay rules and many of the changes the company has been making. I sometimes use my wife's ebay account to buy and sell model trains on ebay, and have have had some of the same kinds of problems expressed in this thread.
After Meg Whitman retired as CEO of Ebay, the company is falling apart. My wife owns shares of Ebay stock and her investemnt has a negative total return of -33% in the past 12 months.
Ebay is losing money for its stockholders.
Next, they've screwed around with rules as has been described in other posts on this threa.
Lately, Ebay has been using its "gestapo" to cancel some of my wife's listings arbitrarilly based upon Ebay's ever changing guidlines and rules. She feels she has lost sales becasue of Ebay's strong arm tactics.
I wonder if Ebay is violating anti-trust laws.
So much for ebay.
What alternatives do we have for buying and selling used model railroad stuff over the internet? I see Amazon sells used railroad books for individuals.
I invite model railroaders to suggest alternatives to ebay.
Would it do good if we all started complaining to ebay?
Any constructive thoughts would be appreciated.
I believe EBAY has another service ProPay, but you control the payments.
I think its a direct bank transferiing I don't use credit cards, not after my previous fiasco, which was really my fault, but thats done, its cash based as much as possible.
Still, if EBAy insists, I may have to go that way but it will be far more difficult for me to deal with ebay, and that means I start hitting swap meets more.
I've had good luck with ebay with only one bad apple using... MONEY ORDERS.
All this complaining about EBAY, but what the complainers fail to realize is...EBAY is a company, with stockholders, who want to make money. That's the same for every other company in the world.....if you don't like what a particular company is doing...then don't patronize it, sitting there moaning that the governemnt should regulate it is just plain dumb!
I have several friends who make a pretty good living selling on EBAY, I've made a fair amount of $$$ selling and I've gotten excellent deals on stuff I bought. I never answer those emails from Nigeria saying my PayPal is being used too much, I always read the ENTIRE description before bidding and I never ever bid with someone who has lower than 98% postive feedback, I check my accounts fequently for activity, and I never answer any emails trying to sell me stuff ouitside of EBAY....with these simple and common sense practices, it's just as safe to use EBAY as it is to send your CC numbers online to one of the hobby houses.
The fees charged by EBAY are not outrageous, and if you're smart you watch the ''free insertion'' notices that pop up frequently. I have the suspicion that the bulk of complainers don't use or have only used EBAY a few times, the remarks about the amount you get charged being triple digits demostrates this very well,. This is a free country and you are free to complain all you want, but whining that the government should regulate a business because YOU feel the prices are too high?? COME ON!!!! What are the complainers going to do when WALMART says.." Unless you use OUR CC from OUR bank ...we will charge you X%''? Will you want government regulation then too?
DT&Ifan,
Welcome aboard, guy.
Hope you'll be around for a long time to come. Don't feel bad, it's just that we've had trolls stir the barrel on a number of occasions.
Can you tell us about yourself and your model RR interests on a new thread?
"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"
alco_fan wrote: DTandIfan wrote:Had my paypal account hacked, cost me 1000's and without any reembursment. Money orders only from then on.Was that before or after the alien abduction? Was Bigfoot involved?If you didn't answer a phishing email and you had documentation that this really happened, it would be news in the real media, not a first anonymous post on a train forum.Puh-lease.
DTandIfan wrote:Had my paypal account hacked, cost me 1000's and without any reembursment. Money orders only from then on.
Was that before or after the alien abduction? Was Bigfoot involved?
If you didn't answer a phishing email and you had documentation that this really happened, it would be news in the real media, not a first anonymous post on a train forum.
Puh-lease.
corsair7 wrote: This is based on the price you initially put us as the minimum bid requested. Then should the auction end successfully you pay a portion of the selling price to Ebay. If the buyer pays by PayPal, there is another fee that is paid based on the amount received. These can total anywhere from $1.00 and up depending the sale with the cost to the seller easily reaching 3 of 4 digit numbers (without the decimals) each and every month. Combine this with the fact that it often takes several go arounds before your item sells and you can see that ebay is usually the only one that makes a dime on many auctions. [emphasis added]
This is based on the price you initially put us as the minimum bid requested. Then should the auction end successfully you pay a portion of the selling price to Ebay. If the buyer pays by PayPal, there is another fee that is paid based on the amount received. These can total anywhere from $1.00 and up depending the sale with the cost to the seller easily reaching 3 of 4 digit numbers (without the decimals) each and every month. Combine this with the fact that it often takes several go arounds before your item sells and you can see that ebay is usually the only one that makes a dime on many auctions. [emphasis added]
Now wait a minute . . . The maximum Paypal fee - based on $3000 or less monthly sales - is 2.9% + $0.30 per transaction. The maximum insertion fee is $4, and that would be for items listed at $500 or more. The maximum possible sale fee - for items selling at $1000 or more - is 1.5% of the amount over $1000 + $36.31. So, to get a "3 digit" monthly total fee, say $500, on 10 auctions, someone would have to be selling around $2,475 worth of merchandise a month (500 = .029x + .03*10 + 4.00*10 +36.31*10 + .015(x-1000)). This works out to a combined fee of 20%. To get a "4 digit" fee - let's say $2,500 on 50 transactions, someone would have to be selling around $11,000 (2500 = .029x +.03*50 + 4.00*50 + 36.31 * 50 + .015(x-1000)), giving a combined fee of 23%.
However, these numbers are actually skewed high because you have to be listing items at $500 to start and getting at least $1000 per item to get these high fees - in which case the first seller would be making a minimum of $1000 x 10 ($10,000/mo) auctions or $1000 x 50 ($50,000/mo) auctions which would give them a 2.2% rather than 2.9% Paypal fee. These examples would actually result in total fees of $434 on $10,000 and $3,865 on $50,000 which work out to 4.3% and 7.7%.
I frankly find it hard to envision the circumstances wherein Ebay is "the only one making a dime" on auctions where the seller is paying $100 to $9,999 in fees "each and every month", unless the seller is pushing hundreds of $0.99 auctions for junk that doesn't sell.
At any rate, as the examples above show, to pay that much in fees every month would require either a very large number of auctions or a very large monthly return on auctions. In either case that smells like a business, and I have little sympathy for businesses that picked a sales model that doesn't work.
KL
fwright wrote: NS AS-416 wrote:I'll agree with that. I have done some sporadic selling on eBay cleaning out computer parts and sports cards to fund my MRR. Within the past year or so there has been a disturbing trend of eBay dipping in where ever they can because some of their shareholders or board or executives or whomever are getting greedy. This new rules change cuts the last way sellers had to get around their double dipping, while at the same time removing some buyers preferred payment methods.What is also frustrating, from a sellers perspective, is that it is nigh impossible to sell an item for anywhere near what you paid for it, although that may have more to do with what I had listed. In any case, I stopped selling after I calculated that I was barely breaking even despite selling a lot of stuff.In M:tG (my other hobby) I was selling some of my excess cards. Guy said, "I'm not willing to give you $8 for that $10 card 'cause I can get it for $5 on eBay." Told him "Good for you, just don't expect me to make an attempt to help you out next time you're looking for a card I have that you need for your deck." It is that type of attitude (unknowingly) fostered by eBay that really disgusts me more than the unscrupulous buyers and sellers. eBay was good for a while but has now devolved to the point of online flea market and isn't really worth the time invested anymore.Matt I'm sorry, but complaining as a seller about not getting your desired price for an item....What makes you think you deserve to get what you paid for an item? I wish I had a guarantee I could sell my house for what I paid for it last year. But wishes are just wishes, and nothing more....One of the results of not having as many buyers in a given market is that the prices will tend to drop - the old supply exceeding demand kind of thing. Which is one (there are others that have nothing to do with buyers) of the reasons eBay is changing rules to favor buyers.And given the financial insecurity many Americans are feeling at present, the demand for hobby goods is very likely to drop even further. The $8 today for your card may seem like a good deal in 6 months when the market rate is truly $5.I have used eBay to sell my excess model railroad goods because I got a much better price and my expenses were smaller than I would selling through local classified ads or garage sales. Whenever I'm selling something, I look at all the various market options, and select which one suits my purposes and needs best. For the occasional seller, eBay is just another form of selling market - no different than tables at swap meets, flea markets, garage sales, Craig's List, classified ads, etc.As a friend of mine used to say, "Never be in awe of banks. They are just a McDonald's for money." Actually, banks are even worse off, with no real way to differentiate themselves from one another except on price and the customer "experience". However, most banking customers don't realize that, and banks take advantage of them.Ebay is similar. It is the McDonald's of venues for the small seller. There are plenty of alternatives, and you are free to start one anytime you choose. At its best, eBay has sufficient mass of buyers and sellers to establish true market prices that can be tracked over time. When sufficient mass of buyers and sellers no longer exists, price volatility ensues and the value of eBay over other venues is reduced.As eBay emphasizes fixed price (Buy it Now) over auctions, and generally makes life more irritating and expensive for the small seller, you can expect it to be a far less efficient market. Buy it Now prices will increase because sellers will have no idea of the going market price, and will price the item to what they think it should be. Buyers will retreat even more as the ability to score the occasional bargain (in the buyer's eyes) goes away. Time for an item to sell will grow, too. An indication of that expectation is eBay extending the listing period for Buy it Now to 4 weeks instead of 1.just my thoughts, yours may differFred W
NS AS-416 wrote:I'll agree with that. I have done some sporadic selling on eBay cleaning out computer parts and sports cards to fund my MRR. Within the past year or so there has been a disturbing trend of eBay dipping in where ever they can because some of their shareholders or board or executives or whomever are getting greedy. This new rules change cuts the last way sellers had to get around their double dipping, while at the same time removing some buyers preferred payment methods.What is also frustrating, from a sellers perspective, is that it is nigh impossible to sell an item for anywhere near what you paid for it, although that may have more to do with what I had listed. In any case, I stopped selling after I calculated that I was barely breaking even despite selling a lot of stuff.In M:tG (my other hobby) I was selling some of my excess cards. Guy said, "I'm not willing to give you $8 for that $10 card 'cause I can get it for $5 on eBay." Told him "Good for you, just don't expect me to make an attempt to help you out next time you're looking for a card I have that you need for your deck." It is that type of attitude (unknowingly) fostered by eBay that really disgusts me more than the unscrupulous buyers and sellers. eBay was good for a while but has now devolved to the point of online flea market and isn't really worth the time invested anymore.Matt
I'll agree with that. I have done some sporadic selling on eBay cleaning out computer parts and sports cards to fund my MRR. Within the past year or so there has been a disturbing trend of eBay dipping in where ever they can because some of their shareholders or board or executives or whomever are getting greedy. This new rules change cuts the last way sellers had to get around their double dipping, while at the same time removing some buyers preferred payment methods.
What is also frustrating, from a sellers perspective, is that it is nigh impossible to sell an item for anywhere near what you paid for it, although that may have more to do with what I had listed. In any case, I stopped selling after I calculated that I was barely breaking even despite selling a lot of stuff.
In M:tG (my other hobby) I was selling some of my excess cards. Guy said, "I'm not willing to give you $8 for that $10 card 'cause I can get it for $5 on eBay." Told him "Good for you, just don't expect me to make an attempt to help you out next time you're looking for a card I have that you need for your deck."
It is that type of attitude (unknowingly) fostered by eBay that really disgusts me more than the unscrupulous buyers and sellers. eBay was good for a while but has now devolved to the point of online flea market and isn't really worth the time invested anymore.
Matt
I'm sorry, but complaining as a seller about not getting your desired price for an item....What makes you think you deserve to get what you paid for an item? I wish I had a guarantee I could sell my house for what I paid for it last year. But wishes are just wishes, and nothing more....
One of the results of not having as many buyers in a given market is that the prices will tend to drop - the old supply exceeding demand kind of thing. Which is one (there are others that have nothing to do with buyers) of the reasons eBay is changing rules to favor buyers.
And given the financial insecurity many Americans are feeling at present, the demand for hobby goods is very likely to drop even further. The $8 today for your card may seem like a good deal in 6 months when the market rate is truly $5.
I have used eBay to sell my excess model railroad goods because I got a much better price and my expenses were smaller than I would selling through local classified ads or garage sales. Whenever I'm selling something, I look at all the various market options, and select which one suits my purposes and needs best. For the occasional seller, eBay is just another form of selling market - no different than tables at swap meets, flea markets, garage sales, Craig's List, classified ads, etc.
As a friend of mine used to say, "Never be in awe of banks. They are just a McDonald's for money." Actually, banks are even worse off, with no real way to differentiate themselves from one another except on price and the customer "experience". However, most banking customers don't realize that, and banks take advantage of them.
Ebay is similar. It is the McDonald's of venues for the small seller. There are plenty of alternatives, and you are free to start one anytime you choose. At its best, eBay has sufficient mass of buyers and sellers to establish true market prices that can be tracked over time. When sufficient mass of buyers and sellers no longer exists, price volatility ensues and the value of eBay over other venues is reduced.
As eBay emphasizes fixed price (Buy it Now) over auctions, and generally makes life more irritating and expensive for the small seller, you can expect it to be a far less efficient market. Buy it Now prices will increase because sellers will have no idea of the going market price, and will price the item to what they think it should be. Buyers will retreat even more as the ability to score the occasional bargain (in the buyer's eyes) goes away. Time for an item to sell will grow, too. An indication of that expectation is eBay extending the listing period for Buy it Now to 4 weeks instead of 1.
just my thoughts, yours may differ
Fred W
I can see the supply and demand as everyone starts dumping their Tyco and (old) B'mann trainset stuff expecting to get rich and getting just pennies on the dollar from a dealer that needed new mdse for the flea market or swap meet. Just not for items from higher end manufacturers.
As for the M:tG guy, he actually came back later and paid ... *gasp* ...$10.00 ... for the card out of my consignment binder because he kept getting outbid on eBay. In my personal experience I don't ever see the market for the cards dropping that drasticly since, unlike mr, M:tG is GROWING as a community instead of sitting in a holding pattern.
My .
Well, I understand that some of you guys were not too crazy about Ebay to begin with.
What I've appreciated about Ebay is finding those hard to get "out of production" model railroad items, such as the HO Bachmann Metroliners (that I've metalized) or older P2K locomotives in paint schemes no longer available. Overall, except for one transaction in which I paid too much, my Ebay experience since 2003 has been pretty good. I've managed to maintain a 100% feedback rating.
So, until the October "new rules enactment" I'll continue to keep an eye out for a few more items I'd like, including a P2K SD-9 in Burlington's black "Way of the Zephyr" scheme. Unless the rules about checks and money orders change, I'll be bidding Ebay a "See Ya!"
AntonioFP45 wrote: Guys,Forgive my confusion. I looked over some listings like this one belowhttp://cgi.ebay.com/AMERICAS-RAILROADS-THE-SECOND-GENERATION-by-DON-BALL_W0QQitemZ200250247261QQihZ010QQcategoryZ4132QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemstill show that checks are acceptable. CAN THE SELLERS STILL ACCEPT CHECKS regardless of the new rules????????????????
Guys,
Forgive my confusion. I looked over some listings like this one below
http://cgi.ebay.com/AMERICAS-RAILROADS-THE-SECOND-GENERATION-by-DON-BALL_W0QQitemZ200250247261QQihZ010QQcategoryZ4132QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
still show that checks are acceptable. CAN THE SELLERS STILL ACCEPT CHECKS regardless of the new rules????????????????
Those new rules don't go into effect until October, so those sellers who take checks can still take them.
Irv
cregil wrote: Kurt_Laughlin wrote: What I find interesting is that some of the people most resistant to using Paypal because of a perceived lack of security are more than happy to send a personal check to a total stranger, a check that has the account holder's name, the ABA routing number, and their account number printed on it. Which, incidentally, is all that's needed for someone to access the account electronically or even have new blank checks printed up . . .KL Right, or set up online banking.Someone pointed out that the day will come when Paypal data gets stolen, but that same risk exists with every employer who has your name, address, SSN, and probably your banking information (for direct deposit). I would like to know the costs of selling on eBay.I am relatively new to shopping there, but notice that of the all of the items I have won, bid on, or watched have been from vendors who have thousands of sales. If I were selling only an occasional item, taking credit cards would be out of the question, and my minimum price would include the costs of paying eBay and Paypal just as my postage cost would include postage as well as packaging.So, what is the least costly payment method for the seller? What is the quickest form of payment from a seller’s perspective? Crews
Kurt_Laughlin wrote: What I find interesting is that some of the people most resistant to using Paypal because of a perceived lack of security are more than happy to send a personal check to a total stranger, a check that has the account holder's name, the ABA routing number, and their account number printed on it. Which, incidentally, is all that's needed for someone to access the account electronically or even have new blank checks printed up . . .KL
What I find interesting is that some of the people most resistant to using Paypal because of a perceived lack of security are more than happy to send a personal check to a total stranger, a check that has the account holder's name, the ABA routing number, and their account number printed on it. Which, incidentally, is all that's needed for someone to access the account electronically or even have new blank checks printed up . . .
Right, or set up online banking.
Someone pointed out that the day will come when Paypal data gets stolen, but that same risk exists with every employer who has your name, address, SSN, and probably your banking information (for direct deposit).
I would like to know the costs of selling on eBay.
I am relatively new to shopping there, but notice that of the all of the items I have won, bid on, or watched have been from vendors who have thousands of sales. If I were selling only an occasional item, taking credit cards would be out of the question, and my minimum price would include the costs of paying eBay and Paypal just as my postage cost would include postage as well as packaging.
So, what is the least costly payment method for the seller? What is the quickest form of payment from a seller’s perspective?
Crews
There is a lsiting fee for one. This is based on the price you initially put us as the minimum bid requested. Then should the auction end successfully you pay a portion of the selling price to Ebay. If the buyer pays by PayPal, there is another fee that is paid based on the amount received. These can total anywhere from $1.00 and up depending the sale with the cost to the seller easily reaching 3 of 4 digit numbers (without the decimals) each and every month. Combine this with the fact that it often takes several go arounds before your item sells and you can see that ebay is usually the only one that makes a dime on many auctions.
So why do ebay sellers stay? Many don't. And even more do it only when they have merchandise that they can't get rid of any other way. Finally, many ebay sellers buy their merchandise from stores that are going out of business or from individuals who just want to get rid of these items and would rather get a few pennies for them than pay for it to be hauled away to the city dump.
Last Chance wrote: When in England, we bought Pounds at exchange. 1.20 to the dollar. Now it's twice that. When in Canada we bought CDN at .74 plus or minus a few cents. I completed a recent Ebay buy from Canada just about 1 for one dollar even exchange more or less. It was transparent to me buying in CDN online.Ebay by requiring people to, only do paypal or creditcard is going to find themselves out of income to a certain extent. There is just too many people who WILL use a check or money order and NEVER use the electronic money. I understand that Ebay is trying to tighten the good ship revenue from all these little leaks and grey-water sloshing about the bilge to appease the stock holder who thinks that the Ebay can do better.One of my family members has a sign "Beatings continue until Morale Improves" in his workshop and I think Ebay will suffer from these rules. Sure they can burn off alot of the sellers and buyers who refuse to abide by the new rules. But can enough leave ebay to make them reconsider the folly of thier change?
When in England, we bought Pounds at exchange. 1.20 to the dollar. Now it's twice that. When in Canada we bought CDN at .74 plus or minus a few cents. I completed a recent Ebay buy from Canada just about 1 for one dollar even exchange more or less. It was transparent to me buying in CDN online.
Ebay by requiring people to, only do paypal or creditcard is going to find themselves out of income to a certain extent. There is just too many people who WILL use a check or money order and NEVER use the electronic money. I understand that Ebay is trying to tighten the good ship revenue from all these little leaks and grey-water sloshing about the bilge to appease the stock holder who thinks that the Ebay can do better.
One of my family members has a sign "Beatings continue until Morale Improves" in his workshop and I think Ebay will suffer from these rules. Sure they can burn off alot of the sellers and buyers who refuse to abide by the new rules. But can enough leave ebay to make them reconsider the folly of thier change?
I sell on ebay and 99% of the auctions items I sell are paid for with PayPal. I suspect most sellers have seen that as well. So if that is the case, why bother asking for checks or money orders? I suspect that this is why ebay is moving that way. Besides, since PayPal is owned in ebay, they will now have more control over the buying and selling process and since they also get to coolect not only the fee charged to the seller when the auction ends successfully but also on the fee charged for amount received by the vendor from the buyer. In effect they get paid twice for the same transaction. And this doesn't even include the fee for listing the item to begin with.
Railphotog wrote: I'm trying to figure out how small sellers ( as opposed to dealers) could offer free shipping. Say I have an item that normally sells for $25.00. I start the auction at $10.00, and it doesn't attract many bidders, selling for $15.00. So I would be offering free shipping of say $7-10 on this item? Selling it for $15.00? This does not compute!Maybe I'm missing something here, maybe they intend for the power sellers to offer free shipping on most of their stuff with "Buy it Now" pricing, which would be high enough to include their shipping costs?
I'm trying to figure out how small sellers ( as opposed to dealers) could offer free shipping. Say I have an item that normally sells for $25.00. I start the auction at $10.00, and it doesn't attract many bidders, selling for $15.00. So I would be offering free shipping of say $7-10 on this item? Selling it for $15.00? This does not compute!
Maybe I'm missing something here, maybe they intend for the power sellers to offer free shipping on most of their stuff with "Buy it Now" pricing, which would be high enough to include their shipping costs?
I think it's more of an attempt to get sellers to sto seeling items at batrgain basement prices but making up for the loss of profit by overcharging for shipping. What I am talking about is the seller that sells a bras locomotive for $10 and then charges $100 for shipping and handling.
As for the power sellers, I don't worry about them losing money beacsue they wouldn't be around long nor will they stay on ebay if they can't recoup the costs of their investments (merchandise) plus the cost of shipping and make a profit as well.
BigRusty wrote:BIG BROTHER is watching you. The IRS is trying to flush out the underground economy that does not pay taxes. They estimate it to be in the BILLIONS. They recently reduced the amount of cash deposits that must be reported by banks from $10,000 to $3,000. Eliminating cash and money order transactions means that ALL E-Bay transactions are now traceable to your Social Security Number. Maybe requiring that the seller furnish a 1099-MISC to buyers is next.
While the IRS wants to tax all income, they aren't the only ones interested in getting funds. Many states also have sale taxes and they would certainly love to get ebay sellers and buyers to collect and pay sales taxes. Don't be surprised if one day soon you won't be able to buy anything on ebay without being forced to either pay sales tax or its near cousin use taxes.
amtrakjackson wrote:These actions are not those taken by a company on the 'way up'- they reflect maximizing income for the smallest of costs, with the subtraction of losses incurred. eBay is falling on hard times. Beware of messages and PR spin bearing these words and phrases: experience, optimize, enhance, dynamic, "exceed your expectations", and my favorite, "what's more". Take some steps back and see it for what it really is. Ugh. <>
These actions are not those taken by a company on the 'way up'- they reflect maximizing income for the smallest of costs, with the subtraction of losses incurred. eBay is falling on hard times.
Beware of messages and PR spin bearing these words and phrases: experience, optimize, enhance, dynamic, "exceed your expectations", and my favorite, "what's more". Take some steps back and see it for what it really is.
Ugh.
<>
PMeyer wrote:They bought PayPal and now they are forcing everyone to use it. Watch their rates sky rocket in the near future. And what government can legislate them?
I'm surprised at the length of this thread and some of the opinions.
I'm not for/against Ebay/Paypal, but to me it is a service that I can chose to use or not to use.
Government regulating Ebay?
How's that saying go? "We're from the government and we're here to help"
No thanks.
No one is forcing you to participate in an auction. It is YOUR choice to do so, so you have no justifiable complaints about fees if you do. If the customers stop using Ebay, Ebay will make a fee/policy correction, its what the market will bear, and they are testing the market. We will see what happens.
MHO
GS
BRAKIE wrote:Indeed..How can the Government legislate them?
The only way the government could get involved would be if they broke banking laws (paypal is a quasi-bank), or if someone figured out how to go after them under anti-trust regulations. By offering to allow payments through sellers' merchant accounts, they avoid having a monopoly on payment methods.
Occasionally, I've bought something and been instructed to not use ebay's check out system, but a third party invoicing system. I found them to be pointless and unduly complicated (I still payed with paypal anyhow), but I wonder if one of these would allow an 'end-run' around the new policies.
PMeyer wrote:It's only going to get worse. The eBay experience has been in decline for some time now. they are trying to be a monopoly. They bought PayPal and now they are forcing everyone to use it. Watch their rates sky rocket in the near future. And what government can legislate them?
My thoughts exactly..As you noted they own pay pal..Now they get a double dip..The auction fee and then the pay pal fee...What's next a transaction handling fee?
Indeed..How can the Government legislate them?
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
AntonioFP45 wrote:Guys,Forgive my confusion. I looked over some listings like this one belowhttp://cgi.ebay.com/AMERICAS-RAILROADS-THE-SECOND-GENERATION-by-DON-BALL_W0QQitemZ200250247261QQihZ010QQcategoryZ4132QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemstill show that checks are acceptable. CAN THE SELLERS STILL ACCEPT CHECKS regardless of the new rules????????????????
The new rules haven't taken effect yet - I believe they start in October.
Very disappointed indeed.
I have a 100% feedback rating and have paid for the majority of my purchases with cashier's checks, free from my bank.
I do wonder if enough ebay users protest if the management might have a change of heart with regard to the use of checks.
Apologies are in order about the fees I listed.
Due to a brain failure and sleeping at switch, I accidently included total costs including shipping expenses to the buyer.
I will say that the more dollar amounts involved, the more your fees are.
I have started to explore a pre-paid credit card via the bank to pay paypal as well... I suspect paypal will try to get into everything like walmarts in the future. Imagine having no cashier lines, just a paypal station.
There are those who think paper checks are on the way out. I will present a argument and say as long as billers like Dish Network demands a voided copy to prove the bank account to auto draft from there will always be a need for paper checks.
Indeed autodrafting for monthly bill payment is getting to be the only method to be on time with your bills. The grace windows are getting tighter with each passing year. Who knows? If paper checks go out, then they will have to make a payroll deduction for your monthly bills at the employer.
Paypal did ok for me as a buyer, but they were always slow with autodrafts... taking 2,3,4 or even 5 days. If you made a buy near the weekend, your item wont ship until late the following week due to seller waiting for the paypal. For some reason paypal sometimes instantly draws the funds moments after auction end (After you pay paypal) and the shipper is happy to get the item on the way in the morning.
BRAKIE wrote: loathar wrote: Tracklayer wrote: I figured that was eventually going to happen one day. I also recently heard a rumor that WalMart, Academy and a number of other businesses are going to stop accepting personal checks and will only accept cash or debit cards as payment anymore. Wal Marts already doing a thing where they scan your personal check, have you sign a credit like slip and hand you your check back. My parents worked for Deluxe Check Printers all their lives and made a good living. My brother and I both worked there too. Deluxe is now defunct and tens of thousands of people are out of a job because of the debit card revolution.Mmmmm...the sour stench of progress....I already shopped in a store that had a notice on the door and it read:As of August 1st we will no longer accept personal or payroll checks.Thank You.Or words closely to that..I was shocked..What's next? Sorry we no longer accept cash?
loathar wrote: Tracklayer wrote: I figured that was eventually going to happen one day. I also recently heard a rumor that WalMart, Academy and a number of other businesses are going to stop accepting personal checks and will only accept cash or debit cards as payment anymore. Wal Marts already doing a thing where they scan your personal check, have you sign a credit like slip and hand you your check back. My parents worked for Deluxe Check Printers all their lives and made a good living. My brother and I both worked there too. Deluxe is now defunct and tens of thousands of people are out of a job because of the debit card revolution.Mmmmm...the sour stench of progress....
Tracklayer wrote: I figured that was eventually going to happen one day. I also recently heard a rumor that WalMart, Academy and a number of other businesses are going to stop accepting personal checks and will only accept cash or debit cards as payment anymore.
I figured that was eventually going to happen one day. I also recently heard a rumor that WalMart, Academy and a number of other businesses are going to stop accepting personal checks and will only accept cash or debit cards as payment anymore.
Wal Marts already doing a thing where they scan your personal check, have you sign a credit like slip and hand you your check back. My parents worked for Deluxe Check Printers all their lives and made a good living. My brother and I both worked there too. Deluxe is now defunct and tens of thousands of people are out of a job because of the debit card revolution.Mmmmm...the sour stench of progress....
I already shopped in a store that had a notice on the door and it read:
As of August 1st we will no longer accept personal or payroll checks.
Thank You.
Or words closely to that..I was shocked..
What's next? Sorry we no longer accept cash?
Sign of the times really. I've worked in retail for twenty years.( all for the same company )Up here in Canada personal checks have not been accepted as payment at major retailers for about ten years now,some grocery stores still do but that is about to go as well.Too many bounced cheques too much fraud in general on the cheque end .Of coarse up eher the embracement of debit cards happened much quicker thna it did in the US.
The the OP's original thoughts ,it won't effect me much.I do a fair bit of ebay selling and buying. I won't accept cheques, and will at least until the end accept money orders but it does add a ton of time to the transaction on the selling end.I won't buy from someone who does not take paypal,I set up a separate bank account credit/debit card just for useage there,muck simpler and much faster.
Rob
Have fun with your trains
CRAP!! this is bad news for me. I only use money orders when buying from Ebay. I get them from Walmart really cheap on my way home from work. I have them in the mail usually within a day or two of the close of the auction. I do not use Paypal because my nephew had his identity stolen through his Paypal account. Within an hour and a half, they had changed all his passwords and effectively locked him out of his own accounts!! I also had a bad experience with a debit card when they first started to be widely used,so I just never got another one. I guess this leaves a credit card as my sole remaining option.
PayPal will then be your only way to go - you pay with PayPal and they charge your card.
Bob Boudreau
CANADA
Visit my model railroad photography website: http://sites.google.com/site/railphotog/
loathar wrote:I won't deal with a vendor that requires a Payscam account. I've used a money order for everything I've bought off E-bay and have a 100% feed back rating. I guess I'd be willing to switch to my debit card, but I won't like it. I guess E-Bay's taking a Q from our government. Cater to the big guy and screw the little guy...
Get yourself a credit card and dedicate it to only online purchases. If someone steals your number, cancel the card immediately and get a new one.
Using your bank account debit card online is a good way to get your bank account in a totally unusable mess if someone steals your number. Ask me how I know ...
By the way, I have had nothing but excellent experiences with PayPal, and the cool thing is there's nothing for an online thief to steal with PayPal.
Joe Fugate Modeling the 1980s SP Siskiyou Line in southern Oregon
Last Chance wrote: Ebay charges you extra for everything. A simple 1.00 open bid on a widget with one picture (Free) and a short description would have not generated much fees... maybe a few cents.But should that widget close at 100.00 winning price, your fees will be approximately 15-22% of the total gross amount of auction when the sale is over. Hopefully the customer has paid the shipping in full. Your net out of that 100.00 sale is going to be about 78 dollars or so when it's all over.
Ebay charges you extra for everything. A simple 1.00 open bid on a widget with one picture (Free) and a short description would have not generated much fees... maybe a few cents.
But should that widget close at 100.00 winning price, your fees will be approximately 15-22% of the total gross amount of auction when the sale is over. Hopefully the customer has paid the shipping in full. Your net out of that 100.00 sale is going to be about 78 dollars or so when it's all over.
Alco fan already addressed this, but if those fees you say were real, ebay wouldn't be the auction site it is today. In fact, it wouldn't exist because nobody would make any money but them.
alco_fan wrote: Last Chance wrote: Ebay charges you extra for everything. A simple 1.00 open bid on a widget with one picture (Free) and a short description would have not generated much fees... maybe a few cents.But should that widget close at 100.00 winning price, your fees will be approximately 15-22% of the total gross amount of auction when the sale is over. Hopefully the customer has paid the shipping in full. Your net out of that 100.00 sale is going to be about 78 dollars or so when it's all over.Say what? You need to take a look at eBay's actual fee schedule. If your list the item with a 99 cent starting price ($.15), then sell it for $100, you pay $2.19 plus 3.5% of the amount over $25 ($2.63). That totals less than 5 bucks. Even if you add percentage points for a PayPal transaction, you clear at least 94 bucks. Its not free, but at least describe it correctlyI'm not hyping eBay, but its worked for me hundreds of times with no problems. Some of the rules are a pain, but some of them came about because unscrupulous buyers and sellers "gamed" the system in the past. If any new auction site ever actually started to be successful, the same cheats would end up there and those rules would be toughened, too. There is no free lunch.EBay revenues were nearly 8.5 billion (yeah, with a "B") in the last 12 months. They won't miss the model train business if all of you tinfoil hatters clear out.
Say what? You need to take a look at eBay's actual fee schedule. If your list the item with a 99 cent starting price ($.15), then sell it for $100, you pay $2.19 plus 3.5% of the amount over $25 ($2.63). That totals less than 5 bucks. Even if you add percentage points for a PayPal transaction, you clear at least 94 bucks. Its not free, but at least describe it correctly
I'm not hyping eBay, but its worked for me hundreds of times with no problems. Some of the rules are a pain, but some of them came about because unscrupulous buyers and sellers "gamed" the system in the past. If any new auction site ever actually started to be successful, the same cheats would end up there and those rules would be toughened, too. There is no free lunch.
EBay revenues were nearly 8.5 billion (yeah, with a "B") in the last 12 months. They won't miss the model train business if all of you tinfoil hatters clear out.
Another thing to keep costs under control would be to ship USPS Priority Mail. The boxes are free, and you can use ebay to calculate the exact cost. That way you're getting the entire cost of shipping every time, and not paying for supplies.
BRAKIE wrote: Black Helicopters and Reynolds Tin Foil hats be darned. " border="0" width="15" height="15" />-------------Don't forget the MIB.
Black Helicopters and Reynolds Tin Foil hats be darned. " border="0" width="15" height="15" />
-------------
Don't forget the MIB.
LOL Brakie
The least costly method is to sell in lots or several of like items.
I used to take a video of the items with a decent camcorder and good lighting showing all of the items sides, ups and downs up close and out. Then posted a video on photobucket. Later a simple link from Ebay selling page direct to the video.
That simple work around eliminated dozens of pictures and was very successful for me in avoiding picture fees. Plus actual video of engines pulling trains or running with sound was very helpful to the buyers.
I think at the time it would have been .25 or about there for each image uploaded to ebay. Gallery fees would have been a few dollars.
dirtyd79 wrote: jeffrey-wimberly wrote: rtraincollector wrote: I was looking at the latest message from ebay in my ebay messages and was shocked to see that come october you will not be ableto receive or pay via checks or money ordeer for items you buy/sell. They want you only to use credit cards or debit cards and pay thru paypal or other electronic paying companies. Am I going to buy from EBay anymore?NO WAY! As long as I could pay by money order it was OK, but putting my credit card and/or bank account info online? Nothing doing! Same here, man. As for being paranoid if any of you guys ever read The Anarchist's Cookbook and read how easy it is to jinjack somebody's bank account or credit card numbers you'd crap a cinder block. Here's a hint take a close look at what you throw in your garbage can sometime. P.S. The Anarchist Cookbook is freeware now so any amateur hack in the universe can find it
jeffrey-wimberly wrote: rtraincollector wrote: I was looking at the latest message from ebay in my ebay messages and was shocked to see that come october you will not be ableto receive or pay via checks or money ordeer for items you buy/sell. They want you only to use credit cards or debit cards and pay thru paypal or other electronic paying companies. Am I going to buy from EBay anymore?NO WAY! As long as I could pay by money order it was OK, but putting my credit card and/or bank account info online? Nothing doing!
rtraincollector wrote: I was looking at the latest message from ebay in my ebay messages and was shocked to see that come october you will not be ableto receive or pay via checks or money ordeer for items you buy/sell. They want you only to use credit cards or debit cards and pay thru paypal or other electronic paying companies.
I was looking at the latest message from ebay in my ebay messages and was shocked to see that come october you will not be ableto receive or pay via checks or money ordeer for items you buy/sell. They want you only to use credit cards or debit cards and pay thru paypal or other electronic paying companies.
Am I going to buy from EBay anymore?
NO WAY!
As long as I could pay by money order it was OK, but putting my credit card and/or bank account info online? Nothing doing!
Same here, man. As for being paranoid if any of you guys ever read The Anarchist's Cookbook and read how easy it is to jinjack somebody's bank account or credit card numbers you'd crap a cinder block. Here's a hint take a close look at what you throw in your garbage can sometime.
P.S. The Anarchist Cookbook is freeware now so any amateur hack in the universe can find it
Black Helicopters and Reynolds Tin Foil hats be darned.
I take the proper steps, the only thing you will find in my garbage is garbage. Any and all mail is shredded in a proper paper shredder, what little I recieve anyway, because I choose not to recieve snail mail billing, it's all done by an e-mail and a website passwords. I haven't written a check in 10 years, I use a debit card, my paycheck is direct deposited, and I have literally performed hundreds of transaction via the internet using my credit card. I have never had a problem. My computer has the proper security measures, the banking websites I use are secure, I keep "in-touch" with my credit report regulary. Bottom line? I take the time.
The one and only time someone stole my credit card info was a waitress at a rather upscale restaurant. She was using it to make long distance calls. I made one call to Amex, the charges were reversed, and a new card and number were in my hand the next day, problem solved.
There is nothing wrong with being cautious, but be realistic.
My
rtraincollector wrote:Personally I'm thinking of looking into selling on www.choochoo.com auctions ( www.traincity.com ) charles sigel he just moved from PA. to FL and mainly has O but he offers spots for all gauges and I mainly deal in O so its good for me. From what I understand its free to list and then and only when you acually sell do you pay anything. I can still offer paypal if I wish or I can require money orders ( postal) if I wish.I've done a lot of searching today scince I was off and came up with this by a freinds recomemdation
Personally I'm thinking of looking into selling on www.choochoo.com auctions ( www.traincity.com ) charles sigel he just moved from PA. to FL and mainly has O but he offers spots for all gauges and I mainly deal in O so its good for me. From what I understand its free to list and then and only when you acually sell do you pay anything. I can still offer paypal if I wish or I can require money orders ( postal) if I wish.
I've done a lot of searching today scince I was off and came up with this by a freinds recomemdation
Well, if you start selling HO on choochooauctions.com, you certainly won't have much competition. Right now there is ONE auction for HO scale, and it's for a set of 6 Model Power soldiers. The asking price isn't even worth mentioning.
Like it or not, ebay is still the best game in town.
Kurt_Laughlin wrote:What I find interesting is that some of the people most resistant to using Paypal because of a perceived lack of security are more than happy to send a personal check to a total stranger, a check that has the account holder's name, the ABA routing number, and their account number printed on it. Which, incidentally, is all that's needed for someone to access the account electronically or even have new blank checks printed up . . .KL
skiloff wrote:I understand people's reluctance to put their card information on the internet, but the reality is, you are far more likely to have your card stolen at your local gas station than you are on the internet. Simply using a credit or debit card puts you in a position to have something fraudulent happen, no matter where.
I'm shocked that anyone has ever thought it was a good idea to use a credit card over the phone. At least stealing one online requires some knowledge and effort on the part of the thief. Someone on the other end of a phone requires nothing. You might as well write your card info on a piece of paper and go around putting them under people's windshield wipers.
Incidentally, everyone in my family has had their credit card numbers stolen from a gas station. The same gas station, on the same day, actually. Three cars on a family vacation, three cards.
BRAKIE wrote: The last time I bought checks I had to lay almost $20.00 into the outstretched hand of the guy printing them . . ." border="0" width="15" height="24" /> ----------------------I still writing checks from the first book since I write one check a month..At that rate my checks will last years so,I may never have to buy another box for $18.00.
The last time I bought checks I had to lay almost $20.00 into the outstretched hand of the guy printing them . . .
" border="0" width="15" height="24" />
----------------------
I still writing checks from the first book since I write one check a month..At that rate my checks will last years so,I may never have to buy another box for $18.00.
I was thinking the same exact thing.I don't know where every one's banking, but my bank gives me free checks up to X amount per year and the ONLY time I've ever had to pay any kind of fee is when I bounced a check or used a non bank owned ATM.(and that's my own fault)
Scarpia-I hear ya loud and clear. Fortunately I was young enough to see the writing on the wall and get out of that business. The guys nearing retirement weren't so lucky.
DonZ-OK. That's ONE I've heard of.Glad it worked out for you.
And I've never heard of a seller complaining he got rip off because of a check or money order since they hold them till they clear.(or at least they should) You can use Telecheck service to verify funds just as EZ as checking a credit card.
My point is my check or money order is my word that I'm going to pay promptly. That word has been good enough to get 100% outstanding feed back up to this point. Now E-Bay (NOT the seller) is saying my word is no longer good enough for them or their sellers. Am I the only one that thinks being an honest person and getting lumped into a category with a few bad apples is wrong??
I understand people's reluctance to put their card information on the internet, but the reality is, you are far more likely to have your card stolen at your local gas station than you are on the internet. Simply using a credit or debit card puts you in a position to have something fraudulent happen, no matter where. I have yet to be ripped off in my 12 years of banking on the internet, but I know lots of people who have had their card information stolen at the gas station or restaurant. Its just one of the realities, unfortunately.
I don't buy a lot on ebay, but I've bought two new Atlas locos for 50% and 40% off retail. After shipping, it worked out to about 42% and 33%, but still a good deal in my eyes. And I will only buy off ebay if its a really good deal. Its not worth it otherwise.
loathar wrote: I won't use PayPal because it's just another guy sticking his hand out to take a cut. I've seen quite a few posts here where people said PayPal did nothing to fix a problem they had. I don't recall a single post where anyone praised them for righting a wrong. (MY )
I won't use PayPal because it's just another guy sticking his hand out to take a cut. I've seen quite a few posts here where people said PayPal did nothing to fix a problem they had. I don't recall a single post where anyone praised them for righting a wrong. (MY )
I'll give you a "PayPal did me right" story:
I won a Proto 2000 locomotive auction on eBay and even though the seller 'insisted' that I pay with a Money Order, his auction stated he also took PayPal. I chose to pay with PayPal. The seller stated he would ship via USPS Priority Mail. 5 days later, no item received. I asked repeatedly for a tracking number and never got a reply. I didn't wait any longer; I opened a dispute through eBay and PayPal. 9 days later, the seller said he mailed the package but still wouldn't provide a tracking number. I escalated the dispute and asked for a refund from PayPal. 21 days after the auction ended, the seller told PayPal he had shipped the item through UPS instead of the USPS. PayPal advised me to refuse delivery of the package. I'm glad I did, because there was no way a Proto 2000 locomotive was inside the small box the seller had shipped. I'm sure his plan was to have proof of delivery by UPS and then it was going to be my word against his that he shipped the loco. Once I refused the shipment, PayPal monitored the tracking number and when PayPal was notified that it was delivered back to the seller, they refunded my PayPal account in full, including shipping charges. The seller was then booted from eBay and theft charges were filed by PayPal. Am I happy I used PayPal? You bet!
Don Z.
Research; it's not just for geeks.
loathar wrote: Tell that to my friends from Deluxe and all the other check printers that lost their jobs, careers and pensions.
Tell that to my friends from Deluxe and all the other check printers that lost their jobs, careers and pensions.
Not to mention all those folks who lost their jobs making steam locomotives, propeller-engined fighter planes, three-masted wooden battleships, buggy-whips, typewriters, flintlock army rifles, home coal furnaces, flatirons, washing machine wringers, dial telephones, phonograph needles, carbon arc lamps, illuminating gas mantels, carbon paper, mimeograph machines, etc., etc., etc. SOMEBODY should've done something to make sure that those technologies were never superseded so that the employees - and their descendents - would always have the same jobs in the same places they always had.
loathar wrote: I won't use PayPal because it's just another guy sticking his hand out to take a cut.
I won't use PayPal because it's just another guy sticking his hand out to take a cut.
What people fail to see by using PayPal is you are protected by seller protection policy and buyers are protected by buyer protection by using PayPal. When you use money order or check the risk is yours no protection. The point is the seller and buyer will feel confident in their transaction when buying on eBay.
I still buy trains on eBay and still find deals as a buyer. I find it as a good resource as a MRR marketplace and will continue to use eBay.
I bought my PCM Yb-6 off eBay for $338, and yes it had sound and I paid with PayPal. Best purchase I have made.
BRAKIE wrote:I already shopped in a store that had a notice on the door and it read:As of August 1st we will no longer accept personal or payroll checks.Thank You.Or words closely to that..I was shocked..What's next? Sorry we no longer accept cash?
With all due respect, cheques are not cash. Cash is legal tender. Cheques are nothing more than a promisary note.
There is a huge difference, and no vender should be, or is required to accept cheques of any type.
If you think differently, let me write you an I.O.U. for that lovely brass loco.....
@ loathar, I don't like seeing folks loose jobs, but really, the writing (pun) intended has been on the wall about the cheque printing business. That's like complaining about how folks in the outhouse diggin' business are now out of work. Moving jobs overseas is another issue that we should discuss elsewhere, and while I disgree with it, if you feel that strongly about it, never shop at Walmart or any other large retailer.
Back on topic.
I havent' seen this before, but I'll have to consider this.
I use paypal and ebay a lot. To date -
1. I haven't been overly happy with the fees accrued by either for selling.
2. I haven't been overly happy with resolutions on paypal, but the mistake was mine for not getting tracking info.
3. I have been able to turn a LOT of former hobby material into instant purchasing power for model railroading purposes thanks to both ebay and paypal. Did I loose money? Who knows, do you really track all of your purchases and weigh it against your sales cost minus expenses and storage costs? I don't. I was just *** happy to mail stuff off and have some $$ to buy things I wanted - now. And thanks again to non-ebay vendors who acccept paypal.
4. I've never had a problem with an account or credit card from online purchases or transactions. Been doing it for over 10 years. In fact, I've had more credit card problems from in person experiences than online (those *** carbons).
5. Would i jump ship from ebay? in 2 seconds, unless, of couse, they have what I want...
So mileage varies. Cheers!
I'm trying to model 1956, not live in it.
I will offer up my attempt to build a site to trade trains to anyone that wants to use it.
http://trains.sagepointe.com
selector wrote: loathar used the term, "foul stench of progress". I would respectfully counter, loathar, that foul stenches come from putrefaction and stagnation, not from Life, from viability, and vitality.
loathar used the term, "foul stench of progress". I would respectfully counter, loathar, that foul stenches come from putrefaction and stagnation, not from Life, from viability, and vitality.
Tell that to my friends from Deluxe and all the other check printers that lost their jobs, careers and pensions. You've gotta remember, a lot of those new high tech computer banking jobs went over seas to third world call centers.
rtraincollector wrote: I was looking at the latest message from ebay in my ebay messages and was shocked to see that come october you will not be ableto receive or pay via checks or money ordeer for items you buy/sell. They want you only to use credit cards or debit cards and pay thru paypal or other electronic paying companies. We're taking steps to give sellers the most dynamic marketplace on the Internet: reduced upfront cost, optimized exposure, and a more consistent buyer experience to drive more sales. Your Auction-style listings with a low start price are still the best deal on eBay -- no change in Auction-style fees! Plus, we're introducing a new 35¢ Insertion Fee for Fixed Price listings-regardless of the asking price or number of items in the listing-with a 30-day duration and automatic renewal option at no extra cost. For some of your items, this new Fixed Price option may be a great solution.Driving more sales with a more consistent buyer experienceWe're taking other steps to ensure buyers keep coming back to eBay:Limits on shipping and handling charges Big seller rewards for free shipping, including free subtitle, a boost in search results, and double PowerSeller fee discounts No more checks and money orders New seller standards: Minimum 4.3 on all DSRs More relevant search results to drive more sales. We're optimizing Best Match to surface the inventory most relevant to each buyer and show the best of Auction-style and Fixed Price. Get more information about these important changes. You're also invited to participate in one of several webinars scheduled for August 20-26.
Plus, we're introducing a new 35¢ Insertion Fee for Fixed Price listings-regardless of the asking price or number of items in the listing-with a 30-day duration and automatic renewal option at no extra cost. For some of your items, this new Fixed Price option may be a great solution.
I found this
"Payment on pick-up"
I will just message the buyer I will use a money order, and carry on as usual.
If they don't accept that, pfft on EBAY anymore.
Life's hard, even harder if your stupid John Wayne
http://rtssite.shutterfly.com/
If I sold you a Athearn RTR Boxcar with three day Priority you will pay shipping plus whatever the last bid is. If you are a GOOD ebayer, you will stop the bidding at MSRP - shipping = cost of the boxcar in your hobbyshop. Most of the time you will be seeing a boxcar with SHIPPING, at MSRP and so on. Basically a Virtual hobbyshop with no real cost savings.
If you waited long enough like a vulture circling above, you might snag this same BOXCAR at 5.00 plus a few dollars parcel shipping but might have to fight 10 others for it.
If I say sorry, no checks, no money orders, paypal only etc etc in response to the new rule. That RTR boxcar will have about 10% of page views it once did and less than 5% of bidding activity it once did under the more open payment rules previously.
And yes it might take 30 days instead of 4 to consumate the sale of the boxcar. Might as well ditch ebay and go to the hobby shop or catalog house and have it shipped to you.
Ive seen many a rtr train thing go out the door at 6.00 total with shipping, ebay fees etc eating into the seller. Nothing makes me as angry as it does a sale that cost ME money to complete. Might as well pour some deisel onto it and burn it in the burnpit.
Alternatives?
Easy, someone can set up a server and get a train swap/trade/buy site thing going. All we need to do is get "For sale train choo choo" information to... B "The train buyer" And the rest can be hammered out like checks, money orders etc.
If all or most of the ebay train stores get together and develop a "Coop" server for train stuff away from ebay and do thier business there... that should get things going rather well.
Bill,
Somewhere down the line eBayers will get a notice that their account information has been compromised due to a theft of an eBay employee's laptop, or a disk was inadvertently misplaced or their system has been hacked and before they knew it some uncertain number of eBayers accounts are at risk......yadda. yadda. Part of this communication will be a pious commitment on eBay's part to assure you that measures have been taken to insure that such an occurence cannot be repeated in the future...blah, blah....and oh, monitor your credit, debit, Paypal account to make sure no fraudulent activity is taking place.
I've purchased and sold on eBay and used personal checks and money orders on both kinds of transactions and have not as yet had a bad experience via these "antiquated" transaction methods.
As one of the responders to your posting noted it's a business and they will use every technique to maximize their profit and in so doing will assure you with what amounts to a corporate straight face that it's in your best interest(businesses have but one interest, their own).
Jon
If you read the financial news, you'll find eBay's stock is not where the investors would like it to be. The number of buyers is declining, which is not a good sign for future profits. Amazon is supposed to be cleaning eBay's clock with its lineup of sellers at fixed prices. The business progosticators claim that auction fatigue, and limitations of the auction business model are limiting eBay. Hence, the emphasis on Buy it Now listings by sellers, and other steps to lower the percentage of "burned" experiences of eBay. Not that eBay cared to do much about fraud before, no matter how much buyers and sellers complained (there are too many bad apples on both sides). And because of that attitude, eBay's shady reputation exists.
Unfortunately, I think eBay is missing the bigger picture. There are numerous hobby and craft communities that have grown up using eBay as THE primary or secondary market for buying/selling their goods. The auctions would typically set the going price for items. The new rules are going to force these communities to reduce their presence on eBay. I already see evidence of this in much higher price volatility (price swings of $45 to $100 or $115 to $195 from week to week for the same item) than I am used to seeing. To me, this is an indication that the number of buyers competing for a given item is way down.
The most onerous of the new rules is probably the shipping cost limitations, and the strong "encouragement" to have sellers offer free shipping. If sellers were limited to realistic shipping costs, that would be one thing. But often the limitations mean a seller is going to automatically lose money in addition to the higher fees on auctions. What I expect to see is a lot more Buy it Now for ridiculously high prices, and a lot more unsold merchandise, as sellers over-estimate what their stuff is worth. eBay obviously anticipates the same because the Buy it Now listings will be good for 30 days under the new rules instead of the current 7.
Hopefully, a new, widely used auction site will arise, which will once again provide us with a realistic market price.
my thoughts
vsmith wrote: This raises a good question, aside from these two, what ARE the alternatives to Ebay?
This raises a good question, aside from these two, what ARE the alternatives to Ebay?
I miss Yahoo auctions, free listings, small % if you sold the item. Even with free listings they couldn't compete.
Onlineauction.com and Ubid.com, but of course, you will not see the traffic that EBay gets.
The more I think about this the less I like it.
I agree that check payments are iffy at best but to eliminate money orders in lieu of PayPal seams to me to smack of more than a little self-interest. Ebay has been catering more and more to their online stores and there higher prices than to the little guy like me who only sells 3 or 4 times a year and subsequently gets the shaft.
I suspect if I continue buying on Ebay, I will do so with a prepay debit card account in lieu of paying by MO, as for selling - I dunno just yet, I got a ton of bike parts I was going to sell on there, but this rather self-serving policy has me second guessing that, how much ya wanna bet Craigslist and Amazon.Auctions will see a rise in listings after this.
Apparently, it wasn't "secure" was it?
Dude, you have the worst luck
Geared Steam wrote:A little PARANOID Jeff ???
A little PARANOID Jeff ???
Robby P. wrote:I sell all of my weathered cars on eBay. I accept checks, money orders, and Paypal. I have some buyers that use checks only. Now that makes me wonder if I will not get there business anymore. Makes you wonder if you can get around the Paypal only payment. Probably say that you paid threw paypal and still send a check. I guess they wouldn't know.
Don't count on it. Ebay owns Paypal and the two are linked as well. Paypal is a good way to pay for ourchases made thru Ebay. Many vendors accept payment thru Paypal as well. But one has to carefully watch Paypal just like you watch any other account that contains your money. To do otherwise is just asking for trouble these days.
As for doing business on Ebay, well I've been there since the 1990s. I used to be able to sell lots of stuff there but it hasn't been the same for the last couple of years. Competiton is stiff and there just aren't as many buyers there as there once were. So I've cut back on what I sell and te number of auctions that I have running at any one time. Lot's of vendors have left Ebay and lots of folks who used to buy there have done the same.
As for the liars and cheats, well they come on both sides of the transaction these days. But their presence are highly overexagerated. Besides feedback is important and it has to be looked at before committing to buy or sell anything. YOu shouldn't look only at the number of positive feedbacks a prospective vendor or buyer has but also at the feedback ratios. 100% or very close to that is good anything less could be asking for trouble.
Last Chance wrote:I got out of ebay last month after about 4 years because of changes. If someone was to try and log in as me and get the password wrong (And they will) Ebay computers call my home at all hours.Unacceptable.
That's very strange. I've typed my password wrong from time to time, and they've never done this. Of course, I think I may still have a dummy phone number listed (done after a buyer called me for technical support and ended up wanting to shoot the breeze).
jeffrey-wimberly wrote: rtraincollector wrote: I was looking at the latest message from ebay in my ebay messages and was shocked to see that come october you will not be ableto receive or pay via checks or money ordeer for items you buy/sell. They want you only to use credit cards or debit cards and pay thru paypal or other electronic paying companies.Am I going to buy from EBay anymore?NO WAY! As long as I could pay by money order it was OK, but putting my credit card and/or bank account info online? Nothing doing!
Well, there goes the way I usually buy stuff. (use my paycheck and take money from it for money orders).
Sometimes the MO is faster, since it always takes 5 days for Paypal, and lots of people I've boughten from, that MO would only take a few days to get there.
Vincent
Wants: 1. high-quality, sound equipped, SD40-2s, C636s, C30-7s, and F-units in BN. As for ones that don't cost an arm and a leg, that's out of the question....
2. An end to the limited-production and other crap that makes models harder to get and more expensive.
One way or another, we'll just have to get used to more restrictive rules that always come about when dishonest people abuse the system.
Tom
--------------
Indeed.
And here's the sad part. Crooks will win by finding new electronic rip off methods ..
BRAKIE wrote: Crooks been around for years cashing bad checks,stolen checks etc yet stores still gave their customers options of:Will that be cash,check or charge?Customer service RIP.
Crooks been around for years cashing bad checks,stolen checks etc yet stores still gave their customers options of:Will that be cash,check or charge?
Customer service RIP.
Problem is, when the store gets ripped off by a customer using a fradulent check, guess who ended up paying for it? That's right, the honest, paying customers. This drives prices up and makes some stores less competitive. The more ways they can find to keep costs down, the more customers will spend their money there. If paying customers want the low prices, they will just have to figure out how to use cash or get a debit card.
Seems like the same logic applies to eBay, but in reverse. Instead of the seller getting ripped off by a bad check (since he doesn't have to ship the item if the check doesn't clear), it's the buyer who usually gets ripped off by a dishonest seller who cashes the check, but doesn't ship the item. I agree that doing away with checks/money orders might make it easier for buyers to trust the seller, and therefore do more buisness.
Lots of emotion here already.
My take on this, not that I have any intention of every dealing with ebay, is that the company has a duty to its shareholders, people who believe in the model and in what they do, people with values, to ensure the company evolves ethically and mechanically so that it has long-term viability. It would be unethical to not change when change is indicated because its customer base was becoming vulnerable to fraudsters. One could even say they had embraced "green" a bit and want to do away with mail, paper, and all the eco-unfriendly usage of that nature. Maybe not. In any event, the company must evolve when they understand the need to do it for its own sake. That almost always means it is, to a healthy extent, good for its customers as well...a positive sum game for all who do ebay, employees, management, and some of you.
Ebay has learned over recent times that their policies have caused grief for too many of the very people upon whom they rely. It would be suicidal to shrug and tell people to get over it.
Ebay makes a good "Train show" when there is none around here except once a year down in Pine Bluff which isnt really a safe town having just annexed 4 state prisons.
The trick is finding actual hobby shops that have some of these items in stock and buying direct.
Shipping is my biggest reason for getting out. Made a 100 dollar sale requiring a building in HO scale to ship in a 2 foot by 3 foot box two feet high. The box was 8.00 gratis to the buyer along with the necessary packing and double boxing also gratis. So... roughly 20 dollars gone. The post office got most of what was left over after ebay fees and etc was paid.
One reason I found shipping to be steep was because I shipped only priority mail with the necessary confirmation, tracking etc. No other method. Most of the time I could sometimes build in "My half" of the shipping prices into the open bid to get the customers fee down to about 15 dollars for shipping.
Ebay started to moderate what shipping fees were charged with pop up boxes etc while you attempt to build the sale. They would think that 16 dollars, 20 dollars or whatever were too much. So that ended my 1.00 open bids and made them 30.00 or whatever resulting in higher fees all around.
160+ sales all perfect 100% and only three issues, two of which were naru'ed against the person who did it and one was a straight refund of a 10 dollar boxcar that was damaged badly.
Ebay made lots of money off me in 4 years. When the adding was finished it was close to 2500 dollars to them. And another 2 grand to the US post office which saw me as a cash cow requiring first class service. And I dont recall too much paypaling fees or trouble because again I kept a isolated bank account and "Zeroed" it after every sale completion. Ive heard of them taking whatever it is they wanted to via autodraft.
No, Ebay is not a way for making a living. Indeed it was a very good way of dumping unwanted train stuff to good homes. Yes I say dumping. If that nice 400 dollar engine did not pull very well upgrade then it got sold for a hundred or whatever the market would bear. I would hope that the buyer would enjoy these things.
Plowing through the mounds of truly junk items to get to the diamond in the swine trough takes hours per day and a planned sale is a military style sniper strike planned down to the last three seconds at any day/hour with obscene amounts of cash stacked and ready to go in that paypal.
Oh.. that paypal? 500 dollars every month yer allowed to move in buying or selling. If you want to be able to move 2000 dollars per month, you go down to the Justice of Peace office and draw up a Marriage certificate between you and Paypal and get ready to bend over. Sheesh.
I dont know about you, but I actually enjoy train shows these days with simple tables and prices written on post it note pads.
Also I enjoyed not having to hassle with sales taxes, money order fees other than .65 cents or whatever to generate one and follow up on it whenever the money order got lost or whatever the buyer or seller might claim. I did personal checks twice and did not ship until my bank said that the check itself cleared. That would take about 14 days.
I investigated the possibility of sending stuff to the local store downtown that advertised themselves as taking your stuff and selling it on ebay. I dont see how they can do it very long with that albatross of a store around thier neck.
Sorry for the negative tone, I must mention that there were plenty of very good people on ebay who bought trains and sometimes shared with me small tidbits about the "Stuff" or photos on occasion. I believe also that several were train clubs and think that perhaps the stuff I sold might be part of a model train somewhere passing in front of people who knows nothing about the hobby during a open house.
One can dream.
I say that the ebay's attempt to exert thier own control with the heavy hand in the form of "IOmportant Changes" written in overtones meant to make you feel good as you are shipped to hell onboard the train with shackles.... that model of business is dead and if it is the future, I dont want any part of it.
The IO misspelling in the Important word is deliberate. A sort of a computerese word for Input/Output. I say garbage in garbage out.
However, The draconian restrictions listed by ebay pretty much squeezes out the giggling 8 year old playing ebay game on daddy's computer or perhaps those who have no intention of paying anything for anything. Credit cards have a way of making sure that the buyer or seller is something that can be chased down and nailed to the wall by ebay security should a buyer whine about the mashed box off the UPS brown truck.
Cash only or I go home.
I might just go home lolz.
I don't understand a buyer's hesitation in using PayPal. As far as I know, the SELLER pays all the fees when a buyer uses their services. I have my account set up to allow debit and credit cards, for a one time minimal fee. I don't have a store, just a load of MRR stuff I've bought over the years that I have decided will never get built or installed on my layout.
For my purposes, the change in payment method is great. There have been times I've waited weeks for a money order to get to me. Almost always I have to query the buyer as to the status of his payment when he uses a money order.
Almosts always I get payment within two days when PayPal is used. The transaction is far cleaner and quicker that way.
Another change that eBay is making is that I, as a seller, don't like is that I can no longer post comments on dealing with a customer. Most customers have been absolutely fabulous, and there have been one or two stinkers. Seems pretty one-sided to me.
Maybe where you live, care to guess how many public train shows we have here per year?
....one.
...and they kinda frown on selling bike part and furniture at those shows
People, it's called TRAIN SHOW.
Good deals, sometimes can be great with decent stuff too.
Also known as real modelers ebay...
As a frequent purchaser and rare seller on Ebay I very torn by this, I have payed thru Paypal but as a very infrequent seller, I'm torn at the notion of having to accept Paypal only because it means I have to set up a payment account as well, which means I'll likely have to use a different credit account for both now. In the past when I sold I accepted MO only. It was most convenient for me, I could cash the MO and have the money in my pocket, I cant do that with an electronic payment, its all on some card account somewhere, that makes easily accessing the funds a bigger PITA, not to mention EVERYONE who gets a nibble of my money, Ebay, Paypal, the bank or credit card company, jezzez, seams the whole stinking system is rigged to take a few pennies out of my pocket every time I do anything now.
Tracklayer wrote: I figured that was eventually going to happen one day. I also recently heard a rumor that WalMart, Academy and a number of other businesses are going to stop accepting personal checks and will only accept cash or debit cards as payment anymore.As for eBay. I've never liked having to deal with sellers that only accept money orders or personal checks. I like taking care of the transaction on the spot and getting my item as soon as possible...Tracklayer
As for eBay. I've never liked having to deal with sellers that only accept money orders or personal checks. I like taking care of the transaction on the spot and getting my item as soon as possible...
Tracklayer
In essence Wal Mart has alread done so when they started their electronic check program. They don't actually accept personal checks now, but they scan the check and debit your account like a debit car esentially.
I can understand why ebay is doing away with personal checks. When I sell on ebay I never accept them because it is too easy to rip a seller off with a bad check. I do not understand the problem with postal or bank-drawn money orders, however. I have always accepted them and many time used them as payment and have never had a problem.
Ron
Owner and superintendant of the N scale Texas Colorado & Western Railway, a protolanced representaion of the BNSF from Fort Worth, TX through Wichita Falls TX and into Colorado.
Check out the TC&WRy on at https://www.facebook.com/TCWRy
Check out my MRR How-To YouTube channel at https://www.youtube.com/c/RonsTrainsNThings
Checks only came into being because carrying and sending large amounts of cash became impractical.
Realistically, if you can do the same kind of transactions electronically, why use paper checks? With the advent of electronic bill-paying, checks are rapidly going the way of the dodo.
One of the last barriers was providing person-to-person electronic transfers. I don't take MasterCard or debit cards myself, but I'm not a retailer, so why should I? But, I've got a PayPal account, so in theory I can now accept electronic payments.
How many of us have done away with the expense of our land-line telephones in favor of cell phones? It won't be long before checking accounts, with their monthly fees, will start looking like opportunities to save money, too.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
RicHamilton wrote: BRAKIE wrote:in a store that had a notice on the door and it read:As of August 1st we will no longer accept personal or payroll checks.Thank You.Or words closely to that..I was shocked..Well, working with small town stores, one of them had accepeted a government cheque as payment for fuel and cigarettes. The difference was refunded in cash to the customer. Making them use a portion of the cheque to buy goods instore is usual business practice around here and government cheques are never bad are they? Retailer deposited the cheque the next day and found out that a stop payment had been issued on the cheque because the cheque recepient had told the issuer they had lost it and had already been issued a second one. The store is now out the money from the cheque and the goods. And people wonder why stores won't accept any cheques
BRAKIE wrote:in a store that had a notice on the door and it read:As of August 1st we will no longer accept personal or payroll checks.Thank You.Or words closely to that..I was shocked..
in a store that had a notice on the door and it read:
Well, working with small town stores, one of them had accepeted a government cheque as payment for fuel and cigarettes. The difference was refunded in cash to the customer. Making them use a portion of the cheque to buy goods instore is usual business practice around here and government cheques are never bad are they? Retailer deposited the cheque the next day and found out that a stop payment had been issued on the cheque because the cheque recepient had told the issuer they had lost it and had already been issued a second one.
The store is now out the money from the cheque and the goods. And people wonder why stores won't accept any cheques
I understand the bad apple part..However..How about the millions of good apples? Going to penalized them?
"Rust, whats not to love?"
I would agree that PayPal is the better payment method. EXCEPT: PayPal fees to sellers are excessive, and I suspect many sellers add to their shipping and handling to cover those excessive fees.
Ebay does not have much competition. However, Amazon has independant sellers of new and used railroad and model railroad books. Good selction of books, too.
I've been eBaying since 1999, mostly as a seller. In my last round of auctions, I specified PayPal only. Getting payment real quick and having the items gone right away are a whole lot more convenient to me that waiting until a buyer gets the time to go and buy a money order then sending it. Some money order users would take several weeks to send their payments, and mail to me here in Canada takes longer to get here than domestic US mail. So instant PayPal payments are a whole lot better. And with all of the Internet scams around, it seems to be pretty easy these days for the criminal types to duplicate money orders, bank drafts, etc.
And don't forget the cost of money orders, here local banks and the post office charge several dollars for them, and then there is the cost of the stamp to mail them. It all adds up.
There's also a 10 page thread on this topic on the Atlas forum as well .... seems to be very mixed feelings regarding thse upcoming changes.
"Sellers will enjoy the benefit of millions of confident buyers as we make the following changes"
I think that this sentence says alot. The site has developed a reputation for being a place to get ripped off. If the buying public is losing confidence in the place and leaving in droves then they need to reverse that trend.
Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum
downtowndeco wrote: Let's be honest. They're the main game in town (as far as on line auctions). True, there may be sites that charge less or have rules you like better but who ever goes to them?
Let's be honest. They're the main game in town (as far as on line auctions). True, there may be sites that charge less or have rules you like better but who ever goes to them?
And lets be honest and thats why they do it but think its kinda calling monoplizing isn't lol
I sell stuff on ebay every now and then & I'm OK with what they charge. I've sold stuff on ebay (for good money) that I couldn't give away at local train shows. If you tell me you're gonna charge me .35 to help cordinate a $50.00 sale to a guy in France I'll say "Thank you!".
That's one way of monopolizing on every transaction.Auction fee + Pay Pal fee=double whammy!
Seems the buyer has no choice-ebay's way or no way..
Yea, Ebay is nothing like it was nine years ago.
i never buy anything on ebay if the vendor doesn't accept paypal , so that doesn't affect me .
i can see how some or all of those new 'steps' will hurt some vendors , mostly the people who are actually selling items they have rather than running a store on ebay like so many of the listings are now
isn't interesting how every time some big company finds some way to screw the little guy they word the announcement as if they were doing them a big favour ?
ernie
Am I surprised? NO.
Am I appaled? YES.
Do I accept anything other than PayPal when I am a seller? Not usually.