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Kadee couplers, E-7 and 18" turns question?

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  • Member since
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  • From: Maryville IL
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Kadee couplers, E-7 and 18" turns question?
Posted by cudaken on Saturday, March 24, 2007 12:45 AM

 Have a PK 2 E-7 and it like to drop it load in a turn, a 18" and a 20" up a grade. At frist it was fine but the first led car I used was car was a tyco Old Dutch Hopper I bulit and the Kadee #5 and box was mounted to far toward the center of the hopper so it was short but the E-7 seems to like it. Hooked a Athearn 50 box car with a #5 as its lead car and unhooks in the turns.

 This a 3 part question.

 1 I want to added a B power unit, what Kadee sould I use?

 2 What Kadee should be on the rear of the B unit or the A if I want to use a Athearn with a 5?

 3 Coupler height. I replaced the stock coupler that came with the PK2 E-7. First I used a #5 and it was to low. I then used a #27 and it is to high? Is there a driffrent number I should use?

   I know I am a bit of a pain but I am getting much better. 18" turns will be gone in a few months I hope.

                      Cuda Ken

I hate Rust

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Posted by bogp40 on Saturday, March 24, 2007 1:10 AM
 cudaken wrote:

 Have a PK 2 E-7 and it like to drop it load in a turn, a 18" and a 20" up a grade. At frist it was fine but the first led car I used was car was a tyco Old Dutch Hopper I bulit and the Kadee #5 and box was mounted to far toward the center of the hopper so it was short but the E-7 seems to like it. Hooked a Athearn 50 box car with a #5 as its lead car and unhooks in the turns.

 This a 3 part question.

 1 I want to added a B power unit, what Kadee sould I use?

 2 What Kadee should be on the rear of the B unit or the A if I want to use a Athearn with a 5?

 3 Coupler height. I replaced the stock coupler that came with the PK2 E-7. First I used a #5 and it was to low. I then used a #27 and it is to high? Is there a driffrent number I should use?

   I know I am a bit of a pain but I am getting much better. 18" turns will be gone in a few months I hope.

                      Cuda Ken

Ken,

Don't beat yourself up worrying about trying to make these coupler combinations work when your going to loose the tight 18" curves. Your entire problem is the tight radius. Short of using a swing coupler pocket and a long coupler you will be experiencing derailments.  When the turns get tight the only way to have dependable operation of the couplers is to have fairly close matched loco/car lengths that have the truck to coupler distances nearly equal. Yhis and loner shank may make the cars stay coupled. On real bad mismatches the E unit could actually derail the short car behind.

You will have to treat the rear of the B unit the same as the rear of the A.

Modeling B&O- Chessie  Bob K.  www.ssmrc.org

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Posted by jackn2mpu on Saturday, March 24, 2007 6:47 AM
 cudaken wrote:

 Have a PK 2 E-7 and it like to drop it load in a turn, a 18" and a 20" up a grade. At first it was fine but the first led car I used was car was a tyco Old Dutch Hopper I built and the Kadee #5 and box was mounted too far toward the center of the hopper so it was short but the E-7 seems to like it. Hooked a Athearn 50 box car with a #5 as its lead car and unhooks in the turns.

 This a 3 part question.

 1 I want to added a B power unit, what Kadee sould I use?

 2 What Kadee should be on the rear of the B unit or the A if I want to use a Athearn with a 5?

 3 Coupler height. I replaced the stock coupler that came with the PK2 E-7. First I used a #5 and it was to low. I then used a #27 and it is to high? Is there a driffrent number I should use?

   I know I am a bit of a pain but I am getting much better. 18" turns will be gone in a few months I hope.

                      Cuda Ken

Ken:

When I got serious about using Kadees with my P2K E units I milled off the bump on the tang on the P2K frame and drilled and tapped a hole for a 2-56 screw to mount a Kadee coupler in it's own box. I know I used a long shank in the pilot position and a medium shank in the rear. Can't remember off-hand if they were straight or over or under-set couplers. Each P2K frame is different, and they may NOT be the same on each end of the frame.

The nice thing with using a Kadee in it's own box is that the coupler will be insulated from the frame so you don't have to worry about electrical shorts from one frame to the other. At the rear of the A unit frame and on each end of the B unit use a #5-type coupler, just watch the height and use a Kadee coupler height gauge to check it. That may be part of the problem why your loco wants to uncouple from following rolling stock. One of the best investments one can make, to my way of thinking, when doing couplers is to have on hand the Kadee #13 test assortment kit (the new one, not the old one, as the old one didn't have the over and under set shank couplers) and a Kadee coupler height gauge, which I believe is now sold separately from the #13 kit of which it used to be a part.

de N2MPU Jack

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God, guns, and rock and roll!

Modeling the NYC/NYNH&H in HO and CPRail/D&H in N

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Posted by jeffrey-wimberly on Saturday, March 24, 2007 7:05 AM
I use Kadee #5's on everything, including my P2K E units and haven't had any problems with couplers coming uncoupled on the curves, and all my curves are 18" radius. I don't know how old your E units are but all mine have swinging coupler pockets, as does my P2K PA1. I also modified an AC4400 so that the coupler pockets on it swing.

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Posted by jbloch on Saturday, March 24, 2007 7:18 AM

Go to kadee.com and check the conversion list--pretty extensive list that covers most locos--the 20 series are reccommended for your E7: 26(long centerset shank) for the pilot and 23(short centerset shank) for the rear.

Jim 

  • Member since
    December 2001
  • From: San Jose, California
  • 3,154 posts
Posted by nfmisso on Saturday, March 24, 2007 8:55 AM

As mentioned above, get a Kadee #205 height guage.

The conversion information on the website should only be considered as a starting point, it is based on a very small sample - often just one - and does not take into account any variation in production.

With models as long as an E-unit, the vertical curve (aka grade transition) is EXTREMELY important.  Meaure your layout, then apply some basic high school geometry to figure out you large the coupler heads need to be so that they will not uncouple enter/leaving the grade.  It is highly likely that you will find that there in practical solution with the abruptness of the grade change you have.

Nigel N&W in HO scale, 1950 - 1955 (..and some a bit newer too) Now in San Jose, California

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