Guys Remember this..A lot of us old gray and white beards seen steams last days,first generation diesels,we saw the end of the cab units..We saw GP30s when they was new and the other "look alike diesels of the 60s.
Its 2007 time and railroads march on..While fallen flags are many it had to come about in order for railroads to survive in the shipping world..You see no longer would shippers accept their car taking 3-4 weeks to go from Boston to Kansas City.Mega mergers help cut interchange and yard dwell time as did run through trains..Thats how the railroads recovered.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
I suppose, Tracklayer, that we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm not that much younger than you are (less than a decade, anyway), but I just don't feel the same way as you do. I did grow up in a time when kids would walk out of the door after breakfast, and barely make it back in time for supper, and nobody had the National Guard out to find them or worried that they'd been grabbed by some perv in a white van. Kids could ride their bikes without helmets and knee pads and supplemental restraint sytems, in short, a much simpler time, and it was only 20 years ago.
I won't try to defend the modern world; it's getting to ba a crummy world, alright. But I also wouldn't want to live without my modern conveniences.
At least you know I won't be competing with you when you go to buy your next big steamer!
Regards,
Mike
I've got 2 sound-equipped engines, one steam and one diesel, and another of each on the way. For sheer excitement, a sound-equipped steamer has it all over the diesel, even my favorite old Alco RS-3.
If you haven't gone into sound, or if you are undecided about which era to model, you owe it to yourself to visit your LHS or a train show and listen to a state-of-the-art, sound-equipped steam engine. It may not change your mind, but it will sure start you thinking.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Mikeymbca wrote: I suppose, Tracklayer, that we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm not that much younger than you are (less than a decade, anyway), but I just don't feel the same way as you do. I did grow up in a time when kids would walk out of the door after breakfast, and barely make it back in time for supper, and nobody had the National Guard out to find them or worried that they'd been grabbed by some perv in a white van. Kids could ride their bikes without helmets and knee pads and supplemental restraint sytems, in short, a much simpler time, and it was only 20 years ago.I won't try to defend the modern world; it's getting to ba a crummy world, alright. But I also wouldn't want to live without my modern conveniences.At least you know I won't be competing with you when you go to buy your next big steamer!Regards,Mike
Thanks Mike. You know where I'm coming from... As for modern conveniences, I personally can live without them. I'm more or less a reclusive hermit and survivalist.
Tracklayer
Tracklayer wrote: Hi all. Not sure how you folks feel about it, but I'm personally no longer interested in modern day trains. I bet it's been six months or longer since I've even had a modern train on my layout... I find that I prefer the steam era between the late 1920s to the late 1940s, and sometimes the diesel era of the 1950s more than any others. Like many members have stated in the past, the great thing about modelling the 1950s is that one can have the best of both worlds...Tracklayer
Hi all. Not sure how you folks feel about it, but I'm personally no longer interested in modern day trains. I bet it's been six months or longer since I've even had a modern train on my layout... I find that I prefer the steam era between the late 1920s to the late 1940s, and sometimes the diesel era of the 1950s more than any others. Like many members have stated in the past, the great thing about modelling the 1950s is that one can have the best of both worlds...
JUST LIKE ME!
I used to be torn between modern and the steam/transition era until I realized today's motive power is souless. Everything had more character back in the day.
"Being misunderstood is the fate of all true geniuses"
EXPERIMENTATION TO BRING INNOVATION
http://community.webshots.com/album/288541251nntnEK?start=588
AggroJones wrote: Tracklayer wrote: Hi all. Not sure how you folks feel about it, but I'm personally no longer interested in modern day trains. I bet it's been six months or longer since I've even had a modern train on my layout... I find that I prefer the steam era between the late 1920s to the late 1940s, and sometimes the diesel era of the 1950s more than any others. Like many members have stated in the past, the great thing about modelling the 1950s is that one can have the best of both worlds...Tracklayer JUST LIKE ME! I used to be torn between modern and the steam/transition era until I realized today's motive power is souless. Everything had more character back in the day.
Thank you Aggro. Glad to know I'm not the only one in the world that feels this way.
I'm not old enough to remember steam, so for me it's diesels or nothing. On the other hand, I like diesels that were built in the 1940s and 1950s. The carbodies were more stylish than the rather uniform-looking low nose diesels that followed.
I model the era I most fondly remember - the mid-1970s. That was when I had my first taste of railfanning and there were a lot of first generation diesels still in operation.
What I do find a little strange is how many modelers are either into the steam era (1950s and earlier) or the so-called 'modern' era where low nose and wide cab diesels are dominant (1980s to present). I somehow sense there aren't enough of us 'in between' modelers.
Dave Vollmer wrote: I second that... With energy issues coming back to the forefront of concern, you can't deny how much more fuel efficient per ton mile railroads are than trucks. Trucks are also tearing up our highway system. It's to everyone's (but the truckers') interest to put more tonnage on trains.The same could be argued for Amtrak. Instead of cutting funding, we should be paying more for Amtrak. Think of how much the government dumped on the airlines to bail them out when they went backrupt. The skies are packed just like the highways (I know, I'm also a private pilot). More Amtrak routes would mean less crowded skies and less government spending overall.Many people would consider riding Amtrak if only Amtrak ran near them. The current structure is designed to fail, because the current government doesn't want to be in the railroad business. I like that states like North Carolina, California, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Maryland, etc. are stepping in with much-needed dollars.I like modern trains with one excetion... Trains look wrong without a caboose. Conrail and the Long Island Rail Road were still using cabooses (cabin cars) when I was growing up, and I miss them. Modern trains are like a sentence without a period. Otherwise, I'm very impressed with the massive diesels and huge cars of today's trains.
I second that... With energy issues coming back to the forefront of concern, you can't deny how much more fuel efficient per ton mile railroads are than trucks. Trucks are also tearing up our highway system. It's to everyone's (but the truckers') interest to put more tonnage on trains.
The same could be argued for Amtrak. Instead of cutting funding, we should be paying more for Amtrak. Think of how much the government dumped on the airlines to bail them out when they went backrupt. The skies are packed just like the highways (I know, I'm also a private pilot). More Amtrak routes would mean less crowded skies and less government spending overall.
Many people would consider riding Amtrak if only Amtrak ran near them. The current structure is designed to fail, because the current government doesn't want to be in the railroad business. I like that states like North Carolina, California, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Maryland, etc. are stepping in with much-needed dollars.
I like modern trains with one excetion... Trains look wrong without a caboose. Conrail and the Long Island Rail Road were still using cabooses (cabin cars) when I was growing up, and I miss them. Modern trains are like a sentence without a period. Otherwise, I'm very impressed with the massive diesels and huge cars of today's trains.
Last year I saw a news feature about regional buslines that were becoming very popular because they could take passengers from downtown to downtown in the major cities with more convenience and less hassle than they could fly and switch to ground transportation. The bus company they focused on had its hub in Chicago but these regional carriers were becoming more popular everywhere. Passenger trains could do the same on a larger basis if there was enough of a public demand for it. Cross country train travel has lost its appeal for all but the most serious railroad fan but a network of regional train routes integrated with airline hubs and other ground transportation could work. Train travel works on the northeast corridor. It could work elsewhere as well with intelligent planning. Instead of subsidizing Amtrak as it is, we should be using trains to do what they do best, carry passengers on short hauls from one major metropolitan area to another as part of a nationwide transportation system.
aloco wrote: I'm not old enough to remember steam, so for me it's diesels or nothing. On the other hand, I like diesels that were built in the 1940s and 1950s. The carbodies were more stylish than the rather uniform-looking low nose diesels that followed. I model the era I most fondly remember - the mid-1970s. That was when I had my first taste of railfanning and there were a lot of first generation diesels still in operation. What I do find a little strange is how many modelers are either into the steam era (1950s and earlier) or the so-called 'modern' era where low nose and wide cab diesels are dominant (1980s to present). I somehow sense there aren't enough of us 'in between' modelers.
Personally I like the 70s that was a era of the short line IPD boxcars and the rebirth of Eastern railroads from ashes of bankrupt railroads to Conrail...I think most modelers has forgotten the conditions the Eastern railroads was in.Even the 60s saw the Eastern railroads in bad shape except for a very few..
BRAKIE wrote:I use to think that way myself till I was track side and watch two SD70MACS start a train..First the motors wound up,then the ground begin to vibrate then I begin to feel the raw power of those units through my body..Yup..Nothing change except locomotive types.
Sounds like the same thrill I got when I went on vacation out to Florida a number of years ago and toured NASA, and experienced a very life like reconstruction of the Apollo rocket blasting off for the moon. It was awsome... But I've not ever felt that way about modern locos. Sorry.
Just a Hobo wrote: Phasing out railroads ??? I doubt it ... do you know how many 18 wheelers with high paid drivers paying fuel costs ... overbloated CEO salaries and road use taxes it would take to replace just one freight train ? They'll modernize engines I'm sure .... but eliminate rail ... I'd say never .
The revenue from freight hauling on rails is at an all-time high. I don't see railroads going the way of the dinosaur anytime soon, or anytime later, for that matter.
The only thing that would truly kill railroads is if they invented a system where we had flying trains (not mag-lev, I mean trains that repulsed gravity and flew in the air). But since science is so far behind on the flying car, I wouldn't bet on that one either.
Let's see now..... I remember when Cokes were a nickle and gas sold for around 28 cents a gallon. Remember those little wax 'coke' bottles with sugar water in them? In the small town I grew up in getting into the theatre, a box of popcorn and a coke on Saturaday would set you back a whole quarter. And that was on a Saturaday afternoon with a double feature, a 'serial' and a Tom and Jerry cartoon. I remember the last of the steam engines, but vaguely. I like having them on my layout but I like the diesels also. I have an Atlas Dash 8-30w that has great sound.
I'm just really screwed up, I guess. At my age I'm supposed to love steam... which I like, and not care for the modern diesels... which I like also, they just maybe don't have the romanticsim that a huffing an puffing steam engine has.
You know, I think I'd like model steamers a Lot more if we could have smoke units that didn't foul up every thing on the layout. I do miss watching the tremendous belches of smoke coming from the stack and all the steam from around the drive wheels.
Is there a group therapy session for people like me?
JaRRell
jacon12 wrote: You know, I think I'd like model steamers a Lot more if we could have smoke units that didn't foul up every thing on the layout. I do miss watching the tremendous belches of smoke coming from the stack and all the steam from around the drive wheels.Is there a group therapy session for people like me?JaRRell
Yes, I have found solace and understanding from the nice therapists @...
http://www.broadway-limited.com/
I model modern day as that encompasses the vast majority of my 41 years on this planet. I mainly model business trains of the western railroads but, when the UP runs the 844 or 3985, 949/951/963 or 6936 thru Topeka, I'm out to photograph the trains regardless of the type of locomotive. They all get me going. But, I don't model the steam engines as they aren't continously run but, I do have BLI's ATSF 3751
Ch
MP 53 on the BNSF Topeka Sub
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
The 4-track Pennsy mainline, now 3-track Norfolk Southern, goes through my hometown...
Option 1: Model the current Norfolk Southern's original all-black paint scheme, or; the 1950s Pennsy with Tuscan Red, Brunswick Green, TrucTrains, Sharknose, coal hoppers, diesel, k-4 steam, and virtually every major class 1 roadname in their consists?
Option 2: Model the current Norfolk Southern's exciting all-black paint scheme, or; the post-1968 Penn Central merger - with Pennsylvania, New York Central, and Penn Central - three color schemes to choose from?
Option 3: Model the current Norfolk Southern's versatile all-black paint scheme, or; the post-1976 Conrail merger - with Penn Central, Ann Arbor, Erie Lackawanna, Lehigh & Hudson, Reading, Lehigh Valley, Central New Jersey, and New Haven - plus Pennsylvania & New York Central - eleven color schemes smorgasboard?
Conemaugh Road & Traction circa 1956
tgindy wrote: The 4-track Pennsy mainline, now 3-track Norfolk Southern, goes through my hometown...Option 1: Model the current Norfolk Southern's original all-black paint scheme, or; the 1950s Pennsy with Tuscan Red, Brunswick Green, TrucTrains, Sharknose, coal hoppers, diesel, k-4 steam, and virtually every major class 1 roadname in their consists? Option 2: Model the current Norfolk Southern's exciting all-black paint scheme, or; the post-1968 Penn Central merger - with Pennsylvania, New York Central, and Penn Central - three color schemes to choose from? Option 3: Model the current Norfolk Southern's versatile all-black paint scheme, or; the post-1976 Conrail merger - with Penn Central, Ann Arbor, Erie Lackawanna, Lehigh & Hudson, Reading, Lehigh Valley, Central New Jersey, and New Haven - plus Pennsylvania & New York Central - eleven color schemes smorgasboard?SO: Is it current-day Norfolk Southern with non-flatcar intermodals? Or 1950s Pennsylvania? Or 1960s Penn Central? Or 1970s Conrail? Hmmm? Which one should be eliminated from consideration first?
SO: Is it current-day Norfolk Southern with non-flatcar intermodals? Or 1950s Pennsylvania? Or 1960s Penn Central? Or 1970s Conrail? Hmmm? Which one should be eliminated from consideration first?
Actually all three have their place..
Having worked on the PRR I will be the first to shout it left a lot to be desired..The cabin cars was drafty and cold in the winter and the locomotive failure rate during a run was 40-50%..Alcos had the highest failure rate including the Century series.As far as locomotives they was filthy and the freight cars of that era was bland seeing the majority was boxcar red or freight car brown..The ROW was filthy and a health hazard seeing that human waste dropped from passenger cars every time the toilet was flush.
As far as steam locomotive as my Grandfather would say "Any fool that likes a steam locomotive never had to fire one." Also steam locomotives was a costly item to maintain and thus they went to scrap.
The 60s saw the majority of the Eastern railroads in dire shape and near bankrupt and rake with woes to include bad track,locomotive failures was still high and that lead to the downfall of the early diesel as they was worn out.Enter the "cry of all diesels look alike" from those the unlearn.
Say and think as you will but,I have spent a life time studying railroads and having worked on the railroad I can assure you railroads are stronger and healthier today then they were in the 50s and 60s-and less trashy looking..
Many times I have watched one hundred cars plus of double stacks or trailer trains being lugged through Flagstaff, Arizona on the old Sante Fe railroad by six hard working diesel lashups. Boring isn't the word for it. Every car alike. AND, no caboose. What a travesty!
Can't hold a candle to watching a New Haven L-1 2-10-2 steamer or an ALCO FA-FB-FB-FA lashup hauling a mixed freight of 100 cars from Maybrook, NY to New Haven, CT or 3 ancient EF-1 electrics hauling a similar consist up from the Hudson River float docks.
Every conceivable car in tow, reefers, boxes, hoppers, tanks, flats, gons, and ALWAYS a caboose.
Those were the days. Too bad, most of you guys are too young to have witnessed it, so there is no way for you to make the comparison. No I don't yearn for those days, but that was RAILROADING then, I don't know what to call present day freight hauling. More like a pipeline, I guess.