Highliner body shell kit

[electrolove]

Can someone please explain what Highliner means. How does it differ from a Athearn Genesis F9 or a Stewart F9 body?

http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/328-1005

[csmith9474]

The Genesis F9 is a Highliner shell on an Athearn chassis and drive. Stewart has a nicely detailed body, but the Highliners are definately better, in my opinion.

[Texas Zepher]

QUOTE: Originally posted by electrolove
Can someone please explain what Highliner means.

It doesn't mean anything it is a brand name of a product just like Kato and Altas.
The concept was that you could take one of their base shells and easily and accurately re-create any F2-F9 ever built.

QUOTE: How does it differ from a Athearn Genesis F9 or a Stewart F9 body?

The bodies used on the Genesis ARE Highliners so there is absolutely no difference.

The Stewart F9 bodies have much less detail.

[Don Gibson]

ATHEARN bought the Highliner Dies and part of the deal was Highliner get's exclusivity right's to market the undecorated shell's (their original business).

What has transpired since then is anybody's guess. Highliner's owner has been indifferent and short on performance. Neither Highliner nor Athearn sell decorated shells.

If you want a painted shell's or kit's, you'll have to go to Intermountain which has excellent shell's and a superior drive. intermountain's AT&SF 'Stainless Steel' look's less 'showy' but more prototypical than Athearn's chrome plating, but Athearn comes with CV lighting.

Those wanting perfection will spend the money and add a Richmond Control flashing Gyralight to their IM's. IM also make their F-7's in the later 'yellow' and 'blue' war bonnet schemes.

TO those Champion's of Genesis engine's: I have 15. So far Two motor's have gone bad in the box, and a third won't stay on the track. They're more for SHOW than go.

[Paul3]

Don,
How can you say Lubliner (owner of Highliner) is indifferent and short of performance? What examples can you bring forth of his behavior?

And, "Neither Highliner nor Athearn sell decorated shells." ??? Surely, you must have mis-typed because Athearn's been almost releasing a new painted Genesis F-unit every month for the last year or so. Highliner only sells undec.'s, Athearn only sells painted units.

IM's "excellent" shells are not as good as the Highliner shell, sorry. It's been said that the Highliner shell is the most accurate HO F-unit ever made in any medium...including brass. As far as IM having a "superior" drive...IMHO, Kato's F-unit drive under the Stewart F's are the best, Athearn second, IM third.

And last I checked, Athearn's "chrome" looks more like stainless steel than IM's paint does.

Also, for those with DCC, you don't need Richmond Control's circuit, just use a DH163 or simular decoder that can handle special lighting effects.

Finally, your "more show than go" comment... What's amusing is that Genesis SD70's are the current long distance champions at Chicago's giant layout having gone farther than any other loco they've tried before failure.

Paul A. Cutler III
*****************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*****************

[electrolove]

I did not know that Genesis F9 is a Highliner shell on an Athearn chassis and drive, interesting...

So the best thing must be to use a Stewart chassis and drive with a Highliner body? Then I get a superb running loco and good looking too.

Have someone tried that?

[nfmisso]

QUOTE: Originally posted by electrolove

So the best thing must be to use a Stewart chassis and drive with a Highliner body? Then I get a superb running loco and good looking too.

Have someone tried that?

Yes, very common, see almost any F-unit article in the mr mags since the Highliners came out.

The B unit came out first, there was a long delay before the A unit was available due to Paul being tied up with the movie Titanic

[wjstix]

I think what Don was saying about the shells is that you can't get decorated Highliner F unit bodies from Athearn separately - with the blue box Athearns, if you bought say an F-7, you could later buy a decorated shell for a different railroad or paintscheme by itself and put it on your powered chassis. Athearn only sells decorated F units, you can't buy RTR undecs or separate decorated shells/bodies. Highliners only sells the undecorated F unit body kits and detail sets.

[wjstix]

BTW if you search thru the Walthers website, you'll see (if they're in stock) you can order the A and B bodies with all the detail parts included to made any F2-F9 engine, the link/pics above are to the shells alone.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by electrolove

I did not know that Genesis F9 is a Highliner shell on an Athearn chassis and drive, interesting...

So the best thing must be to use a Stewart chassis and drive with a Highliner body? Then I get a superb running loco and good looking too.

Have someone tried that?

I purchased about twenty Highliner shells when they were first available about fifteen years or so ago. Only the B units were available from Highliner until Athearn came along, but I mounted them on Stewart drives by Kato. They are the best of both worlds and just continue to run.

You can use the Proto 1000 drive units also, but you have to work on the close coupling details to use them. The Proto 1000 drives are great runners and deserve a lot of respect, but the shells are very dated and not current. The great thing about these is they were blowing them out for twenty bucks only last year.

When Athearn came along and purchased the rights to market the A and B units, I was excited about the project until I started to run some of them. The first Athearn drive units were poor at best and some were so erratic, I replaced those with Kato drives.
I soon learned and complained to Athearn about the problems and they always offered to fix them if I would send them in. I always refused and started replacing the out of round wheels and gear sets with the Kato wheel sets. This actually fixed most of the erratic running qualities of the first year Athearn units. They have since upgraded the wheel sets and gears and advertised that they upgraded the drive train on the F units. I do own some of the latest ones, read last year, and they do run better without too many problems.

The fact remains that the Highliner shells are probably the best in the market today and have set standards that few other can meet. My Overland and Oriental F units certainly take a back seat overall to the Genesis looks.

The Intermountain shells are great also, but one cut below the Athearn shells. The Genesis line does have the stainless plating for the units that require that look and it is as good as it gets. The Intermountain drive is excellent and they should get credit for their efforts also.

I keep wondering, how many more F units can we stand with BLI now bringing in a complete set of F7's and I believe they will do F3's also. Maybe Lionel will come back into the HO market and finally build an F unit. Sorry about that comment.

There must be an unwritten rule that you must make an F unit to be known!!

[Texas Zepher]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Paul3
How can you say Lubliner (owner of Highliner) is indifferent and short of performance? What examples can you bring forth of his behavior?

That is easy, they advertised like mad for almost three years before they finally got the B unit out. The forever again for an A unit. I had never even seen an A before the Genesis.

I guess this is not uncommon though. There was the "Bulldog" chassis for the SD40, and most recently the almost three year wait for the Soundtraxx Tsunami.

QUOTE: Originally posed by Don Gibson
If you want a painted shell's or kit's, you'll have to go to Intermountain which has excellent shell's.

I partially disagree. I find the plastic in the nose too thin and they have to be painted black on the inside or the headlight glows through.

[Paul3]

Texas Zephyr,
Please note that Don Gibson was talking about Lubliner being "indifferent and short on performance" after Athearn bought the rights to the Highliner shell. Sure, you could make a case that Lubliner was "indifferent" before his models hit the market (I mean, it was a running joke at our club: "Will there be a Highliner A-unit before or after the Red Sox win the World Series?"). But how can one accuse Lubliner of being "indifferent" after his model hit the market and is commonly available?

Paul Cutler III
***************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
***************

[electrolove]

QUOTE: Originally posted by bangert1

QUOTE: Originally posted by electrolove

I did not know that Genesis F9 is a Highliner shell on an Athearn chassis and drive, interesting...

So the best thing must be to use a Stewart chassis and drive with a Highliner body? Then I get a superb running loco and good looking too.

Have someone tried that?

I purchased about twenty Highliner shells when they were first available about fifteen years or so ago. Only the B units were available from Highliner until Athearn came along, but I mounted them on Stewart drives by Kato. They are the best of both worlds and just continue to run.

You can use the Proto 1000 drive units also, but you have to work on the close coupling details to use them. The Proto 1000 drives are great runners and deserve a lot of respect, but the shells are very dated and not current. The great thing about these is they were blowing them out for twenty bucks only last year.

When Athearn came along and purchased the rights to market the A and B units, I was excited about the project until I started to run some of them. The first Athearn drive units were poor at best and some were so erratic, I replaced those with Kato drives.
I soon learned and complained to Athearn about the problems and they always offered to fix them if I would send them in. I always refused and started replacing the out of round wheels and gear sets with the Kato wheel sets. This actually fixed most of the erratic running qualities of the first year Athearn units. They have since upgraded the wheel sets and gears and advertised that they upgraded the drive train on the F units. I do own some of the latest ones, read last year, and they do run better without too many problems.

The fact remains that the Highliner shells are probably the best in the market today and have set standards that few other can meet. My Overland and Oriental F units certainly take a back seat overall to the Genesis looks.

The Intermountain shells are great also, but one cut below the Athearn shells. The Genesis line does have the stainless plating for the units that require that look and it is as good as it gets. The Intermountain drive is excellent and they should get credit for their efforts also.

I keep wondering, how many more F units can we stand with BLI now bringing in a complete set of F7's and I believe they will do F3's also. Maybe Lionel will come back into the HO market and finally build an F unit. Sorry about that comment.

There must be an unwritten rule that you must make an F unit to be known!!

Does the Highliner body fit on a Stewart drive without any modification?

Is it possible to just buy the Stewart drive or must I buy the complete Stewart loco with drive and body?

[Anonymous]

Electrolove

You can mount the highliner shells directly on the old Stewart drives, but I cannot answer if the one built now are identical in every way. I had the drives built by Kato for Stewart and the shell fit tightly on them.

Maybe someone else on here could answer your question completly. Most all of the shell will interchanged with slight modifications to the guide pins inside, if they have slots or guide pins. The highliner shells do not have them, so they will just about fit on anything with little effort.

You can also purchase the Genesis drive chassis without a shell. I picked up some of those also just to have some spare parts and plan to use them for other projects, like my remaining unpainted Highliner shells.

[wjstix]

You can get the Stewart F unit drive by itself from Stewart or other sources. You see them sometimes on ebay, although you might get a better deal just buying an F-unit. I found a good deal on one where the guy had started to strip the paint off an F-3 then gave up. Body shell was a mess but the drive was great and I paid quite a bit less than the drive by itself would normally sell for !!

BTW not sure about Highliners being "commonly available", Walthers has been out of stock on the A units since late Nov / early Dec and the expected date on them coming back in stock is "unknown". I want to get one for an F2 to go with an FT A-B set I have. (It looks like I could get the shell and all the detail parts as separate purchases, but it would cost more than just buying the A unit and detail package.)[:(!]

http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/328-1001[:)]

[Don Gibson]

Paul III: Close, but no Cigar.

QUOTE: Originally posted by Paul3
Don,
How can you say Lubliner (owner of Highliner) is indifferent and short of performance? What examples can you bring forth of his behavior?

Recent multiple post's on this forum ... "Out of stock" (Longtime), "Doesn't answer Email's"(repeatedly).No answer's. How about Ignoring customer's?

QUOTE: And, "Neither Highliner nor Athearn sell decorated shells." ??? Surely, you must have mis-typed because Athearn's been almost releasing a new painted Genesis F-unit every month for the last year or so. Highliner only sells undec.'s, Athearn only sells painted units.

'Surely' I typed Athearn doesn't "sell decorated SHELL'S" - (meaning 'separately') . Has this changed?

QUOTE: IM's "excellent" shells are not as good as the Highliner shell, sorry. It's been said that the Highliner shell is the most accurate HO F-unit ever made in any medium...including brass.

Are YOU saying that? I have both, and consider BOTH excellent.

As for interpretation of ATSF'S stainless steel panels - one being imatative paint - the other (imitative ) chrome plating - you are welcome to your opinion.

QUOTE: And last I checked, Athearn's "chrome" looks more like stainless steel than IM's paint does

If you visit the last remaing AT&SF 'war bonnet' sitting in the sun at Sacamento's RR Museum, as I have, I would welcome your 2'nd opinion.

QUOTE: As far as IM having a "superior" drive...IMHO, Kato's F-unit drive under the Stewart F's are the best, Athearn second, IM third.

I alway's thought STEWART copied their Kato drive (originally used on their unit's), and I.M. copied Stewart's. Perhap's I was mis-informed. (I have all 3).

QUOTE: Also, for those with DCC, you don't need Richmond Control's circuit, just use a DH163 or simular decoder that can handle special lighting effects.

TRUE, but it rquires DCC module ($) or (Richmond board) to do.

QUOTE: Finally, your "more show than go" comment... What's amusing is that Genesis SD70's are the current long distance champions at Chicago's giant layout having gone farther than any other loco they've tried before failure. -Paul A. Cutler III. *****************

Good for them. (About time). I was speaking solely about unit's I own. You?
3 'serious' deficiencies out of 15 unit's, is 20% - not exactly amusing -

[Don Gibson]

QUOTE: Originally posted by wjstix

BTW if you search thru the Walthers website, you'll see (if they're in stock) you can order the A and B bodies with all the detail parts included to made any F2-F9 engine, the link/pics above are to the shells alone.

PARTS to make the shell an F-2 to a F-9, yes, but it's still undecorated . Right?

Can I buy an F-9 painted in D&RGW dress? I cannot even buy a complete Genesis B unit separarely. I have tried.

[wjstix]

Right, it's still undecorated. Athearn uses Highliner bodies for their Genesis series of F units. They only offer them as decorated models - you can't buy them as RTR undec, nor can U buy the decorated bodies separately. Highliner only sells undec kits for A or B F units, they don't make assembled/painted ones.[:(]

BTW is this kinda you're looking for?? I guess this an F7 but it's close anyway. (Should be possible to change a few details to make it an F9.)



http://cgi.ebay.com/Highliner-F7A-D-RGW_W0QQitemZ6030573529QQcategoryZ484QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

This guy is also selling a DRGW decorated B-unit....[:)]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by wjstix

Right, it's still undecorated. Athearn uses Highliner bodies for their Genesis series of F units. They only offer them as decorated models - you can't buy them as RTR undec, nor can U buy the decorated bodies separately. Highliner only sells undec kits for A or B F units, they don't make assembled/painted ones.[:(]

BTW is this kinda you're looking for?? I guess this an F7 but it's close anyway. (Should be possible to change a few details to make it an F9.)



http://cgi.ebay.com/Highliner-F7A-D-RGW_W0QQitemZ6030573529QQcategoryZ484QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

This guy is also selling a DRGW decorated B-unit....[:)]

The F7A and F9A side panels are very different. The Highliners shell has both since the F9a has a filter in front of the 1st porthole.

Genesis has offered at least one set of F9's in D&RGW.

[Don Gibson]

bangert1

YES, but in Single Stripe 'B'. Thank's.

[Anonymous]

I think the newest, duel model decoder with sound, Genesis F units are the best on the market period!!. I have owned both brass and Stewert with the Kato drives, while they were nice and smooth running, the newest from Athearn outdoes them all, the details on the shell are museum quality, the duel mode decoder has the mars/gyralite effect even in standard DC mode. And the drive is a copy of a kato drive using a motor from Roco. The onboard sound and DCC are a brand new setup from MRC for Athearn and the sounds are right on, you might have to change the horn and bell rate for your particular unit and these are all programable from the factory. I remember the waiting to see if Highliners would do the A unit that never happened. As for the ATSF warbonnet being done correctly, from my digital photos of the real unit in CA and the model here in front of me, its the closest I have seen, almost perfect in my opinion. I just hope they reissue the Monon F3's with sound soon!! Cheers Mike

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by LGBF7

I I remember the waiting to see if Highliners would do the A unit that never happened. As for the ATSF warbonnet being done correctly, from my digital photos of the real unit in CA and the model here in front of me, its the closest I have seen, almost perfect in my opinion. I just hope they reissue the Monon F3's with sound soon!! Cheers Mike

The Highliner A unit was completed before Athearn puchased the project but it never reached the market as you said. It would seem that money might have been the issue, but most of us agree, they are the best. Paul's design and tooling is the best offered and I would like to see the E8 and E9's offered in kit or Genesis type form. We probably will not see the E series with this level of quality, but it would be nice.

Now that the Genesis line is out, the Highliner A and B units are available as shell kits only and really are nice to work with if you want certain detail that has not been offered in the Genesis line.

I would like to see the Highliner A units offered with plating like the older B units were offered so we can paint our own with the Stainless looking panels. .

[wjstix]

About those F7's - you could check with the guy selling them, if he's the one who painted them he might be willing to substitute the correct F9 sidepanels. Otherwise you might be able to do it yourself, it would just be taking the correct piece and painting it DRGW gold, and popping out the F7 panel and putting the correct F9 panel in place.

[Don Gibson]

LGBF7: Re: new Genesis 'F's.

IF the newest unit's have Sound, I'm wondering is they'll be compatible with the non- sound run's?

QSI's 'dual-mode' decoder requires approx 8 volts to activate in DC.