[quote user="Anonymous"]The older Rivarossi-AHM models had very deep wheel flanges, and the locomotives had noisy rough running motors.They are a collectors' item to some, but virtually never sought out for actual railroading.In the mid-to-late 70's, Rivarossi switched to ".039"flanges, which were not RP25 wheels, but at least they didn't bounce thru turnouts.AHM printed "with .039 flanges" on one end of the box on these newer units. Value is always whatever anyone is willing to pay.The suggestion to check ebay is good,it tells you what people are actually paying. I sell equipment at train shows several times a year. Most older AHM-Rivarossi steam locos go for the equiv. of (USD$) : Switchers $20-30 Pacifics, Hudsons $50-60 Articulateds $80-100 diesels $12-15 freight cars $2-3 lighted passenger cars $12-15"New in Box" of all these gets maybe 10-15% more $. Your 'made in Yugoslavia' models are made by Mehano, in Slovenia, who make a lot of stuff for IHC and for 'house-brand' grocery and hardware train sets.Not much value for 'old Mehano'. regards / Mike
I'm in Niagara Falls, NY and there is an outlet store here called Ollie's - kinda like Big Lots is becoming but not as organized. Anyway, for Christmas 2012 they had boxes of IHC kits for $5 and $6 each... I kick myself I didn't buy more. So cheap for scratch building.
I often reference my MR back issues for articles and recall recently coming across the 3-page AHM adverts someone mentioned... The problem with being in the hobby is remembering buying Varney and Athearn cars for a buck and a half! But then gas/oil was a heckuva lot cheaper too! So was milk & bread. I follow the manufacturing in China and how the buyouts in recent years plus the high oil prices have directly increased the cost of plastics whether in the model railroad field or elsewhere.
It seems many are becoming scratchbuilders for different reasons that the models of the 40's and 50's and it's not because the product isn't available - it's cuz it's gotten so expensive. Maybe the time/cost ratio is in par with today, but it's not with my pocketbook. Today, you really have to be patient and the deals come around. Just be ready or else you'll be waiting longer the next time around! www.facebook.com/justrains.group
Thread's got more lives than a cat. Nice link, btw.
Dave
Just be glad you don't have to press "2" for English.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQ_ALEdDUB8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hqFS1GZL4s
http://s73.photobucket.com/user/steemtrayn/media/MovingcoalontheDCM.mp4.html?sort=3&o=27
Eleven years old, apparently still relevant. Last summer I bought about a half dozen AHM cars from a hobby shop who landed an estate sale. I paid about 2 to 4 dolars each for some freight cars, just because they looked so nice in their original boxes.
I have a Mehano (IHC) 2-10-2 also, as well as four 2-6-0s They all run better than any Rivarossi ever did. Dan
About the 2-10-2´s: I still don´t have this model but I want to buy one these days. When searching around on the internet, I found out that there are 3 different versions of the 2-10-2. Or maybe it´s only 3 different styles of boxes but models might all have the same features, I don´t know:
Version 1: IHC COMMAND XXV box (part of their Premier Gold Series), engine is positioned above the tender.
Version 2: Mehano box (Part of their Prestige line), engine is positioned above the tender.
Version 3: Mehano, but which product line exactly it is I don´t know. But the tender is positioned behind the engine, so they are both in one line.
I´m asking myself now: are all these 3 versions DCC ready (also ready for speaker installation) and do they feature a metal frame, sprung drivers and a 5 pole skew wound can motor with brass flywheel?
To be honest I wanna buy that last version (version 3 (PRR)) because the seller doesn´t live too far away from me and offers a good price, so I really wanna go for this model. But the fact that the tender is positioned behind the engine and the fact that I can´t find photos of the outer box on the internet really makes me worry that it might be some old Mehano Train Line junk, although the sellers writes that the engine is DCC ready, what again makes me think that it might be identical with the ones being sold as Mehano Prestige and IHC Command XXV. Can somebody familiar with these models/manufacturers maybe clear that up for me?
I have an Erie version of this 2-10-2, one of the Command XXVs. It does not have a flywheel, and as for the 5 pole, I can't say for sure, but I think it's a 3 pole. I wouldn't let that stop me from purchasing it, because it runs like a 5 pole, smoothly and quietly even at decent low speeds. It draws very low current too. I run DC, and am happy with it's performance, and I've read that it runs better on DCC.
This locomotive was what made me go to the bother to make a turntable large enough to handle it.
That´s interesting because in all the descriptions that I read on the internet they say it has a flywheel. But 3 pole or 5 pole motor is not so important for me. There are some very good 3 pole motors around that indeed run like 5 pole motors like you say. And I heard and read many positive reviews about this model and every owner seems to be very satisfied with it´s running characteristics. Of course I plan to install a high quality DCC decoder with sound, so I hope it will be very good perfomer then. I will modify this PRR engine into a SP engine by replacing the tender with a correct SP hicken style oil tender, by modifying the cab a little bit, by overpainting the yellow cab lettering and red cab roof with black paint, by adding correct SP decals for the F5 class 2-10-2 on the cab, by painting the smokeboxdoor white, by adding some SP-sepcific detail on the pilot platform, by removing the original pilot and attaching a brass SP pressed steel pilot, by modifying the headlight casing and also maybe by removing the center dome and adding numberboards. Should be a very nice model then. Can´t wait to start the work on it!
As long as this string has kept going, maybe I can fill in some of the gaps because I was there during some of the later years of AHM and worked with Birney Paul on a number of projects. About 1980 or so when AHM wanted to have Rivarossi make the Heisler(logging engine) their bank, I think it was PSFS, began having problems and then a whole lot of things happened. One result was that all of a sudden, Rivarossi trains got new price tags- much higher than previously. But after this time it was never imported in the quantities as earlier, and of course, Woolworth 5 and 10 cent stores are gone.
AHM actually started in the 40s with airplanes, but it was around the time that the Polks Aristo was really getting started in trains again in the 50s that AHM got a lot of similar and the same products. "New Ones"- die cast locos, for example came in under both Aristo and AHM labels. Birney Paul took trips around the world to see where useful model items were being made, and was very interested in what Rivarossi had to show. Rivarossi had already done one year or so manufacturing for Lionel as Lionel HO, and a few of the early models persist at train shows. The FM C-Liner diesel, for example, was, as I recall a bit more elaborate than the later ones, and with good reason. For years the later production came listed on the box as "Made under License from Rivarossi" and came from the Mehanotechnika plant in Yugoslovia, now Slovenia. As mentioned, there were changes to the model over the years and later AHM imported a GP18 from Mehano, for example, plus a ton of freightcars, often knockoffs of not only Rivarossi but also of Athearn. Roco supplied some cars too, and Tempo- an Eastern bloc company(Mehano) plant in neutral Austria. (Austria had been divided like Germany for several years, and was reunited but as a neutral country)
Now the meat of the piece here- Mr. Paul wanted to make a New York Central Hudson- I believe that was the first large plastic locomotive they came out with. Paul said he wanted to sell it for (as I recall) at $29.95. Rossi replied that he would have to take like 50,000 of them to get sufficient discount to permit this- and Birney Paul said to go ahead and do it. Keep in mind that in those days very few HO models ever had a production run anything like this. So Paul approached Woolworth and made deals to crank out tons of AHM in virtually every Woolworth. Flagship stores would have huge glass wall displays with amazing amounts of AHM imports- mostly Rivarossi, some Mehano. Now about the proportions of the NYC Hudson. They are wrong. Partly to allow for the flanges, partly to accommodate the motor they used at the time.. While it does have the tapered boiler of the J-3, and no question that is what it is supposed to be- a kitbasher could substitute Pacific spoked drivers to simulate a Boston and Albany (NY Central) J-2 which had low drivers,and would have a slightly closer representation of the prototype. But if you start measuring brass models, you will find that many of those have either too long a wheelbase or undersized drivers- or both- to accommodate even RP25 flanges.
The mechanisms of Rivarossi engines featured an iron frame with brass stepped axles. Gears were double cut- an expensive method of getting smooth operation, and gears wered about the NYC Hudson, while it does have the tapered boiler of the J-3, and no question that is what it is supposed to be- a kitbasher could substitute Pacific spoked drivers to simulate a Boston and Albany (NY Central) J-2 and would have a slightly closer representation of the prototype. But to get back on the topic of what happened to AHM- I heard a few of the things that were going on, but the main point is that the bank had big problems, AHM went belly up. But Birney Paul made fortunes- lost them, picked himself up, at times selling cartons of model trains out the back of his station wagon. Within a short time I visited him at he new plant....right across the street from the old AHM headquarters in the former Philco radio plant on Tioga St in Philly. In a short time, International Hobby Corporation was up and running. New passenger color schemes were introduced- many had but a single run and are quite rare or unseen today- I believe the Florida East Coast, Kansas City Southern might have been in this group. Veterans of model trains from the '60s will recall the 1920s and 1940s series of Rivarossi passenger cars- heavyweights and lightweights.
For a year or two, Rivarossi then produced a 1930s series based on Budd passenger cars. They had a one piece body with snap in floor and flush windows. They were a generation newer than the 1960s production cars and while they are seen around at swap meets, it is unlikely these will ever be produced again. Walthers prototype specific cars are more detailed, but much more expensive, and also I have been told that 1.- the molds are lost somwhere between Italy and China and 2.- There were lawsuits between IHC and Rivaross, which I can believe. IHC persisted until just a few years ago when Birney Paul passed away. He was an increadible guy, and without him, IHC just sort of disappeared.
Some of the production was bought and turns up at swap meets as full tables of items and there is IHC of Texas who sells a number of interesting items. For whatever reason, one of the last products of IHC was lines of heavyweight and lightweight cars. They are all nicely painted and are operate well, but some of the renditions are bizarre with little tiny windows up near the top of the car- two of the Pullmans with the windows too far down on the car sides, and most or all have huge separate handrails that fit into big holes that are hard to correct to add scale handrails. Those were made by Mehanotechnika. But a large number of Rivarossi cars come in the same red IHC boxes. So- Made in Slovenia is Mehano, Made in Italy is Rivarossi. There is much more to this, and I hope my long term memory is still accurate on the details. But I had better sign out so someone else can have a say too.
. .
It's interesting knowing some of these behind the scenes facts, about the actual individuals who pushed to get specific models into production. It makes owning some of the resulting models a little more fun, like having a little piece of history. And it makes some of the inaccuracies a little more understandable.
I know in model car production, a number of Characters went to great lengths and even did some bizarre things to get some models produced. And I've read about the actual designers of the models (ever heard of Bob Paeth?), real model enthusiasts, butting heads with the bean counters over quality vs cost.
For what it's worth, the only Rivsarossi I was ever satisfied with for how it ran, and I had my share, was the Heisler. And that was only after adding contacts for all wheel pickup.
Thanks for taking the time to share this history.
rivabrucihc is still around they are in humble texas
They have an ad on the Catalog &Website Directory page in the July 2016 MR. It states:
"We have new product! GP 20 US Army locomotives. New F-3 A DC and DCC locomotives from $49.98"
maxman They have an ad on the Catalog &Website Directory page in the July 2016 MR. It states: "We have new product! GP 20 US Army locomotives. New F-3 A DC and DCC locomotives from $49.98"
Copper Line Foreman Does any one know where I might find a motor for the above engine Does anyone have an idea how to re-motor?
Does any one know where I might find a motor for the above engine
Does anyone have an idea how to re-motor?
What I did to my Y6b was to buy a worm gear with greater pitch that would fit a can motor and then I made a bracket and epoxed it to the frame and used two small screws, I also made two holes to fit the can and bent and adjusted it until meshed and moved the can up and down in the slots. It isn't that hard to do, I just looked at a newer engine and got the idea from them. I hope this helps.
Seem to recall, that AHM of Philadelphia, PA., went bankrupt in the late 1970's then resurfaced as International Hobbies Corporation of Philadelphia.
The AHM line of locomotives, freight and passenger cars came from Yugoslovia and Austria at one point and the building kits came from Denmark.
The vendors supplying the goods would change from time to time as who could produce to specifications at expected cost to AHM. In other words, a group of manufactuers in European Countries would "Bid" on the work for AHM.
Then when the European manufacturers could not produce at what AHM would pay, then they went to Far East Countries, soliciting bids to produce the goods.
Possibly some other readers, may have current details on the current production and where abouts of the tooling of the old AHM line.
Ive aquired a small fleet of the newer (AHM) Rivarossi 4-4-0's with RP-25 wheels and better tender motors. Does anyone know what kind of replacement tires will work?
I remember for a time in the early 80s the parent company was called "Regal Way"-the product was still AHM, they came out with a line of snap-together buildings which included fast-food outlets like Burger King, Pizza Hut, and Baskin-Robbins, along with a 7up bottling plant (with underscale doors).
Old threads and old companies never die. No problem finding AHM on ebay.
Joe Staten Island West
I'm glad this thread is still with us. As time goes by I am drawn more and more to the old AHM/Rivarossi items I come across at train shows and eBay. I'm sure it is because my first steamer was an 0-8-0 Indiana Harbor Belt I bought when I was 10, and those Woolworth sales every year allowed me to have much fun with my paper route money, and kept me out of trouble. I just subscribed to a new publication called HO Collector that showcases AHM and other HO train builders of the past, looking forward to receiving the first copy. One other thing, don't throw out that outdated computer optical drive until you harvest the disc drawer drive motor. I put one in a Rivarossi Milwaukee Road Heavy Pacific from 1975, along with a TCS decoder, and it is one of the best running locos I have. In fact, it has a slower starting speed than even a modern Broadway Limited locomotive!
JusTrainsI'm in Niagara Falls, NY and there is an outlet store here called Ollie's
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Ollie's is finally making its way into the South. There is one in Cordele, Georgia that I stop into from time to time. Have not found any trains, but they have dirt-cheap prices on some of the stuff needed to build layouts.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
AHM was Associated Hobby Manufacturers. you are confusing it with AHC, a hobby store in New York City , America's Hobby Center, long out of business.
OldnrustyFor whatever reason, one of the last products of IHC was lines of heavyweight and lightweight cars. They are all nicely painted and are operate well, but some of the renditions are bizarre with little tiny windows up near the top of the car- two of the Pullmans with the windows too far down on the car sides, and most or all have huge separate handrails that fit into big holes that are hard to correct to add scale handrails. Those were made by Mehanotechnika. But a large number of Rivarossi cars come in the same red IHC boxes. So- Made in Slovenia is Mehano, Made in Italy is Rivarossi.
I'm glad to see these comments, as I've often popped into threads talking about passenger cars to point out that - contrary to what many folks seem to think - IHC passenger cars are not the same as the yellow/blue box AHM or later maroon box Rivarossi cars. Their appearance is different, and interiors made for IHC don't fit AHM/Rivarossi cars.
Save money and just go to HOSEEKER on line
So funny that 20 years later the quest continues to find out where AHM went...although the answer was posted in the very first reply also 20 years ago.
Rich
Alton Junction