B&O museum pictures

[TBat55]

B&O Railroad Museum in Baltimore, MD, 04-05-2005:

outside view of roundhouse (60' turntable inside it):


roundhouse door:


inside view of the new slate roof, originally designed by Mr. Baldwin:


an interesting maintenance thing to model:


2-6-6-2 C&O challenger


close-up view of same


ditto


ditto


2-8-4 berkshire


same, up close


same, up close


same's tender


old switcher


part of the collection ("Burro" and car)


lightweight passenger car for 18" radius curves


don't know what this is

[dave9999]

Nice pictures.

Isn't that the museum that had the roof collapse? Looks like they did a great job
replacing it.
I would like to visit... one day. It's a long drive from Fla to Maryland, but it would be nice
to see. Love that steam! Dave

[Anonymous]

Im heading there this spring! Nice Pics.

[Morpar]

While your pictures are very nice, some of the subjects look rather sad. The outdoor locomotives look like they need at least a good coat of paint, all the rust and white stuff (boiler lagging??) can't be good for keeping these locos around for the future. Does all of the equipment outdoors look like those locomotives? If so, what can be done to better preserve them? I remember reading somewhere that at least one of the DM&IR 2-8+8-4 locos that were "preserved" had to be scrapped due to weathering like that seen in your photos.

Please don't take this as a personal affront. Your photos are quite good, they just show that the equipment at the museum needs some help soon, before it goes the way of most other steam locomotives.

[TBat55]

Thanks, I highly recommend the visit. Made my day for $14.00 (includes short train ride by SW7).

Next month, May 2005, the new Car Restoration Shop opens & accessed via the train ride.

The collapsed roof damaged many engines and cars. One car repair estimate was $1Million. Some VERY STRANGE engines in there

including a Camel with cab on TOP of the boiler (forgot about tunnel clearance?).

Special note: The Smithsonian display on loan has the best models I've ever seen in 40 years of MRR.


B&O Railroad Museaum, Baltimore, MD, models on loan from the Smithsonian:

















These are scrathbuilt models that look like they took a lifetime to make.

[Anonymous]

/i went there this christmas. The models are amazing. Does anyone have pictures of those damaged engines. I would post but I didnt take any.

[Anonymous]

BTW: did you see thier HO layout inside the passenger car. I am not impressed at all. You think they could at least build a halfway decent layout for thier museum.....

[DigitalGriffin]

Since I got hooked back in November, I've visited the B&O three times.

It is no doubt quite a collection of odds and ends. There are a number of significant and unique pieces of RR history there. Their collection is quite extensive, and unless I am mistaken, one of the largest in the world.

But that's part of their problem. They have so many pieces it's hard to keep them in shape, let alone restore them at $1 million+ a piece. I would personally love to see an Allegeheney restored. Regretably from what I understand the B&O museum does not have a lot of money in it's coffers, and was at several times in it's history at risk of closing. If you want to make a difference contribute to save this part of American heritage.

They put the engines and moving stock that were damaged during the roof collapse behind a plexiglass wall. They then put a plaque in front of each one showing the before,after and the estimated cost to repair for each one which is nothing short of staggering.

You can get a report of what is being done to save these great engines here:
http://www.borail.org/restoration/

While a number of engines are significantly "aged and weathered" their hauls do appear intact with only a surface rusting. (I may be wrong about this, as I'm not a curator.) Most of the piping/hoses/air pumps, etc on the engine appear intact. (But then again I'm not an expert and only have elementry knowlege of what goes where now that I have a blueprint book of popular engines.)

Considering what they have to work with, I think they are doing a good job.

[Anonymous]

I lived in the Balto-Wash area for a little over 20 years and never failed to take my house guests to the B & O museum, Smithsonian, et al. Through the years I watched the B & O artifacts gradually erode away to its now pitiable state. I left the area in 1981 and was struck dumb when I saw these recent photos. It would be wonderful if there was enough interest to establish a group to promote more funding for this classic display of U.S. railroadiana. By the way TBat55, did you also visit the Baltimore Trolly Museum? It is certainly worth the short drive over to Penn Station for a quick look-see. Thanks for the fine photos.

[Anonymous]

My son and I have made the approx. one-hour drive a number of times over the years. While some of the outdoor displays are rather sad, I don't think that any of them are particularly memorable or one-of-a-kind. The musuem had made some progress on a long-term plan to at least get them under cover, but the roof collapse has over-shadowed such efforts. By the way, JPM335, we thought the HO layout was pretty nicely done, especially the 100% accurate city scene at the beginning of the tour. Guess your standards are extremely high.

[DigitalGriffin]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rails5

By the way, JPM335, we thought the HO layout was pretty nicely done, especially the 100% accurate city scene at the beginning of the tour. Guess your standards are extremely high.

I thought so to. For the space they had, they did a great job.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by JPM335

... Does anyone have pictures of those damaged engines. I would post but I didnt take any.

I live within a 30-minute drive from the Museum. If enough people express interest, I could go there and get some pics and post them here - IF they allow me to get close enough to them...

[Anonymous]

Rails5, I have a question on the second sentence of your comment. Are you referring to the entire collection of artifacts "...not particularaly memorable or one-of-a-kind." or the outdoor rolling stock only? After JPM335 commented on the HO layout, I was beginning to wonder if there might be two different B & O Museums and I went to the better of the two.

[AggroJones]

They really let those C&O steamers fall to hell. [V]

But they are still in better condition than our Santa Fe 2-10-4 and 4-8-4 downtown.

[dave9999]

TBat55,
The first loco is not a Challenger. It is a H-6 from Baldwin. In fact it was the last (#1309)
2-6-6-2 H-6 that the C&O ever recieved. It was also the last steam locomotive that Baldwin
produced. The C&O actually tried to cancel the order for the last ten H-6's, but were forced
to take them in 1949. The C&O never owned Challengers. Dave

[TBat55]

My mistake. I thought "Challenger" was the generic name for 2-6-6-2's. There is also an Allegheny 2-6-6-6 (if the name's right). It is hard to remember the names when different RRs called the same wheel arrangement a different name (like "Mountain", "Niagara", etc). By The Way (BTW), the damaged stuff is behind plexiglass wall. Also, I wnet there on route to the airport and had to haul my suitcase around. The won't let you store it.
Next up: Chicago's Museum of Science & Industry's MRR exhibit recently featured in MRR magazine. (I travel a lot for Homeland Security & use personal time for the hobby).

[dano99a]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TBat55

My mistake. I thought "Challenger" was the generic name for 2-6-6-2's. There is also an Allegheny 2-6-6-6 (if the name's right). It is hard to remember the names when different RRs called the same wheel arrangement a different name (like "Mountain", "Niagara", etc). By The Way (BTW), the damaged stuff is behind plexiglass wall. Also, I wnet there on route to the airport and had to haul my suitcase around. The won't let you store it.
Next up: Chicago's Museum of Science & Industry's MRR exhibit recently featured in MRR magazine. (I travel a lot for Homeland Security & use personal time for the hobby).

Oddly enough they called some of the 2-6-6-2's "Mallets" or "Baby Allegheny" the
2-6-6-6 Allegheny is one of 2 that survived the scrappers torch. The other one looks FAAAAAR better though, it's indoors. It's obvious that the B&O Museum has been busy fixing the museum and not the equipment they have (shame [:(] )

[mersenne6]

The models were built by a number of very skilled model railroaders at the request of the Smithsonian. I don't know the names of all involved but I do know that M.D. Thornburgh ,a claims agent for the B&O and a prolific contributor to Model Railroader from the 1930's-1950's, built several of them. He was also responsible for the construction of a number of the O scale models owned by the B&O museum itself.

If you ever have a chance to look over the older issues of MR (his last construction article was a 6 part piece from January -June 1959 on building a Wabash Mogul) you will be amazed at what he could do and also how he did it.

Many years later, John Page, an early editor of Model Railroader wrote a series of "I remember" pieces for the magazine and in one of them he recounted a visit to Mel's house. At the time, many people thought Mel was downplaying the tools needed for his work. John asked about this and without so much as a by-your-leave Mel took a piece of brass, chucked it into the bit of a hand cranked drill, clamped the drill in a vise, and while manually spinning the drill press, applied a file to the piece of brass and in very short order had made a beautiful marker light....they are beautiful looking models and they were built with time, practice and patience.

[Anonymous]

"Time, practice and patience!" I never thought I would hear those words in our world of " quick, quantity and Quackery!" Mersenne6, thank you for the memory "knee jerk." On another tack; I have been laboring under the misinformation that "Mallet" was a man's sir name ( inventor of articulated locomotives). No doubt, his name would have been used in naming some articulateds. My question before the board is: where did these "popular" names for locomotives originate [Prarie, Mogul, Pacific, Atlantic, Challenger, et al.)? I have heard of a "Texas" class steamer but have no idea as to its' wheel arrangement...HELP! TBat55, while at the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry, please don't forget to "scope" the JU 87 (Stuka) dive bomber. Until I saw the thing, I had no concept as to the size of that war plane. Happy rails to all. Ted

[Anonymous]

Is it worth the $14 and time? I'm asking since the pics show some pretty bad shape locos. I was planning to swing on by next Thursday on the way home from a business trip.

[DigitalGriffin]

mktrains,

It's worth it. Don't let the pictures discourage you. The collection is quite large and a number of trains are in better shape than others.

The Smithsonian museum of American History in DC also has a nicely restored collection.

[UPJohn]

Nice 2-6-6-2 challenger

[AggroJones]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Ted D. Kramer
On another tack; I have been laboring under the misinformation that "Mallet" was a man's sir name ( inventor of articulated locomotives). No doubt, his name would have been used in naming some articulateds. My question before the board is: where did these "popular" names for locomotives originate [Prarie, Mogul, Pacific, Atlantic, Challenger, et al.)? I have heard of a "Texas" class steamer but have no idea as to its' wheel arrangement...HELP

Most of the time, it came from the first of its kind to be built.

Example, the 2-10-4 Texas got its name from Texas & Pacific because they were the first purposefully designed 2-10-4s.

Northern came from Northern Pacific, the first ones to build a 4-8-4.

Berkshire got its name from the Bershire mountain range that some of the earliest units built ran through.

Challenger was the title given to the 4-6-6-4 by Union Pacific from the challeging assignments they were given in the Wasatch Mountains.

[mersenne6]

Ted,

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "I have been laboring under the misinformation that "Mallet" was a man's sir name ( inventor of articulated locomotives). "

From Articulated Locomotives by Wiener (1930) we have "The first practical locomotives on this system were due to the eminent French engineer Anatole Mallet. His design answered so admirably to practical requirements that it has ever since held the field." His engines had the high pressure/low pressure cylinder system (small cylinders to the rear and large to the front).

Some of the other locomotive names - the 4-4-0 was developed in the U.S. and was called either the "Standard 8 Wheel" or the "American" - Whyte uses "American" for this wheel arrangement.

From White - American Locomotives we have " The term "Mogul" was popularly used to describe any large freight locomotive, irrespective of its wheel arrangements, but in the trade it meant simply the 2-6-0. The earliest generic use of the term was found in the Master Mechanics Association Report for 1872. However, it is possible that the Central Railroad of New Jersy's "Mogul", built by Taunton in 1866 was the origin of the class name. This was true in the case of the "Consolidation", the first 2-8-0."

[cheese3]

those look great! I am planning on going this summer, I only live like 45 min. away!

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the history of some of the popular names for classes of steam locos. It certainly makes sense that the railroad, not the manufacturer, would be more likely to make the name choices. In re: B & O museum, yes, where else can anyone expect to see so much railroadiana so inexpensively? As I recall, there was no admission charge back in the 60's and 70's. Obviously, there should have been to help with the restorations. Thanks again, Ted

[Anonymous]

Ted Kramer,

I was referring strictly to the outdoor collection most of which is not-so-slowly rusting away. Nearly all of the stuff in the roundhouse (which was in fact a car shop, not a loco shop) is unique.

[Anonymous]

rails55, thanks for clearing up the "indoor, outdoor" issue. Yes, the outdoor stock looks like a dying endangered species alright. Fortunately, the Museum is located in a forlorned area of town or neighbors would sue CSX for exhibiting an "eyesore."