I'm looking at picking up some decals for a custom paint/decal of a shell. Are there any stark differnences between Microscale and Champs as far as quality?
I also seem to remember reading wayback when that one should avoid the older sets of Champ decals because they had a tendency to crack upon application? Is that still the case?
Lastly, perusing eBay I noticed that the older Champ packets have the "EH" prefix and the newer ones, "BRH". Besides the differences in packaging (yellow vs. white envelope), does that designate which is older and which is newer? And, yes - I'm aware that Champs is out of business.
Thanks for your input.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
I haven't had too many problems with Champ decals craking with age, HOWEVER any moderately old decals from Microscale or Herald King need an oversray of a clear coat because they will actually go to little pieces when you wet them.
The letters varied with the series, i.e. "PH" was "Passenger, HO". "BRH" was from Champs' Blue Ribbon Series and did not designate age. Blue Ribbon sets had more decals, a little better artwork, or were made to go with certain manufacurers' equipment. Champ had a basic set for PFE reefers but then they replaced that with a BRH set that contained lettering for just about any series within the time frame listed on the package.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
Nobody bought them, as far as I'm aware. They closed up shop several years ago.
Champ decals were thicker than Microscale decals. Beyond that, it's a personal preference.
Uncle_BobNobody bought them, as far as I'm aware. They closed up shop several years ago.
You are correct.
Champion Decal Company has gone out of business.
We thank our customers from the 1940's through 2010 for their support and business. What a wonderful and long journey you have made with Champ. We are proud to be permanently stuck to the thousands upon thousands of model railroad cars and locomotives you have labored over. This hobby is truly a labor of love.
From the late Max Gray, the late Rich Meyer and current owner Connie Allard, we wish you all the very best.
September 30, 2010 was the last day any orders were accepted, be it by mail, fax, web or any other means. Orders received here after September 30, 2010 will not be filled (mail orders must be postmarked prior to September 30, 2010)
If your order was placed before September 30, 2010 please note that we are weeks behind in filling our orders. Consequently, some sets may sell out before your particular order is filled due to the many orders ahead of yours. Therefore, the web may have shown that certain sets were available when you placed your order, but may have sold out before we actually got to your order. Our apologies for any inconvenience this may cause.
Only correspondence inquiring about orders placed before Sept. 30, 2010 will be answered. Our email is champ@minot.com.
However, I found this company making "replacement sets"
http://www.myhotrains.com/
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
I see a lot of Champ decals on eBay, and resist, because I've had a lot of experience with old decals breaking apart, almost disintigrating, while appying.
It seems to be the same seller.
I also have the same problem with old Microscale decals. I do buy on eBay, but want to be sure the envelope it comes in is unopened.
Mike
My You Tube
When using Champ and Microscale Decals, the Champ White Decals seem to be an ivory shade of white, while the Microscale and others are a more bright white which I prefer on my lettering projects.
I use Microscale Decal Film over all my Microscale, Herald King and old Champ sets as the all tend to break apart due to either the thiness of the decal or age.
Rick J
Rule 1: This is my railroad.
Rule 2: I make the rules.
Rule 3: Illuminating discussion of prototype history, equipment and operating practices is always welcome, but in the event of visitor-perceived anacronisms, detail descrepancies or operating errors, consult RULE 1!
Champ decals were my favourites, as they had more lettering for steam era cars and locos than did Microscale, and a vast array of alphabet sets in various fonts, sizes, and colours. They also offered dimensional data and re-weigh and re-pack info.I recently completed this undecorated Tangent tank car kit, lettering it with Champ alphabets in various sizes and two fonts, along with data from Champ and Microscale. There is a total of 168 separate pieces of decals on this little car:
I've seldom had any problems with Champ decals, even those over 30 years old.
Wayne
doctorwayne I've seldom had any problems with Champ decals, even those over 30 years old. Wayne
Wayne, just used some 40 year old Champ Decals, and had lots of problems with them splitting even after putting on Decal Film, but it is hit or miss with those and since they are no longer available in some road names, why take a chance!
There are four problems with Champ decals:1). The emulsion (the clear stuff the ink is on) is thick and needs full strength Solvaset to get them to conform to irregular surfaces.
2). The decal ink is not 100% opaque. If one is putting white decals (or any light color) over black, dark green or any other dark color, you'll need two layers of decals in order to get them to be actually white and not gray.
3). The emulsion covers the entire sheet of decals, meaning that you have to cut close to every decal and the resulting emulsion left around the art is not tapered.
4). The printing on Champ decals is a little fuzzy around the edges. Small printing and detail kind of turns into blobs.
Microscale decals have the thinnest emulsion in the business, and only needs the relatively mild strength of Microscale Micro Sol to get them to conform to surfaces. Their decals are all printed in at least two layers, usually with a white undercoat that prevents the color from the model showing through the decal. Also, the emulsion usually only covers the art with a small border that naturally tapers at the edges, meaning that they're easier to blend into the model surface. Lastly, the printing from Microscale is razor sharp with clean lines and clear printing down to being able to read very small letters.
In short, Microscale decals are superior in every way to Champ. The only thing that Champ has is art that Microscale hasn't done. So if you need something that only Champ has, you have to use it. But I'd save it for a last resort situation.
Paul A. Cutler III
While I've used mostly Champ decals because they offered more lettering appropriate to my era, I've also used Microscale, and cut them close to the lettering, too, rather than around the blob of clear backing film. Black Cat and Rail Graphics decals are also a more opaque white than Champ, but once the car or locomotive is weathered, they all look similar. If you cut close to the lettering, don't use a slicing motion, as it raises the material adjacent to the blade, the same as when you cut sheet styrene in that manner.Instead, cut the needed portions from the main sheet by slicing some distance from the lettering, then, working on a hard surface (I use a sheet of glass) use a sharp blade to chop off the excess material around the lettering - line up the blade, then firmly push straight down.When you apply the decal, this edge is much easier to get settled with setting solution than is the raised edge created by slicing.
I always and still would prefer Champ decals over any decal being offered.
Back in the day I decaled many Athearn 40' cars with Champs with excellent results. My freelance railroad decals was made from Champ;s private name decal list.
A example.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
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TStage) my Champ vs Micro experiences....
Just so you know, I dont prespray my decals. They either work or they dont. Not only do I buy online both Champ and Micro, I have some personal stuff from as far back as 1980 from both makers as well.
Stark differences? Well, I tend to see a more sharper, crisper print from Micro than Champ. One might even say a more broader spectrum of prints (my opinion more than fact). But thats about it. 0 - 1
Breaking up? I find that Champ fails about 5% of the time, Micro fails around 10% of the time. 1 - 1
Ive never tried the white packets, my references are to Champs in Gold(Yellow?) envelopes with green lettering. 1 - 1
Tied: so, additionally for a tie breaker....
I find Champs are a tad stiffer to work with. While requiring more setting solution to hunker down, they are easier to move, easier to align, and wont tear as easy as the Micro will.
All said and done, if it comes down to it, Id get the Champs. Though, having both would give you a back up in case the first set fails due to age. Plus, you can pre spray them if you do that.
As said I dont do that, but I hear the results are indeed favorable.
Clear Ahead!
PMR
I think any old decals tend to have the breaking up problem if they are old enough, it isn't limited to one manufacturer.
Although Microscale decals have a thinner coating so in many ways are superior, I do miss Champ (and Walthers) decals just because they offered so many decals that no one else ever made.