BLI Paragon2 H10s and DCC

[dudu]

Hi.

I am a novice in DCC. I have recently purchased a new H10s. It is a Paragon2 BLI.

I am trying to make it move on my track. I have a NCE Power Cab DCC system. It succesfully works on my Atlas engine, although it is a very simplistic engine (knows forward, backwards, headlights). 

When I attempt to use the DCC system on the BLI engine (which is my first steam engine), I have huge issues making the steam engine work. While sound functions suchy as bell, whistle,etc. work just fine -- when I try to move the engine forward or backwards, the engine just stands still.

Is there something I am missing? Do I need to do additional work for the engine to move?

Please do help, as I am a novice

[selector]

First, I am going to assume you know how to acquire the correct address for the decoder since you can activate bell and whistle.  It is a well-known problem, if problem it can be called, that the BLI tethers need to be firmly and fully seated in order for the motor control to work.  I and others have run into this many times; you can get lights and whistle to work, but the engine won't budge at all.  I take the engine back off the rails, place it on a soft surface on its side, and then find a way to safely push the plug deeper into its receptacle under the locomotive's cab.  I have had excellent success.

You need to firmly grip the locomotive to keep it from moving, and you need a thin but strong implement with which to force the plug another mm or so deeper until it can't go without breaking something.  I have used the blunt end of a bamboo kabob skewer and the ends of the long thin tines on sharp needle-nosed pliers.  The trick is to avoid pinching or dislodging the tiny wires inserted into the back of the plug.

I believe this is your problem.  If you do this and it still won't work, you'll have to contact BLI and ask for a repair.  The decoder may be faulty, or maybe the tether itself is already broken/defective.

[gmpullman]

Hi, dudu and...

Since you can get the whistle and bell to work OK I assume you have the throttle and address matched. If you bought your H10 new it came shipped at address 03.

For starters you can try pressing F9 which is the "startup" sequence. There are some sound decoders that do not allow the engine to move unless this is active. F8 should mute the sound but still allow you to run the engine.

Lots of Broadway Limited users report engines "losing" their address. Sometimes a short on the layout or if the engine has been idle for some time it seems like the address gets scrambled.

In this case a reset to factory default settings is needed. If you are comfortable with setting the CV values with your Power Cab you would select CV #8 and change its value (it might be 38 now) to 8 to perform this reset.

IF this does not bring your engine back to life, on address 3, then a "complete" reset may be necessary by opening the tender and pressing the reset button on the circuit board.

From the P2 manual:

Paragon2 Series FAQ Section:

I made a mistake programming. How do I reset my Paragon2 Series locomotive to defaults?

There are two ways to reset the Paragon2 locomotives. 

1. Using your programming track, reset CV8 to 8. You will hear the coupler crash sound as confirmation the reset was successful.
2. Locate the manual reset button on the main circuit board. Place the model on unpowered track. Press and hold the button. While holding the button, apply power to the track. After you hear confirmation that the reset was successful, you can release the button and re-assemble your model. Loco address is now 03.

 

Try the CV8 = 8 reset first and see if you can then get the engine to run on address 3.

Hope that helps,

Ed

[richhotrain]

The Paragon 2 decoder has a somewhat troublesome history.

Do you have a separate Programming Track set up with your Power Cab?

You need a Programming Track set up to read CVs.  

The long address may be an issue.  So might CV 17, 18, and/or 29.

It may need a reset as others have suggested.

Rich

[dominic c]

If the sound functions all work, see if the headlight comes on FN (0). If the headlight fails to come on the wire plug might not be inserted properly.

Joe C

[dudu]

Hi, you are absolutely right, the headlights fail to come on. Which one is the wire plug? Sorry for the novice questions.

[dudu]

Hi, not sure if that is the problem, I cannot get the lights or the smoke to work at all. Just the sound

[dudu]

Hi, address is 03 alright. No problem in loosing the address. F9 indeed starts the engine sequence, F8 mutes it. Sound works just fine. What does NOT work fine is the motive power and the lights.

[dudu]

Hi,

I can setup a separate programming track, no problem in doing that. What is the sequence of commands you would want me try? I have an NCE Power Cab.

Thank you!

[richhotrain]

On the Programming Track, set CV8=8 to reset the decoder to factory default. Then, program the long address.  Place the loco back on the main layout and see if it will move when the long address is called on the Power Cab.

Rich

[rrinker]

There is a set of wires between the tender and the loco. If this is not securely plugged in, it will behave as you are saying. No need to reset the decoder or anything, especially if the sounds start and you can blow the whistle and ring the bell. All the electronics are in the tender, and the tender picks up power on both rails, so the tender can be put on the track all by itself and it will make noise. The loco motor only gets power through the wire harness that plugs in under the cab deck, so if that's not plugged in, it won't move. The headlight power also comes through there, so the headlight won't come on either.

                  --Randy

 

[gmpullman]

rrinker

There is a set of wires between the tender and the loco.

Sometimes when I take a new Broadway engine out of the box and get ready to make the connection of the tender to engine plug, I have to kind of poke around in the front of the tender, just under the floor deck, to get the plug and wires out far enough to comfortably plug in the connector under the cab floor. If you didn't know it was there it's easy to overlook, unless you read the manual. 

As Selector pointed out above, I use a wood skewer to fish the plug out and to help push it into the socket under the cab floor.

Do this with the engine and tender laying on its side. Look in to the end of the plug and you will see the row of sockets favor one side, be sure to match it up to the pins on the plug of the engine.

Then use a flattened end of the skewer to help push the two together so they are clearly seated evenly. It takes a bit of force so be careful where you grip the engine.

Then you can align the drawbar hole with the pin on the engine, use the outer hole on tighter curved track, get the apron to rest on top of the tender floor deck then turn the whole thing upright and carefully place it on your track.

You'll wish you had two more hands...

So... when you first took the engine out of the box, DID you plug the tender in to the engine???

Ed

[dudu]

Well, Ed. When people are right, people are right ... That would be you.

And when novices are novices, well, then they are novices. That would be me.

I am sorry guys. I did not realize there is a plug in between the cab and the tender. It is extremely well hidden :( I worked like one hour, literally, to pull it out.

Plugging the plug makes the steam engine work. And it looks amazing :)

I am sorry again for all the trouble I have caused and much appreciating your help.

My BLI works as expected on address 03.

I have bought a 2008 MTH Mikado as well, now I will have to make that one work too. Is there a plug here too? :)

My appologies gentlemen, once more.

[Brinty-1936]

Oh Dudu you have just made my day. It was about two years ago when I got my first DCC steam loco from BLI. It was a Paragon2 and looked magnificent. I sat and gazed at it for ages but could I get it working? Could I heck! It was by sheer accident that I found the well hidden plug but when I did, I was over the moon. In a way it just delayed the excitement. But it pleases me no end to learn that I'm not alone in being lost and confused. Cheers, Brian

[dudu]

I am not seeing any plug on the MTH Light Mikado. Is there one?

[gmpullman]

dudu

Well, Ed. When people are right, people are right ... That would be you.

Several people contributed ideas here, dudu. My first assumption was that you had already plugged in the tender and that the engine was still giving you problems. That's when I figured you needed the reset.

After Selector, Joe C. and Randy mentioned the plug, I remembered how sometimes it arrives from the factory with it pushed way back in the opening.

Now, I might add — as a friendly reminder, that the instructions might be a good place to start when you get your NEXT new locomotive 

Glad you're rolling...

I am not seeing any plug on the MTH Light Mikado. Is there one?

[Edit:] I only have one MTH locomotive and it has two contacts as part of the drawbar so when you put the pin in the hole it makes two connections inside. It seems a little flimsy to me so be careful when you put the pin into the drawbar. 

Good Luck,

Ed

[dudu]

Hi Ed,

As stupid as it may seem to you, the loco came with zilch instructions. And it was sealed :( I thought this is normal, as this is my first BLI.

Now, on the MTH Light Mikado, I am not seeing any plug ... :(

Thanks!

[dudu]

Hi Ed, so there are TWO contacts? 

I can see one (the bar in between the cab and the tender). I am not seeing the second one.

And, of course, this engine also gives me trouble and does not want to roll ... 

[gmpullman]

Broadway Support Documents here:

http://www.broadway-limited.com/supportdocumentation.aspx

Also other helpful information...

Ed

[gmpullman]

dudu

I can see one (the bar in between the cab and the tender). I am not seeing the second one.

My engine is the NYC Empire State Express Hudson, a different engine so it may not be the same. If it is similar, there are two brass sleeves on the locomotive pin under the cab and inside the drawbar there are two thin wire wipers that contact that pin. The wires coming out of the drawbar and into the tender (barely visible)  seem very thin and fragile. That's why I mention being careful. Also it seems like the brass sleeves want to snag those tiny wiper wires inside the drawbar... look at it closely.

[gmpullman]

dudu

Now, on the MTH Light Mikado, I am not seeing any plug ... :(

Here:

http://mthtrains.com/sites/default/files/download/instruction/80st12696i.pdf

Page Nine.

Ed

[dudu]

Thanks Ed. Apparently I had to hit F3 for this one to work. Unfortunately, it has some parts missing, as far as I can see. It starts running, and then it stops.

This one goes back ...

[dudu]

How to apply smoke fluid to my BLI?

Again, dumb question, and the manual provided by you guys does not seem to answer this ...

What kind of smoke should I use? I have some Bachmann smoke fluid from one of my friends. I also have the smoke fluid from the MTH engine. Can I use them with the BLI?

Much appreciate it ...

[gmpullman]

dudu

How to apply smoke fluid to my BLI?

Personally, I don't... but it is an option that some modelers like to try out.

The key word is — s p a r i n g l y ! Only put about 3 or 4 drops from an eyedropper into the smoke stack opening. There is probably enough from the factory already in there for maybe a half hour or so.

There is scented smoke available  again, not for my tastes. I imagine this time of year, pine scent is popular...

http://www.megasteam.com/

Or you can look for MTH or Broadway Limited's own smoke.

http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=smoke+fluid&Submit=

Maybe others have some preferences here they can chime in with. If you choose not to use smoke at a later date be sure to learn how to turn the heater off. It draws a bit of current and the element will fail if you run it hot with no oil in it.

Sometimes there is a switch under the cab or behind the smoke box front. It can also be turned off by modifying a CV value but if you reset the decoder it comes back on again.

Good Luck, Ed

[dudu]

Thanks again Ed. Indeed, there is a switch underneath and I turned the smoke off for now.

But the main idea is that I can use ANY smoke fluid in the BLI, right? I do not need to use a particular brand.

Thanks again for the help!

[rrinker]

 Use an eyedropper or a tiny funnel - the first smoking BLI locos came with one, since then they don;t provide them. Before adding smoke fluid, look in the stack with a magnifier, you will see a pipe within the pipe - the fluid goes in the inner pipe. If it gets around the ouside, it can migrate to the motor that produces the puffing and soften the gear so it spins but doesn't puff the smoke.

 Newer ones I believe all have the switch under the cab. If you aren't putting smoke fluid in, you should turn it off, running the heater dry can burn it out. There's a function key to stop the smoke, but the next time you power up the layout, it turns back on unless the little switch is turned off.

 There should have been a fairly comprehensive instruction book with the loco. The link provided will get you a copy to download, which should explain the smoke and the switch.

                   --Randy