Just talking to a friend of mine who has a rather large collection of MRR stuff in all scales. His primary room filler layout is HO. He is one of those guys that just seems to acquire stuff and rarely parts with any of it.
Many years ago at an estate sale he ended up with some brass loco's. One of these ended up sitting on a shelf for years. A common aquaintance of ours use to drool over this thing constantly when he was at my friends house. This guy had a nice layout of his own but was not in the "Brass Loco" income bracket. Recently my buddy just gave it to him. My friend isn't hurting for $ at this stage of his life and thought it would be a nice thing to do. He is a very generous guy with his time and money but was thoroughly ticked off at this guy for turning around and selling it a week later for about $600.00.
So I know when you give someone something as a gift, it is theirs to do with as they please. But really, I think he should have at least held on to it for a while first.
So opinions..... What's the etiquette on something like that. How long should he have kept it before selling it? I had to agree with my friend that it seemed like bad form to have turned around and sold it. If he didn't want it he should have just not have taken it.
Personally I couldn't imagine doing something like that.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
I agree we with you. It was tacky to sell it right away. I honestly don't know if I could ever sell a locomotive I was given as a gift. A few years ago, I was given a Clinchfield GP38-2. But then I stopped modeling South Carolina and started modeling Pennsy country. I repainted the loco into Conrail colors and was nervous about my friend's reaction. But he liked what I did with it.
Modeling the Pennsylvania Railroad in N Scale.
www.prr-nscale.blogspot.com
Brent, I agree with you, 100%. If the guy was drooling over the brass loco, it should have been with the intent of keeping it. Selling it a week after it was gifted to him tells me that he never intended to keep it. So, he never should have accepted it from your friend. Once he did take it, he should have told your friend of his intent to sell it. The least he could do was to split the $600. Did your friend understand the value of the loco before gifting it?
Rich
Alton Junction
Rich, my friend knew exactly what he was giving away value wise. He has been at this hobby for as long as I have been alive. This aquaintance is just someone that tags along with a much better friend of ours. I don't think he will be too welcome for a while, if ever at my friends house. It's too bad things like this happen.
Tacky beyond belief, apparently $600.00 was worth more than the friendship to the seller.
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
I am trying to get inside the head of the recipient. If I had to guess, I would say he drooled over just 'bout any brass locomotive when he saw one. In fact, my bet is that the recipient had plenty of his own stuff, and only spent what he wanted on what he valued most at the time, and it wasn't brass. Then, when he got the brass, he quickly looked at it as a means to continue to acquire the stuff he valued most. The benefactor only saw the drooling, and thought he would bestow a kindness and a quality locomotive on someone he thought valued that quality. Nope. The guy just enjoyed being acquisitive, and he knew darned well what his purchasing plan was from month-to-month. The brass was an unexpected windfall, but not what he really desired. More is what he desired. More was made possible with one quality brass loco he didn't even have to pay for.
Yeah, okay, I'll accept your calling me cynical.
For something that's as valuable as a $600 loco that was given as a gesture of friendship, he should have given back if he decided he did not want it.
If it was an item that the original giver didn't want, then doing what you please is okay, but not an expensive item that the original person would have kept if it wasn't for your friendship.
- Douglas
I agree with you! If he had been drooling over the brass loco for so long, one would assume this was because he was fascinated with the appearance/details/etc. with the loco, NOT with the prospect of reselling it for a profit, so why would he have even thought of selling it?!?!
I agree with what most posters have already stated. If the receiver had no intention of keeping the locomotive he should have declined the offer or been open and honest about his intentions from the get go.
"Ladies and gentlemen, I have some good news and some bad news. The bad news is that both engines have failed, and we will be stuck here for some time. The good news is that you decided to take the train and not fly."
Brent,
I agree...that suck's.
I've been in that situation as the giver....a few times...if You never want to see some people, ever again....loan them money.
Take Care!
Frank
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
Geared Steam Tacky beyond belief, apparently $600.00 was worth more than the friendship to the seller.
It could also go beyond that. If I was the friend he was tagging along with, I'd also tell him to go find someone else to tag along after. I wouldn't wanna be seen with him after such a cheap trick.
It is amazing the low price some people can be bought for--!!!
herrinchoker
The fellow seemed to know the value of the loco pretty well.
He's absolutely clueless about the value of friendship.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Something similar happened to a guy i knew, who gave a longtime friend of his an original copy of a rare vintage car builder's dictionary. This so-called friend promptly turned around and sold the book to MR, which had been looking for one to reproduce (I think it was about $800 in 1970s dollars)! And this guy had been a good friend of the gifter, too, so that friendship went up in smoke: the gifter never spoke to the clown again. (He said he would've gladly accepted a few bucks if the guy had offered it, with no ill feeling.)
As one of my favorite characters, in one of my favorite TV shows, told a wealthy chiseler, "People like you know the price of everything but the value of nothing."
BTW, just like most of you said, I would never sell a gift; friendship is worth more than mere gold.
Deano
Batman Brent:
You say:" A common aquaintance of ours use to drool over this thing constantly when he was at my friends house."....
1} Did It ever occur to you {or your friend} that the drooler was drooling as he really wanted to sell it from the beginning, and really only wanted it for the money it represented anyway?
2} It MAY have been an original drool over it, for real, BUT it may have passed since it's been a long time from drool to gift. His plans may have changed.
3} Brass would not really fit into MY scheme, though I have looked at them and drooled {online}, and often wished I had the money to aquire one . IF I were to receive a gift of one, while I'd treasure the gift, I'd probably [a ] politely refuse first, [b ] somewhere sell it myself, though i would probably "proudly" display it in the LR for a while first. But if IT was insisted I take it, then I'd have to, wouldn't I? Perhaps the same for this chap who received it?
I am NOT defending the guy, just maybe playing Devil's Advocate.
The giver is NEVER to be upset with a receiver's use/disuse of a gift, or what they do with it. If that extra blender the newly weds received for the wedding ends up at their first yard or garage sale, the giver has NO RECOURSE as to what the newly weds are doing with it!
THE ONLY ETIQUETTE in receiving a gift is to be "gracious" in receiving it.
THE ONLY ETIQUETTE in giving a gift is to allow the receiver to do with it as he/she pleases.
WHat one chooses to do with it after receiving is fully up to the receiver.
It really should NOT be held against the receiver for selling it, he is free to do with it as he pleases, even if it 'hurts' the seller that he sells it.
It's really THAT simple.
Unfortuantely.
**so dont gift me anything if you dont wnat to me to do wiht it as I please...and BTW: any gifts I HAVE received from generous givers from this site, are ALL STILL IN MY POSSESSION!
-G .
Just my thoughts, ideas, opinions and experiences. Others may vary.
HO and N Scale.
After long and careful thought, they have convinced me. I have come to the conclusion that they are right. The aliens did it.
galaxy just maybe playing Devil's Advocate.
I don't think the role suits, "O Keeper of the Candles."
Cheers, the Bear.
I never have nor will I ever sell a gift.I ain't built that way.
galaxy Batman Brent: You say:" A common aquaintance of ours use to drool over this thing constantly when he was at my friends house.".... 1} Did It ever occur to you {or your friend} that the drooler was drooling as he really wanted to sell it from the beginning, and really only wanted it for the money it represented anyway? 2} It MAY have been an original drool over it, for real, BUT it may have passed since it's been a long time from drool to gift. His plans may have changed. 3} Brass would not really fit into MY scheme, though I have looked at them and drooled {online}, and often wished I had the money to aquire one . IF I were to receive a gift of one, while I'd treasure the gift, I'd probably [a ] politely refuse first, [b ] somewhere sell it myself, though i would probably "proudly" display it in the LR for a while first. But if IT was insisted I take it, then I'd have to, wouldn't I? Perhaps the same for this chap who received it? I am NOT defending the guy, just maybe playing Devil's Advocate. The giver is NEVER to be upset with a receiver's use/disuse of a gift, or what they do with it. If that extra blender the newly weds received for the wedding ends up at their first yard or garage sale, the giver has NO RECOURSE as to what the newly weds are doing with it! THE ONLY ETIQUETTE in receiving a gift is to be "gracious" in receiving it. THE ONLY ETIQUETTE in giving a gift is to allow the receiver to do with it as he/she pleases. WHat one chooses to do with it after receiving is fully up to the receiver. It really should NOT be held against the receiver for selling it, he is free to do with it as he pleases, even if it 'hurts' the seller that he sells it. It's really THAT simple. Unfortuantely. **so dont gift me anything if you dont wnat to me to do wiht it as I please...and BTW: any gifts I HAVE received from generous givers from this site, are ALL STILL IN MY POSSESSION!
In mho to decide whether the friend acted inappropiately we need to know what the drooling consisted of. What did the friend say and how did he say it to indicate that he wanted the engine? This could throw some light of whether the donor was deceived and also the intententions of the recipient.
Just my worth
Bob
Don't Ever Give Up
The recipient of the Loco on the few times I have been around him, always came across as a bit of a deadbeat. An example would be, when a work party is called up he sits down and has a couple of beers first while everyone else has rolled up their sleeves and started working.
As far as the Loco goes, I did hear him say that "I wish I had something like that" or "I will never be able to afford one of these". I suspect he originally saw a nice Loco, never thinking it would be given to him and when that happened he all of a sudden saw a stack of cash.
The giver of the Loco is well into his seventies and though he hasn't said as much, I think he is starting to unload a few things in preparation of downsizing. He is like me in the way he hates going through the hassle of selling things. I tend to give away almost everything I don't need or want anymore that I feel someone else can use.
Galaxy, I did ask for opinions. Taking up the roll of "devils advocate" can get people thinking and stir up the conversation. I appreciate what you added to the discussion.
I was hesitant to post on a rather negative happening, I think I just needed to vent a bit about something that was really bugging me. A mans generosity was thrown back in his face. Knowing him though, it will not change him.
Brent:
You described the recipient as something of a deadbeat. I agree totally.
When I was in retail we frequently had to set up displays at home shows. It was heavy work moving entry doors and window displays into place. There were always a couple of guys who never lifted a finger but who were first in line for the pizza. Those people deserve no respect. Neither does the guy who sold the gift.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
hon30critterWhen I was in retail we frequently had to set up displays at home shows. It was heavy work moving entry doors and window displays into place.
Dave, we had a very tight group and could get a 747 freighter off loaded and loaded in no time. Every once in a while we would get some lazy twit that would come in and think he had made it in to a job that had a powerful union behind it, thus his effort was minimal. These types only lasted a few days, the rest of us made sure of that.
We worked very hard, were paid well and took pride in doing (no mistakes) work. A deadbeat in the mix wasn't welcome.
While, it is a gift, for some reason I hear Weird Al's "Cuz I'm Tacky".........
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.