ruderunner Of course the ultimate in RTR is one of the railroad builder services that have sprung up over the years. Sign the check, here's your layout.
Of course the ultimate in RTR is one of the railroad builder services that have sprung up over the years. Sign the check, here's your layout.
This is kind of the ultimate short-cut, and ironically, does allow someone with no modelling skills to have a potentially "museum quality" layout.
I've often wondered though, what do you do if something on one of these custom layouts breaks, or if you find some element of it no longer works for you. I guess, if you have the dinero to just write a check for a couple of G's to have a layout designed and built for you, you can just hire someone to come fix it.
For me, though, parts of my layout may not measure up in some people's eyes, but at least I can point to it and say, "I did that." Sometimes, though, you get a nice surprise. I've never thought my homemade trees were anything better than "good enough", but I recently had a visitor who said, "Wow, I like those trees! How much did it cost to buy all those?" I told him that I didn't buy them, I made them. He didn't really believe me until I showed him some in progress. Looking back, I guess they're a great improvement over most pre-made trees, at least.
Connecticut Valley Railroad A Branch of the New York, New Haven, and Hartford
"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." -- Henry Ford
I guess I kind of fit all molds. I recently decided to switch to HO so I could run sound. I don't have much of any room, so small layouts like Tom Miller's Meramec Valley RR layout from April '08 issue is a good inspiration. I started out with N scale so I do have a bit of that stuff, but I still plan on increasing my N scale stock, like a collection. I still plan to build a little some thing so I can run my N scale stuff (more or less something door sized with scenery and some track) but my main focus will be on the HO. I am a beginer, nothing more than a few locos and a few pieces of rolling stock. But I plan to hand lay track, try my hand at kitbashing (I love the look of the depot kitbash on the banner thing on the homepage), with a few wood kits, although I will say the sctucture kits are more attractive to me than the R-T-R stuff. Also, one other reason I decided to go wtih HO, car kits. The 'train store' I go to has a nicely sized collecting of car kits (don't know if they're resin or styrene) and I plan on getting at least a few. I will also be running soem R-T-R stuff so don't get me wrong. I love scenery so I plan to make hills using both methods, plastery type and rigid foam type, I also love tree's and water so some sort of water feature will be there and the layout would feature a mix of R-T-R trees, made trees, and cheating with ground foam. I also plan to have everything weathered.
Do I know some, if not most of this is beyond an average beginners skill level? Yes I do. Am I afraid to jump into something like above my skill level? No I am not, after all, that's how things are learned, by doing. I also am starting to know the gentlemen running the 'train store', and I know if I have a question about something I can go there for help, and the big local model rr club is right next door. I do also plan to eventually join that club.
Maybe what we really need is a nice, thick book - titled Model Railroading for Dummies.
It's true that someone with a generous endowment and a paid-off mortgage can buy a turnkey empire.
It's equally true that someone less financially fortunate can asemble an adequate layout from preassembled rolling stock, prebuilt structures and snap-together track.
However, one thing that usually happens is that the beginner starts to get interested in something that's a bit more advanced, like prototypical signaling, car card/waybill operation or trying to reproduce the essence of the old home town (or some other specific place.) As has been mentioned, with the demise of simple kits there's no convenient bridge from here to there. And, while there are some articles and some books that deal with parts of the knowledge required, finding a source of information can be a daunting experience in arcane research.
I admit that I would not be the ideal teacher (or author.) To be honest, I do a lot of things without giving the process much, if any, conscious thought. Thus, how do I explain my methods when most of the control inputs are subconscious? It's rather like trying to explain how to ride a bicycle.
Present day beginners may have an easier time just getting started. Getting beyond 'started' isn't as easy as it once was. Still, the object is to relax and have fun. It's just that fun has different definitions for each of us.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
Chuck
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Depends on one goals in the hobby.The majority of the modelers I know have no qualms about parking a RTR SD70M next to a Hobbytown RS3 they built 40 years ago.They have no clue if their GP40-2 is a phase 2 or 3 or if their Walthers interlocking tower isn't correct for (say) CR..Still they have tons of fun and buy as they will.
The few discriminating modelers I know is more selective in their modeling to ensure all is correct for their era and chosen railroad..They to have tons of fun.
The wild ones(as I calls 'em) are a close net group (19 at last count) that models exact by researching each locomotive condition for their era (as in month/year) they model and then model that locomotive has it was in (say) July '95.They also have tons of fun..I been to several of their bi monthly meetings by invitation and usually stand in awl of the information pass back and forth as well as the modeling.I seen locomotives with crack door glass only because in July '95 that glass was cracked!
The craftsmen,the good/close enough modelers,the wild ones,the operators and all others enjoy the hobby in their own way base on their skill level (or the lack of),hobby budget,time and hobby desires.
Isn't this a great hobby for one and all?
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
fwrightShould a beginner be expected to be able to build more than a shake-the-box kit, decal, paint and weather, scratch a simple structure, and understand his layout wiring by the time he finishes his 1st layout? Fred W
Should a beginner be expected to be able to build more than a shake-the-box kit, decal, paint and weather, scratch a simple structure, and understand his layout wiring by the time he finishes his 1st layout?
Fred W
It is my opinion that a beginner should be expected to do nothing more, or nothing less, than what gives them (not you or I) a pleasurable way to pass their free time. It's a hobby.
I have in the past two years quickly tired of the laments about the hobby headed off a cliff, in a bus full of RTT and DCC, and a blind old man named Kalmbach doing the driving.
I must say since my "re-introduction" to the hobby a few years ago, the one aspect that continues to work against that decision is the constant useless negativity some people harbor towards "other" elements of the hobby. Scales, control systems, RTR, other minutiae; the arguments are incessant, tiresome, and ineffectual other than to potentially turn a new hobbyist away.
My experience indicates there is plenty of room for everyone, from highrail tinplate on the plywood prarie to highly detailed static photo dioramas, to whatever it is I can't think of.
I would advocate that an increased number of interest and posts in the actual activity that is model railroading, rather than the theory thereof that seems overly prevalent, might help guide and create more excitement in the hobby.
Is it really that hard to keep perspective, and just say " that's *** cool" when it is, even if it's an Exactrail or Trueline Trains RTR freight car or a working grade crossing signal?
I'm trying to model 1956, not live in it.
I reckon that perhaps the NMRA should come up with a new category in their Model Railroader achievement tests....
Category #1: The Master Model Railroader
Category #2: The MasterCard Model Railroader
John
CTValleyRRThis is kind of the ultimate short-cut, and ironically, does allow someone with no modelling skills to have a potentially "museum quality" layout. I've often wondered though, what do you do if something on one of these custom layouts breaks, or if you find some element of it no longer works for you. I guess, if you have the dinero to just write a check for a couple of G's to have a layout designed and built for you, you can just hire someone to come fix it.
Yes, but there may also be a third possibility-- many people have the skills, or don't mind acquiring the skills, but either don't have the time or the inclination (for whatever reason) to do it all from scratch from the git-go. So hiring all or part of the initial build may be an expedient way to get their layout up and running. And then if there's any problems or issues that come up later, or else they want to change or extend the layout, they might either already know how to do it, or else can figure it out. I know a lot of people in non-model railroad contexts that probably don't have the drive or inclination to design and build something from the ground up, but can fix pretty much anything that goes wrong.
tomikawaTTI admit that I would not be the ideal teacher (or author.) To be honest, I do a lot of things without giving the process much, if any, conscious thought. Thus, how do I explain my methods when most of the control inputs are subconscious? It's rather like trying to explain how to ride a bicycle.
Explaining how to ride a bicycle is easy:
Step #1: Get on the bike and start peddling
Step #2: Don't fall off.
See?
jwhitten Explaining how to ride a bicycle is easy: Step #1: Get on the bike and start peddling Step #2: Don't fall off. See? John
Kind of like explaining soldering.... sounds easy, until you melt your PCB or half of your track ties trying to do it.
I am most definitely new to the hobby. My late grandfather had an HO empire, but that was years ago. I've recently started into modeling as a way to relax, and start a rewarding hobby for myself. I currently live in an apartment, with very little space. I barely have space for a work desk, and a shelf to store my rolling stock on. I joined a club not only to have a place to run my stock, but also as a place to witness, and learn how veterans of the hobby go about their ways. I now have access to hundreds of years of knowledge, and thousands of feet of modeled main line to watch, and learn about.
As I said, my space is limited. So I focus on the aspects of the hobby that I have room, and finances to do. I really enjoy building kits, and weathering. Even the RTR stuff is fun for me to weather. I live right above the BSNF/UP mainline in Tacoma, and it's fun to watch a few roll by, and then try to emulate that on a kit, or RTR boxed freight car. Buying a few cars at a time also is within the budget that my Army salary provides.
Don't get me wrong. I would love an HO coal hauling empire (maybe one day). Until then though, I'll stay with in my "yard limits" by building, weathering and learning the hobby. I read all the literature I can find, and soak up all the small talk at club meetings. I feel like it's preparation for the future when I have the time, space, and funds to start my first layout. Plus, by then I'll have a nicely weathered fleet of rolling stock and locomotives to serve my layout.
Happy Modeling
Kyle
PUGET SOUND LINES
"Service, Pride and Efficiency"
Interesting topic. I seem to be an example of what you all are talking about.
I'm a semi-recent newbie that started 5 years ago. There were numerous amounts of kits available for cheap in era, but when Roundhouse was acquired, those kits dried up quickly.But as you know, those kits were pretty easy to build. My son's Hogwarts engine took a dive in Concrete Canyon, and I tried to console him by building a 4-6-0 form a roundhouse kit I found.
I'm starting to see a few RTR kits in my era now, but I'd rather the kit because it is easier to strip and paint the kit.
I did do my share of RTR by buying "lots" of structures off eBay. I soon found that they were not good enough, and either resold them or upgraded them to match my expectations.
I started with EZ Track, but found it was not good enough and ripped up the layout.
Since then I have been scratch-building and kit-bashing kits (including "craftsman" kits) to get the look I want.
I did however enter the hobby with a fair amount of skills. So far my biggest difficult has been soldering. But after building a couple dozen turnouts, I feel I am semi-competent now.
Chip
Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.
krupa..Instead of forming an online partnership, the magazine could just provide LHS's with a parts list and say this is the "official kit for the September project". And they could provide it to their customers if they so desire....Anyway, it's a thought for helping beginners get into more difficult aspects of the hobby. It may be more hand-holding that some of you guys like, but I think it would be a great help. -matthew
Anyway, it's a thought for helping beginners get into more difficult aspects of the hobby. It may be more hand-holding that some of you guys like, but I think it would be a great help.
-matthew
Model Railroader used to do exactly as you proposed with their project layouts in the 1950s. Even now, Atlas or Kato will put together track "kits" for some MR project layouts. The question has always been - how many duplicates of a given published project layout ever get built? Do the sales justify putting together the kit?
Woodland Scenics and Atlas have combined to set up "complete" packages for a few layouts. I believe the N versions are actually more popular than the HO, but that's just a guess on my part. I would be tempted to buy such a kit - and modify it significantly - but the kits seem relatively high-priced for what they contain. And the track plans have almost no operating potential - they seem to be oriented around building scenery using WS products. You then do display running of your train through the fabulous scenery you built.
WS also offers a 4x8 complete scenery kit. And they have the Mod-u-Rail system discussed in another thread. WS often (usually?) has scenery clinics at the major train shows, showing how to use their products. So I would have to say WS does a lot of hand-holding, which probably has contributed to WS dominating scenery material sales in most hobby shops.
my thoughts, your choices