Diesel for mid-50's

[donhalshanks]

Got some Christmas money to spend, and I want to buy a diesel that you might find running on the short lines in the Midwest or Northeast in Mid-50s.  My knowledge is VERY limited at this stage on diesel history, GP#'s, SD#'s, etc., so could you recommend a few of the more populous ones?   Thanks for your help in advance!

Hal

 

 

[bogp40]

Got some Christmas money to spend, and I want to buy a diesel that you might find running on the short lines in the Midwest or Northeast in Mid-50s.  My knowledge is VERY limited at this stage on diesel history, GP#'s, SD#'s, etc., so could you recommend a few of the more populous ones?   Thanks for your help in advance!

Hal

 

 

GP7s, GP9s, were probably the most common, but also RS1 and RS3s, Trainmasters. Don't forget about my personal favorite, the EMD F units. F3 were rebuilds by then and both phases of the F7 and Bs. These were geared for both passenger and freight. Some short lines ran switchers S1 and S2s NW2s VO1000s. Most of the SDs 7and9s were used for low speed drag, heavy pullers.

[Anonymous]

I have a Proto SD7 for the Chessie Railroad that runs (Analog, no sound or DCC) but I find the 6 axle unit is too big for some of my kato switches.

I will be replacing them with the new Proto 4 axle GP9's for the Chessie with DCC and Sound sometime in 2008. I run in the 50's as well as the modern times.

I have F units and E units as well. The F is for manifest freight work and the E's are passenger only.

GP's are the popular engines because the engineers hated switching in the F units. Leaning out of the window looking back was a difficult. The new GP's provided better support for humans who need to see everything and walk on everything.

SD means special duty. It was given 6 axles so it can lightly go places where the track is not as strong.

[Blind Bruce]

Aw why worry about it. Just buy more steamers.

[dti406]

Also for the Midwest and Northeast, Alco FA's & RS11's, Baldwin Sharks (B&O and PRR), Baldwin DS4-4-10, S-8, S-12, VO 660 and 1000 were all popular engines running around the area.

 

Rick 

[potlatcher]

I want to buy a diesel that you might find running on the short lines in the Midwest or Northeast in Mid-50s.

I guess it depends on how you define the term shortline.  Some of the roads running in those two regions back then would be shortlines or regional railroads in today's terms, but were Class One lines at the time.  Thinking of several of these types of railroads (M&StL or CGW in the midwest, B&M or MEC in the NE) Alco roadswitchers (RS-1 and -2) were very prevalent locmotives (as were F-units, but mostly on through freights).  By the mid fifties, the GP-7 had been out on the market for five years (starting in 1949), but the GP-9 had just been released in 1954.  Of course, before the GP series, there was the BL-2.  I think both BAR and B&M had BL-2s in the NE, but only the Rock Island had them in the midwest.

Among the true shortlines in the midwest, Midland Continental had a pair of RS-1s, Duluth & Northeastern had a few older EMD switchers - SW-1s and NW-2s, and I know of a few even more obscure lines that had GE 44-ton or 70-ton switchers.  I also have images of GEs being used on some of the NE shortlines.  And you really can't go wrong with an Alco switcher (S-1 thru S-4) on any railroad in the mid-fifties.

To sum up, stick with switchers (Alco, EMD, and GE in that order of popularity) or shorter 4-axle road switchers (primarily Alco, and maybe EMD), and your locomotive will definetely fit into your chosen time and location.

Tom

PS, even though I personally think Baldwins and FMs are really cool, and they were certainly in existence at the time, I am having a hard time coming up with many mental images of them working on midwest or NE shortlines.  Doesn't mean it didn't happen, but if you're trying to find a "typical" shortline engine for that time and those places, I would avoid models of either type.

[tstage]

Hal,

Are you interested in any particular RR line or does it matter?

Tom

[R. T. POTEET]

I am going to take a stab at a response to your question done with a caveat that this is a "by guess" answer i.e. that I have nothing except a logical analysis to justify what I am about to say.

The time era you specify was still in what we term "the transition era" when the Class Is were "transitioning" to diesel operations from steam; hence there were not a lot of "used" diesels on the market. Most steam engines were going under the scrapper's torch - insert the sound of heavy sobbing at this location - but a few were sold to shortline operations. A lot of just what kind of diesel locomotives one might encounter on your shortline is going to be dependent on just what kind of shortline operation to which you aspire.

If your shortline has a relatively long mainline - say 85 miles from point A to point B - and it has the traffic volume then it is not out of reason that it could justify the expense of the purchase of what we today term 1st generation diesels. Perhaps one might even find a couple of EMD or Alco covered wagons covering 'mainline' operations. EMD GP7/9s or Alco RS2/3s would be excellent units for these operations. There were some other players in this game all of whom could have provided road switchers for operations: Baldwin had a couple of 1000/1200 horsepower units on the market at this time in both BB and A1A-A1A/CC configurations; Fairbanks-Morse also had some BB unit in their catalog at this time. Again these types of locomotives tended to be a little on the expensive side and would have required substantial revenues to justify their acqisition.

If your shortline is a marginal operation economically - hanging onto existence by the skin of its teeth - OR if it is an operation serving a bunch of (relatively) short spurs - then it is most likely that it is going to acquire end-cab switchers. EMD's SW1, NW2, SW8, SW7, and SW9 models were just out of production and being succeeded by SW900s and SW1200s. Alco had only recently ceased production of it's S3 model in 1953; production of their S1 and S2 models had ended in 1950; at the time referenced by your inquiry their S4 model was in current production. As was true of road switchers both Baldwin and Fairbanks-Morse were cataloging end-cab switchers at this time.

I have not meant to imply that there were not second-hand units available on the market in the mid-'50s and I might at this point inject that, although pre-WWII end-cab switchers had been offered with only low production numbers, relatively speaking Alco's high-hood models from that era had had pretty good sales and these would be excellent candidates for units acquired second-hand. If I were looking for diesel locomotives to power my mid-'50's shortline I would probably look for these Alco high-hoods; I seem to recall someone offering these many, many years ago but I am not aware of any recent mass-production offerings in either HO Scale or N Scale.

If your shortline is going to have a more industrial-based operation - short trackage with a lot of switching on short radius curves such as are likely to be encountered in warehouse districts - I would probably consider going with General Electric's 44 ton units. These had fair sales quantities and could move trains of ten to twenty cars over track with moderate grades. Shortlines loved them because they overcame the featherbedding rule and even the Class 1s operated a substantial quantity of them.

Hope I might have been of some help. I will take this moment to wish you and yours a prosperous New Year.

Jay aka R.T.POTEET.

[tgindy]

Diesel Chronology(s) 'R Us...

http://www.urbaneagle.com/data/RRdieselchrono.html 

[3railguy]

A good place to start is to choose a short line you want to model. The Fallen Flags website list a number of shortlines (other roads) in their alphabetical index.

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/

It seems Alcos and Baldwin 4 axle diesels were popular with short lines. Many shortlines were and are mom and pop organizations that were set up to pick off freight from class 1 railroads and delivered it to local industries that were too small for class 1 railroads to cater to. 10 or 20 car consists were pretty common so smaller switchers were all that was needed. Many were purchased second hand from class 1 railroads. 

Atlas is good for offering special runs of locomotives with short line roadnames.

[ndbprr]

A lot of short lines were buying steam engines from the Major railroads for scrap prices that still had years of service left in them at that time.  I agree that an SW-1, RS-1, BL-2 or GP-7 would probably be about the newest power on a short line.

[loathar]

Diesel Chronology(s) 'R Us...

http://www.urbaneagle.com/data/RRdieselchrono.html 

GREAT list of born on dates! THANKS!

[JimRCGMO]

Couple of other places to check for info:

http://membrane.com/~elmer/rail/product.html 

http://www.hazegray.org/rail/product.htm

Also, Jim Kelly had a list back a ways in MR:

The ABC's of diesel dates - what ran when
Model Railroader, July 1987 page 58

I'd like to see MR run an updated list of that, bringing things up to today's diesel models (for other modelers, since my layout is in the famed 'transition era' (mid-to-late 1950's).

Hope some of that's useful for you.

 

Blessings,

Jim in Cape Girardeau 

 

[donhalshanks]

I have learned so very much from all of your responses, and I thank you for taking time to answer my elementary question.  Your knowledge is so evident and the history it imparts is wonderful.  I am freelancing in HO, so I have some flexibility (of fiction) in explaining why something is running on my shortline, or I can re-decal my freelance name.

You have given me authentic choices and I go forth to purchase with confidence! Thanks.

Hal 

 

[Texas Zepher]

I want to buy a diesel that you might find running on the short lines in the Midwest or Northeast in Mid-50s.

Our club layout is set in 1953.  We have put together a list to help new members know what is and is-not era appropriate.   I've webified it at the link below.  If one moves just a few years later all the EMD "nines" come into play F9, E9, GP9 etc.

Diesels of 1953:
http://www.walkersquawker.net/DieselsOf1953.html

[tgindy]

In case the link to Andrew Toppan's "Motive Power Rosters" at Rick Blanchard's "Diesel Chronology" was overlooked, the new website is "The Diesel Shop" at...

http://www.thedieselshop.us/

[donhalshanks]

Thanks "Texas Zepher" and "tgindy" for these last two internet sites.  Very helpful!

Hal

[BRAKIE]

Got some Christmas money to spend, and I want to buy a diesel that you might find running on the short lines in the Midwest or Northeast in Mid-50s.  My knowledge is VERY limited at this stage on diesel history, GP#'s, SD#'s, etc., so could you recommend a few of the more populous ones?   Thanks for your help in advance!

Hal

 

Hal,Depending on the size and traffic of the short line.I will recommend the following for your consideration:

Alco.

RS1

RS2

RS3

EMD

GP7

GP9

Any one of the above units would give a all around roster for a short line.

Now off the well beaten path you could use a Baldwin Road Switcher like Bowser/Stewart makes.