Rich. I believe he has switched the polarity on the rails on one side of the green sections. On the lower loop the red is in the outside coming into the green section and then the black is on the outside leaving the green section. I believe that it would work, but the wiring would be different to say the least. i prefer to have a continuous rail with the same polarity but in the diagram shown he has switched the polarity of the rails and used the reversing section to switch the polarity in the green sections.
Jake,
The simpilistic way to find a reverse loop is to trace one rail such as the outside one and when it meets the inside rail you have a reverse loop. Then that loop is isolated
I'd undo changing the polarity of the track with bus wiring and eliminate the green colored track/wiring as well.
Just show the track plaese.
When I asked for help installing two reversing loops I just provided the track diagram and let the "experts" make the appropiate comments.
In trying to help, to me atleast, you have made arriving at and explaining a solution more difficult.
No offense meant, just trying to be of help also.
Bob
Don't Ever Give Up
Bob and other folks - I am embarrassed about the quality of my drawings but that is the TRACKS, not the buss that I am diagramming.
I plan to have a single main buss line that will run down the center with track feeds leading to the red and black tracks. Floridaflyer is correct, I have kept all the track so that the red (or A) track is inside and the black track outside. At the loops, the reversers will make the change. The reversers will be wired so the the inputs come from the main buss and the reverser outputs will go to track feeds in the green sections.
I do have all metal wheels and I can make those reversing sections at least 8-10' each, which gives a train of 16+ cars, probably all that my branch line motive power should handle anyway.
Rich - I do see the possibility of collisions so I will have to be diligent in my attention!
As always, I am very grateful and appreciative of all those who have followed this string and given good advice. I have fretted a lot and learned a lot. Now it is time to turn to wiring the layout.
floridaflyer Rich. I believe he has switched the polarity on the rails on one side of the green sections. On the lower loop the red is in the outside coming into the green section and then the black is on the outside leaving the green section. I believe that it would work, but the wiring would be different to say the least. i prefer to have a continuous rail with the same polarity but in the diagram shown he has switched the polarity of the rails and used the reversing section to switch the polarity in the green sections.
I see what you mean. I think that is poor practice to color portions of the rail differently. It only leads to confusion and bad wiring.
Rich
Alton Junction
To avoid confusion and wiring problems, each rail should consistently be the same color when drawing track diagrams. The objective is to establish and maintain proper polarity throughout the main sections of the layout. That way, as others have indicated, a reverse polarity situation is immediately obvious when different color rails are joined together. When that occurs, the mismatched rails must be gapped to avoid a short.
In the diagram that follows, the two black circles indicate the points of reverse polarity on your proposed layout. You can immediately see the reverse polarities by the conflicting colors of the mismatched rails inside the circles.
The first reversing section, marked A, requires additional gaps at points A-1 and A-2 to isolate the reversing section which should be longer than the longest train that will occupy it. Depending upon the length of the longest train, the gaps at A-2 may need to be moved further to the right.
The second reversing section, marked B, requires additional gaps at points B-1, B-2, and B-3 to isolate the reversing section which should be longer than the longest train that will occupy it. Depending upon the length of the longest train, the gaps at B-2 may need to be moved further to the right around the curve in that section of track. On the other hand, if the reversing section can be shortened sufficiently, the gaps at B-2 may be able to be moved to the right of the gaps at B-1 just to the right of that turnout, in which case the gaps at B-3 could be eliminated.
Rich - this brings us back to the way I started the diagrams.
I assume that I am also supposed to gap at A and B points? And inside the area including the crossover track is where the output feeds of the reverser will be?
One thing I do not think I like is that the programming track and yard ends up in the reversing section. Can that be altered? Or does it matter. The length from B-1 to B-2 is less than 2' so I would have to move B-2 (and A-2) quite a ways around those loops.
Thanks for taking the time and patience to map this out for me.
Program track in the reverse section isn't a problem. the program track will be isolated and wired separately. You are correct that you will have to move the gap at "A" further away so as to lengthen the reversing section, Again no problem as you have plenty of space to do that. "B" looks to be long enough but you could move it to the right if you want to. Following this plan is much clearer and more easily wired than your original plan. Switching polarity on the main can only lead to confusion and problems.
pathvet9 Rich - this brings us back to the way I started the diagrams. I assume that I am also supposed to gap at A and B points? And inside the area including the crossover track is where the output feeds of the reverser will be? One thing I do not think I like is that the programming track and yard ends up in the reversing section. Can that be altered? Or does it matter. The length from B-1 to B-2 is less than 2' so I would have to move B-2 (and A-2) quite a ways around those loops. Thanks for taking the time and patience to map this out for me.
Yes, you need to gap the rails at points A and B, as I mentioned earlier in that last post. Those are the two most critical locations on the layout because reverse polarity occurs there as the track folds back onto itself. Moving the gaps for A-2 and B-2 further down the track is no problem and, as you indicate, may be necessary in order to accomodate the longest train inside the reversing section. You have to cut gaps in the rails where the circles and black boxes are on my diagram in order to fully isolate the two reversing sections.
Actually, this layout is interesting in that the two reversing sections potentially occupy more than half of the main line. As such, the main section, the non-reversing section, is the shorter of the two.
It would be feasible to actually eliminate some of the gaps and merely create one large reversing section, but that may be for another day.
As florida flyer indicates, the location of the programming track inside the reversing question is really not an issue since it must be gapped and isolated in any event. But be sure that you are familiar with how to deal with a programming track, even if gapped and isolated, when it is connected to the main track. Personally, I prefer to keep the programming track completely separate.
floridaflyer Program track in the reverse section isn't a problem. the program track will be isolated and wired separately. You are correct that you will have to move the gap at "A" further away so as to lengthen the reversing section, Again no problem as you have plenty of space to do that. "B" looks to be long enough but you could move it to the right if you want to. Following this plan is much clearer and more easily wired than your original plan. Switching polarity on the main can only lead to confusion and problems.
Yep, I am in full agreement.
Tell us about your timing.
Have you already laid the track? Installed the bus wires?
When do you plan to cut the gaps and install the auto-reversers ?
Well, right now I am in Fort Myers Beach, FL taking care of my Mom but am heading home in a week or 2. Don't think I will be laying more track for a week or 2 as I have other interests and am building some armor models for my clubs. Still have to build the curves and bridges on the lower curve as well.
BTW, I used the directions from a past forum to wire the program track. It is totally isolated from the main tracks by 2 gap sections as well as a 3 pole switch.
I will keep in touch as I go along. Cheers and thanks again.
pathvet9 Well, right now I am in Fort Myers Beach, FL taking care of my Mom but am heading home in a week or 2. Don't think I will be laying more track for a week or 2 as I have other interests and am building some armor models for my clubs. Still have to build the curves and bridges on the lower curve as well. BTW, I used the directions from a past forum to wire the program track. It is totally isolated from the main tracks by 2 gap sections as well as a 3 pole switch. I will keep in touch as I go along. Cheers and thanks again.
That programming track arrangement is perfect, no problems there.
Spent a winter in Fort Myers a few years back. Made the mistake of taking that local road through Fort Myers Beach on my way back from Bonita Springs during Spring Break Week. Took me over three hours to get through there. Never again.
Rich - you are right about this Beach, one way on or off, and Mom has to go somewhere every day so we sit.
As to the track plan, I assume that you did not like my ideas because i was changing the track color (therefore, polarity on each loop. Still don't understand why that would not work but I will print out your plan and study it when I get a chance.
pathvet9 As to the track plan, I assume that you did not like my ideas because i was changing the track color (therefore, polarity on each loop. Still don't understand why that would not work but I will print out your plan and study it when I get a chance.
Changing the color of the rails to reflect changes in polarity lends itself to confusion and posible wiring mishaps. The two rails should each retain their same color throughout the layout on a track diagram to identify mismatched polarities when opposite colors meet.
So, it's not that your approach would not work, it's just that using the same color for each rail throughout the layout is more conventional. Your way of doing it anticipates the change in polarity before it occurs.
But, however you draw up the track plan, the resulting rail gaps should still be the same and in the same relative positions. Any mismatched polarity must be avoided by gapping the rails; otherwise, a dead short will occur. Moreover, the entire reversing section must be isolated from the main section of the layout by additional gaps so that a flipped polarity in the reversing section will not adversely affect any train in a non-reversing section of track.