"Pre-wide cab GE's are famous or rather infamous for having exhust fumes leak into the cab. Plus (at least the ones I've been on) there's that lovely chemical toilet smell. For some reason, the GE toilets always stunk worse then the EMD ones.
Oh, and if you ever ride on an older GE, you'll understand why we call them washing machines".
So:- one thing I've never seen an article or anything at all on is how/where the chemical toilets get cleaned at at loco facilities - or anywhere else.
So, if we can have (we do have) a serious thread on cow poo...
And we do have several threads on outhouses...
Is the work put out to specialist contractors?
Do the locos stop by a sluice room facility ?
I know what happened in steam days... it went in the firebox... come to think of it... you couldn't do that with a power stoker... ??? Or oil fired...???
I reckon that a steam footplate at speed must have been more of a skilled job than any diesel.
Now that sound is getting so advanced will the next development be "authentic loco smells"? They're very evocative...
Have a nice day
Dave,
You do come up with some....um....interesting topics.
For the most part, toilets are serviced at the service track. With something like this:
Major toilet issues are handled at the heavy repair shop.
There's nothing quite like the aroma of a locomotive that's been baking in the sun on a 100 degree day.
Nick
Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/
nbrodar wrote: Dave, You do come up with some....um....interesting topics. For the most part, toilets are serviced at the service track. Major toilet issues are handled at the heavy repair shop. There's nothing quite like the aroma of a locomotive that's been baking in the sun on a 100 degree day. Nick
For the most part, toilets are serviced at the service track. Major toilet issues are handled at the heavy repair shop.
With steam, you were on your own at any stopping point. The coaling tower where we used to watch had an outhouse and it was used now and then. The servicing of the engine normally took about twenty minutes or so and during an oil around, there were always a chance for relief.
Nick...
I may come up with interesting topics but you come up with the great asnwers!
Baking in 100 degrees? Urgh! NASTY!
John...
Your post reminded me that our long distance passenger cars used to "vent to space". That's why they had the signs "Do not flush while train is standing in the station". When I worked on the Brighton Line Resignalling in the (as I recall) mid 80s the technicians always made a point of removing all gear (right down to a pair of pliers) from the 4' before any train past. The law of diminishing returns or something just dictated that if you didn't a bull's eye would be scored.
Somewhere I have a copy of a RR mag article from the 1890s about USA station sanitation (I'll try and find it) apparently the ends of the platforms were the worst in the spring when the snow melted... YEUK! Just thought... I should find that article for Spacemouse.
Thanks for the information guys. It may be revolting but it's real life and a great laugh
I've just been around the railroad long enough to have great stories. Including, some that make me believe I live a charmed life.
Plus, I love the challenge of answering your questions.
nbrodar wrote: Dave, I've just been around the railroad long enough to have great stories. Including, some that make me believe I live a charmed life. Plus, I love the challenge of answering your questions. Nick
Glad you live a charmed life
If you enjoy a challenge... How about explaining US signalling to me? Preferably the kind I'd find around Chicago (West side/CNW) No cheating... don't go for cab signals!
Larger points have a in ground concrete septic tank at the service track. Depending on the location of the sewer lines it is either hooked up to the sewer or when full the tank is pumped out by a waste disposal contactor. All engines have a standard fitting and valve on the toilet dump pipe. The hose from the septic tank is hooked up to the dump pipe,valve is opened,and a water hose is used to put water into the toilet to flush the tank out.
The early GE's smelled so bad due the toilet design(no flapper in the bottom of the bowl to seal off the fumes),lack of seal on the toilet door, and the location of the toilet. EMD's were chemical toilets with a flapper in the bottom of the bowl that stayed closed unless the toilet was flushing, The EMD's were located down in the nose and the GE's were in the cab with you behind a door.
JA545 wrote: Larger points have a in ground concrete septic tank at the service track. Depending on the location of the sewer lines it is either hooked up to the sewer or when full the tank is pumped out by a waste disposal contactor. All engines have a standard fitting and valve on the toilet dump pipe. The hose from the septic tank is hooked up to the dump pipe,valve is opened,and a water hose is used to put water into the toilet to flush the tank out. The early GE's smelled so bad due the toilet design(no flapper in the bottom of the bowl to seal off the fumes),lack of seal on the toilet door, and the location of the toilet. EMD's were chemical toilets with a flapper in the bottom of the bowl that stayed closed unless the toilet was flushing, The EMD's were located down in the nose and the GE's were in the cab with you behind a door.
Just got to ask this! Do Kato, P2K, Atlas, atearn et al (Who is AL?) model this pipe or can it be got from one of the detailing parts suppliers? Where is it on the locos???
(It's much more fun not taking the hobby seriously )!
JA545, I guess you're right. I never bothered to look at the bottom of the toilet to see if there was a flapper or not. Blue chemical toilet water isn't something I really want to study.
As you can see the red arrow is pointing at the toilet drain. All are located in the same place on EMD engines. Due to the pic you can't see if it has the drain valve on the pipe or if it is inside in the toilet.
Just be glad you don't need a comfort stop in a NS engine. No blue water, just a plastic bag ("dry hopper"). At least on the high nose jobs, you don't have to contort yourself too much to get in there.
Mike WSOR engineer | HO scale since 1988 | Visit our club www.WCGandyDancers.com
This is one of the most entertaining and informative threads I've read in a long time, thanks for posting! I've never really thought about where it all goes. I have a video from the 90's that shows two Metra trains paralleling each other while one douses the other with some kind of liquid coming from one of the cars. Could this be um... "waste"? This is a little off topic but,
Originally posted by Dave-the-Train, Oh, and if you ever ride on an older GE, you'll understand why we call them washing machines".
Don't know anything about Metra trains as I have never seen one.
The Older GE engines were called U-boats and compared to washing machines due to the excessive vibration of the diesel engine. When idling a GE engine felt like you were on a galloping horse or on a boat in ruff seas. Sitting in the cab of one would literally rock you to sleep. As the engine speed increased the vibration increased in frequency and felt like it was going to shake apart till you got past throttle position 3 or 4. I have replaced quite a few handrail,handrail stanchion,and grab iron bolts and door hinges due to them wearing out from the vibration. During the winter a roll of masking tape was standard issue to a road crew if they got on a train with a U-boat in the lead. Due to the wear on the door hinges from the vibration even when closed the rubber door gasket wouldn't seal off the air blowing in the cab. Had a lot of trouble with the water coolers and refrigerators bolts ripping through the plywood cab floors from the constant vibration. Most of them were retrofitted with a 2" wide by 1/8" thick steel strap wrapped around them and welded to the wall of the cab to keep the bolts from tearing through the floor.
Thanks for the reply, having to seal the door with tape and weld the cooler to the wall doesn't sound like very much fun!
Oh the horror stories I could tell about what the vibrations of GE engines did the the governers,fuel pump/lines,oil lines/filters,cooling water lines/sight glasses,and air compressor. But the most frightening part is what might or might not get sprayed all over you when opening the door to see what the problem was. You couldn't shut the engine down first as you had to see what was leaking and where it was leaking from.
Due to heath issues, locomotives have not been equipped with water coolers since the 1970s. The large water bottles were easily contaminated.
Rather, crews are provided with individual 8 or 10 oz, bottles of water. Supplies of water and ice are provided at crew points. Some places use ice machines, and some places use outside ice contractors.
When I started on the railroad in 1976 there were 3 classes of workers in the Mechinical Department. Laborer,Apprentice Carman,and Carman. There were two types of laborers, engine service and repair track. The engine service laborer supplied every engine with a 5 gallon metal can of ice water,paper towels,rags,and paper drinking water cups. While suppling the engines the laborer would clean the windows and sweep out the cab. A metal cooler like this...
http://cgi.ebay.com/1960s-ERA-IGLOO-GALVANIZED-BEVERAGE-COOLER-5-GALLON_W0QQitemZ180021341715QQcmdZViewItem
In the late 70's the metal cans were replaced with plastic ones like this....
http://bestmaterials.com/detail.aspx?ID=10756
The MP railroad started buying water in 8oz plastic bottles. After the merger this was changed to 12oz bottles and a few years ago they started buying 10oz bottles. Different railroads bought different brands of water in 8 to 16 ounce plastic bottles. Some railroads even bought water in the plastic cups with the aluminum foil seal like orange juice comes in.
So instead of ice water the cans were packed with ice and water bottles. After the UP-MP merger the cans were done away with and a standard 5 gallon plastic bucket with a styrofoam insert were used. If a engine had a working refrigarator the water bottles were put in there instead of putting a cooler on the engine. But by the late 90's most engines that had a refrigarator weren't maintained so they didn't work. In the 90's the NS stopped buying water cans and started buying Rubbermaid and Igloo 24 to 48 quart ice chests. Needless to say the ice chests very seldom made it back to the NS on run through trains.
In the mid 80's laborers were no longer hired at smaller points and as the laborers retired their duties were taken over by carmen. At larger points there still are laborers that load up a pickup at the begining of each shift with a dozen or so coolers of ice/bottled water and supply switch engines. In the last several years with the use of remote controled switch engines the laborer drops the coolers off at the switchman's shanties. The laborers still supply road engines and run throughs. At smaller points the crew make up thier own coolers with ice/bottled water.
Great! Thanks!
That explains why I've noticed cool boxes on the short hood of several locos in pics of yard ops.
Cool!
So having a company pickup parked next to a engine with a laborer climbing up on it with a can of ice water and other supplies would be something that happens on the railroad all the time that I have never seen modeled. Or a laborer climbing on a caboose with two 5 gallon buckets of ice and supplies as all cabooses had one or two large 2'x3' by 2' deep insulated ice boxes on them. With some of the cabooses in local service having 3 ice boxes. As most locals went 50-75 miles a day,spent the night,and came back the next day so the ice had to last for 2 days every trip. With some locals that ran between outlying points had a local ice company supply the caboose with ice once a week and the crew had to make a can of ice water every day for the enigneneer from the ice in the caboose ice box. If the crew was in a hurry they wouldn't stop but just dump the water out of the old can and drop it on the ground about 15 feet before the got to the laborer. Then the laborer would hand a fresh can of ice water and supplies up to the crew as they went by.