I understand that using 1" to 1/1/2" foam board to cover the plywood is a good way to
start your layout! But in using flex track how do you fix the track to the foam?
Glues???
It depends on the type of track and roadbed you use.
I personally use flextrack on cork roadbed, so I first glue the roadbed to the foam, then I glue the track to the roadbed, using track nails and pins to hold the track in place until the adhesive dries. If you plan on using something like EZ Track, or a similar product that has the roadbed already attached, then, obviously, you could simply glue the track straight to the foam.
The most important point to keep in mind, is that whatever adhesive you use must be "foam friednly", i.e. one that will not dissolve or otherwise affect the foam. I personally use Liquid Nails for Projects. It works quite well.
Careful following my advice, I am new here...
First Remove the plastic from the foam.
Glue/screw the foam to the Plywood.
Elmers glue and nail roadbed to the foam
Then Elmers glue and nail track to roadbed.
I use plain old cork roadbed and Atlas Flex. I seems to work fine for me.
But my experience is only about 9 months in the hobby.
Good answers so far.
I like Woodland scenics foam roadbed. It is easier to use than cork and allows more adjustment as time goes by.
I am a fan of cheap LATEX clear caulk. (not silicon) It goes on easy and can be taken up when you change your mind. A small bead down the middle, spred thin with a putty knife will do it. I hold some track down with books or bricks or any heavy items while it dries.
Thank you for the advice and feedback!
I was going to use from 1" foam to 1-1/2" for a HO layout.
The flex will be held in place, as advised here by 1-1/4" to 2" finishing nails while glue drys!
sounds good with the cork road bed as a base for the gravel. The nails used, I guess, have to be very small braids! But can you get them 1" to 1-1/2" long?
I want to use the foam under the tracks so I can contour around the tracks.
Thanks again
(Hmm, we get this question a lot, it seems. And my answer is always the same)
Latex caulk. No nails needed. Grab a pack of pins at Staples, the ones witht he colord beed on the head, as temporary hold-downs while the caulk dries, pull them up and reuse as you go along. They're long enough to go into the track and roadbed. I usually only need them to hold curves to shape and at joint locations to keep things aligned.
Caulk is cheap, easy to use, easy to pull up track if you change your mins, and it it tacky right from the start, but gives a good 20-30 minutes working time until it actually dries, so you can sight down the track and push it into alignment without having to rush around like Lucy in the candy factory.
Caulk works equally well with foam or plywood for a base. It works equally well with cork or the WS foam roadbed.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Thank yo ufor the reply!
I am going to try your techquie tonight. I am using 1" foam over the plywood!
I will look for the pins you are describing. I am sure I can get long ones!
again will be using flex track! I have soldered two of the flex so easy to make curves with them. We have clued the foam to the board already and now just waiting the track!
Thank you again
I just tried the caulk thing last night...it's SO EASY!
I'm using WS foam trackbed and I found out it's so elastic I don't need pins to hold it down (I did use pins to hold it down to test the trackplan)! The caulk grips it right away!
I tried it on a test section of track on my "Try-O-Rama" and it was extremely easy. Just a little caulk spread thin does the trick. It's firm enough to hold the track to the roadbed securely yet soft enough to remove with a little force. I was impressed.
Hi!
I am using the foam board because you can cut out the contours and side slopes
out of the foam. It looks very natural and cheap to do! I dont know the name of the foam board but its pink and rigid, comes in various thickness! If you use something like a 2" foam
you can have a various amounts of changing contours! I noticed that this is a poplar method.
and alot of fun shaping the foam. My question was holding down the flexible track while the glue dried! But there are alot of methods as listed above! I had said HO above but we had moved to the S scale.
Happy Railroading!!
csmith9474 wrote:I was dead set on using Homasote sound board, but it seems the foam is the way to go. Any input on this?
I prefer Homasote to any other material for roadbed. Homasote does 2 things very, very well. It is an excellent noise reducer, and it takes and holds track spikes better than any other material. The latter reason is why it is a favorite among those who hand lay track.
The primary drawback of Homasote is the dust mess it makes when you cut it. Quite a bit more mess than cutting foam.
Sheet extruded foam is also easier to carve out for below track scenery. In fact, most folks use Homasote only as roadbed or as a flat surface where structures are going to be mounted. Homasote is not a practical carving surface for scenery.
Finally, Homasote laid flat will sag if not supported at fairly close intervals (about 8"). Typically, 1/2" plywood (plywood is supported every 16"-24") laid flat is used to support Homasote roadbed. Foam does not need plywood support; 2" foam only needs support about every 16" or so. But foam by itself is quite noisy.
my thoughts and experiences, your choices
Fred W
csmith9474 wrote:I already have 1/2" plywood down as a base. I was going to lay Homasote sound board over that, but if I use a thicker foam, I could carve out smaller washes and creek beds and such if I wanted (I want at least a couple of smaller wooden trestles).
What I will do on my next layout (I'm still in a drawn out moving process) is use Homasote as a roadbed over a sandwich of 1/4" plywood and 1" foam. I intend to cookie cutter the plywood/foam/Homasote, and use thin foam shell instead of stacked foam for a scenery base. I have not tried this concept in practice yet. The point of using the foam instead of thicker plywood and plaster shell scenery is to minimize the weight of my shelf layout sections.
The reason for explaining my plan is to point out that you could use Homasote for roadbed on top of a suitable thickness of foam glued to your plywood. The only drawback to using Homasote as a roadbed on a flat top railroad is that the Homasote is 1/2" high. This puts the track quite high above adjoining scenery, making it necessary to provide additional support to raise track loading platforms, roads, and other scenic items to near track level. Using Homabed (a commercial Homasote roadbed) instead of cutting your own Homasote roadbed is a solution to this drawback, as the Homabed is only 1/4" thick.
In my personal opinion, foam is pushed as an answer to everything in building a model railroad. My preference is to use foam, or any other material for that matter, where its properties contribute to the desired outcome. If you are not going to carve scenic features into the foam for below track level scenery, then don't bother using foam.
A fairly easy alternative to getting below track level scenery is not to use a flat top table in the 1st place. Cut out plywood for your subroadbed where your track will be and support it on risers from your table frame. Install your roadbed of choice, and fill in the space in between with the scenery base of choice at the height you desire.
just my thoughts, it's your railroad and you make your choices
Metro Red Line wrote:I just tried the caulk thing last night...it's SO EASY! I'm using WS foam trackbed and I found out it's so elastic I don't need pins to hold it down (I did use pins to hold it down to test the trackplan)! The caulk grips it right away! I tried it on a test section of track on my "Try-O-Rama" and it was extremely easy. Just a little caulk spread thin does the trick. It's firm enough to hold the track to the roadbed securely yet soft enough to remove with a little force. I was impressed.
Great, isn't it? You will probably want to use pins as a temporary fastener on curves, and at joints. Especially if you buy the 24' rolls of the WS roadbed - it is curled up in the box and so has a tendency to want to curl back up again after it's on the bench. I pin the edges at joints, and on curves, just to make sure it stays down until the caulk dries. On long straight sections - just pinning the ends so they don't lift is plenty, the middle stays put due to the tackiness of the caulk.
THIN layer of caulk is the key. The stuff is cheap, but no need to waste it. If it squishes out, you've used WAY too much. If it squishes up between the ties of your track, you've used too much. If you draw guide lines on the base, you should still be able to see them throught he layer of caulk before applying the roadbed, that's how thin it shoud be. One tube did track AND roadbed AND Tortoise mounts for my entire 8x12 layout.
Some modelers swear by foam, others swear at it.
Foam has the advantage that it is light weight and relatively easy to shape, especially if you use a hot-wire cutter.
Foam, however, can be messy to shape if you cut it with a knife/rasp, and it conducts train noise more readily than wood and plaster. And finally, foam is more flammable than wood and plaster, and will fill the room with toxic fumes if the layout ever catches on fire (not very likely, but still a consideration).
I'm more of a traditionalist and prefer good old wood roadbed, and cardboard-strip and plaster scenery. I also like the ease with which I can install turnout motors and track feeders under the wood roadbed/plaster scenery, as compared to having to deal with layers of foam that I have to carve out.
Joe Fugate Modeling the 1980s SP Siskiyou Line in southern Oregon
Didn't this just come up on LDSIG or Layout Construction? I REALLY need to save that web site link where someone took pictures of attempts to make foam burn. They used the white beaded stuff (burns EASILY with a thick, black smoke) and pink (could not even MAKE it sustain combustion even when holding it in a candle flame). It also contains a link to the MSDS on the pink Owens-Corning extruded foam. No toxic fumes.
I guess we should stop using wood for the benchwork. And no wood structure kits - no plastic ones for that matter, styrene does give off nasty smoke when it burns. No wood track ties. Better make all benchwork and the top from steel, lay nickel-silver track on concrete ties, and make sure every locomotive and piece of rolling stock is 100% metal, no plastic or wood parts. Cast all structures from hydrocal or something.
Update: found the web site. Here : http://www.scaletree.com/foamsafety.html
rrinker wrote: Didn't this just come up on LDSIG or Layout Construction? I REALLY need to save that web site link where someone took pictures of attempts to make foam burn. They used the white beaded stuff (burns EASILY with a thick, black smoke) and pink (could not even MAKE it sustain combustion even when holding it in a candle flame). It also contains a link to the MSDS on the pink Owens-Corning extruded foam. No toxic fumes. I guess we should stop using wood for the benchwork. And no wood structure kits - no plastic ones for that matter, styrene does give off nasty smoke when it burns. No wood track ties. Better make all benchwork and the top from steel, lay nickel-silver track on concrete ties, and make sure every locomotive and piece of rolling stock is 100% metal, no plastic or wood parts. Cast all structures from hydrocal or something. Update: found the web site. Here : http://www.scaletree.com/foamsafety.html --Randy
Hmm. I don't get it. Why does pink/blue foam carry a "combustible" warning and has some health safety notices on it while white foam says "non-toxic"?
Yes, I understand a fire in the layout room is not very likely, and that wood burns readily too. However, if there ever is a good fire in the layout room, the foam will smoke, burn, melt -- or whatever you want to call it -- from the heat and give off toxic fumes. Meanwile a good ol' wood and plaster layout will only produce wood smoke.
If there is ever a good fire in the layout room (like from a space heater or something) and the walls start to burn, it could produce enough heat that the foam will begin smoking. And all else being equal, its well known that foam smoke is a real killer -- way worse than wood smoke.
Just something to consider ...
It doesn't carry a warning because it is not flamable. Go to the web site, or do a Google search on this material. What Joe is talking about is "melting" not bursting into flames. When certain plastics, foam, and other materials are exposed to flame or sufficient heat, they give off vapors which in some cases can be harmful to breathe, much more so than wood.