Troubleshooting problems with a new UR91/UT4R radio Digitrax setup - anyone have experience with possible interference problems?
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I recently added a UR91 radio receiver, with a UT4R throttle. I've been using a DT400 on my layout for quite some time, and wanted the extra flexibility. Plus, our model train club has radio setup -- and is large enough that when I took my DT400 down, tethered operations were a pain!
My layout is a L -- 16' on the long leg, and about 12' on the shorter leg. It's up in the third floor playroom/attic. We have a 2.4Ghz wireless router on the second floor. We also have a 5.4Ghz phone system, with phones on the first and second floor. Finally, we have an ADT security system, with wireless transmitters for the motion and glass break detectors.
I am having very poor quality reception using my UT4R. I've tried the basic troubleshooting in the book, in terms of location, antenna positioning, etc. My best option was to mount it upside down, about 7 ft up on a wall...even then, it wasn't perfect. When I say poor reception - when I turn the speed knob, the signal is not always received by the receiver / loconet...so, for example, if I bring the speed to 0...sometimes the train keeps going. Not good!
I've done the following so far, troubleshooting wise (updated...more troubleshooting done!):
So - I think I've eliminated as many of the "root causes" / potential break points in the: throttle, power supply, loconet, immediate layout interference. Next potential issues are harder to solve: radio interference...problems with UR91 itself...
Does anyone have experience troubleshooting - or other ideas?
I will try taking my UR91 to the train club, or back to the store, to see if we can troubleshoot it, to see if it is the problem. But, thought I'd ask here for help as well.
I'd like to AVOID having to buy another UR91...based on the layout at the club, I think my layout is plenty small to be covered by one receiver. Any advice???
Gate 5
Check the rabbit ears on the UR91. Are they spred apart and NOT touching anything?
Check the loconet cabels for phasing. They should be COM cable to DATA cable. (the pin 1 on each end are the same color) use your LT1 to test it.
In your LOCONET system you are pluged into the BACKS of UP5's and UP3's and the UR91 not the computer port in the side.
UR91 is mounted HIGH so as to make sure that the siganls is not bounced off ???
UR91 has the BLACK screws forward and if you have more than one DB150 and a DCS100 that you have a reference ground hooked between them.
This is all I can think of. Mine works fine with wireless everything around it.
I have the Digitrax Radio Chief (DCS-100 & DB150) in a large basement. My UR-91 is mounted high next to the celing in the center of the basement. I also have a G-Band wireless router about 3 feet from the UR-91. I have no problems with the radio signal, using DT-100, DT-300 or DT-400.
Make sure your UR-91 is mounted high and not in the facia. Did you check the power supply to the UR-91 to make sure it is operating properly?
JIM
Jim, Modeling the Kansas City Southern Lines in HO scale.
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
rrinker wrote: The Digitrax radio is in the 900MHz band, so the 5.8GHz phone and2.4GHx wireless routers will not interfere. I do not know what frequency range the ADT equipment uses, but I would lay odds it's 900Mhz. --Randy
Randy, is that not the same as cordless phones? I trashed a codless when it sent a spike to the layout. was not 100% sure BUT it was the only thing that was touched when the Challenger lost it's mind.
ALSO, the walky talky can be in that range correct?
In the old days we used to play with the CB to open garage doors.
Modeloldtimer
claycts wrote: Randy, is that not the same as cordless phones? I trashed a codless when it sent a spike to the layout. was not 100% sure BUT it was the only thing that was touched when the Challenger lost it's mind. ALSO, the walky talky can be in that range correct? In the old days we used to play with the CB to open garage doors.
George
You are probably right as to what happened in your case. All 3 bands are public unlicensed spectrum. The vast majority of earlier cordless phones used the 900 MHz band. Most of the newer ones have shifted to the 5.8 GHz band to avoid interference issues. Some have used the 2.4 GHz band, too (along with microwave ovens and wireless computer networks). Trade-off is range is typically not as good as you go to higher freqs, but antennas become more efficient for the same size.
Were you able to reset your Challenger?
Fred W
A remote possibility is that your receiver may be being swamped bu too strong a signal from the UT4R. Modern receivers have circuirs to prevent this but yours may not be working as designed.
Just a thought.
BB
73
Bruce in the Peg
I finally found the solution - after several hours of troubleshooting at home, the train club and the store. Believe it or not - it was the UT4R throttle. Even better - it was a batch of throttles that were bad (or at least two from the same batch / inspection lot). Only when we tried a third throttle at the store - with a different internal handwritten inspection sticker, did it work.
And this was after trying new everything in 1 by 1 comparisions: throttle, loconet cable, battery, receiver, receiver power cord, DB150 command station, 5 amp power supply, locomotive, location, track, etc.
I mean we were PULLING OUR HAIR OUT. We put an entire new setup in at the store - new receiver, throttole, command station, power supply, cables, batteries...and STILL had the same problem. It was the final attempt in vain -- grab another UT4R...and it worked. And the only different...the inspector.
So, who'd ever think - like in that Haine's commercial - that inspector #9 would play such an important role!
Thanks for everyone's help - works like a charm now!
I use the UR-91 with a DT-400R throttle and I also have the same problem with the train still moving looooonnng after turning to 0. Nope, not good at all. Like you I've tried to find the source of the problem but haven't yet. My layout is in a 15x21 foot room and there is a cordless phone that is rarely used in there also. There are no computer routers in it. The UR-91 is not mounted in the facia yet, haven't gotten that far along, it resides on a shelf in the middle of the layout, out in the open.
I'm beginning to suspect the throttle itself and I'm thinking of sending it in to Digitrax, although they'll probably NOT think it's the throttle but some other source. I don't know if they have a way to test them for this sort of thing. The reciever is plugged into my Digitrax DCH-50 and it's nice to operate trains using just that..... knowing the train is going to STOP!!..... where I want it too.
Isn't it odd how that's one of the things we really, really want to happen at the proper time...
Jarrell
rrinker wrote: You DO have a PS-12 or equivalent power supply connected to the UR-91, right? They won't work very well if at all trying to draw power only from the Loconet. --Randy
What Randy has posted PLUS the UR91MUST have it's EARS extended. Mine is as high as we can put it in the main line room and works perfect when in the Nanticoke area of the layout which is on the other side of a wall.
This picture is old but the BLUE box is a "J" box for 110v lights. The Grey wire is the loconet with the UR91 BEHIND the 2x4. YOu are looking from Nanticoke to the maiin line room
Again old picture showing the location from the Nanticoke area.
As you can see the correct installation is what is required..
grayfox1119 wrote:You may need a repeater, placed high above the layout, about 8 to 10 feet away. They work real well.
A repeater is only needed with NCE radio due to its lack of range.
I think we are not looking in the right direction to solve this problem.
At the club we have a Digitrax Super Chief and the sole UR91 is underneath the benchwork, well hidden and we have 10/10 reception. The room is 60'x30' three of the walls are cement the other plaster board on steel studs. We even have a staging yard behind another steel studs wall and reception from behind that wall remain foolproof. The UR91 is only plugged into the loconet.
Can it be a faulty UR91?
Jack W.
I have found that reception on devices varies with location. I had a Tundra with an alarm and remote entry device on my key fob. There were times when I would have to be within 10 feet of the vehicle to get it to unlock, whereas it often worked across large parking lots. Raising my hand above car-top levels increased the range, as you would expect.
So, there are unseen hindrances to ranges of frequencies everywhere. Try more locations?