35 X 15 layout---UPDATED---7-4-06---need suggestions and comments

[Anonymous]

Hello all,
Here is my layout that I am getting ready to start building..[:D]
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/jwey71/layout.jpg
I need suggestions and comments for improving it.
I am hopeful that it will be my last one, I am tired of tearing them up cause i get bored with them.[:(]
Thanks in advance

[SpaceMouse]

What are your givens and druthers?

[spidge]

Wow, what an awesome space.
I would turn the blob around, run it off the south wall and you could do a mushroom blob. The yard could remain along the west wall.
This will take a while.
If you get bored what is different about this layout that may help keep you interested.
I found that when I built in some hidden staging that it openned up alot more operational possibillities.FUN, You store long trains without dissrupting the layout when they are not run.
Have long passing sidings. Don't try to put too much track as then there is no room for scenery. A small town with a long passing track and a few sidings is visually interesting and runs better than a short passing track with too many sidings.
You like me have to allow your trains to run through the same scene twice. I attempted to have them on different levels to devide scenicly. Will post results when I get some scenery. Get away from too much straight track as curvrs are interesting.
Hope this helps.

[jeffrey-wimberly]

Yeah! I saw this layout listed on another forum. There's enough there to keep you busy a long time.

[Texas Zepher]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jwey71
I am hopeful that it will be my last one, I am tired of tearing them up cause i get bored with them.

It might be more helpful to see pictures of the prior ones to know what you are getting bored with. Why are you getting bored with them? I have 4x8's that I've never tired of. The most complex layout in the world will be boring if the trains are just run around randomly.

What era?
What prototype?
What part of the country does this represent?
Are there passengers, what priority do they get?
What are the train classifications?
How many operators (and/or computer controlled) and how often is it going to be run?
How many trains are to be run simultaniously?
Do you have a schedule?
How fast do you run the clock?

The layout is subservient to all of these things. This layout would get boring quite quickly if one just sent a train to loop around on the main.

[conrail92]

looks like a nice layout i wish i had that much space, What industries do you plan on having and you should plan on what products the industries will consume and export, if you give it realistic operations there will be endless amounts of possibilities you could have. and im not sure or not but do you have a staging track anywhere, i cant tell.

[Anonymous]

OK....
In this HO layout I am planning some coal mines and a small logging area.
I need a continuous loop mostly for my son so he can have some passenger runs. I am more into the switching aspect.
The era is steam/diesel transition.
I have most of the benchwork done. The black box is the HVAC, that why I went around the HVAC as opposed to a mushroom type.
The last couple of layouts have been from the old 101 track layouts book and they didnt have much in the way of switching.
Staging.....the jury is still out on that one. I think with the space that I have I really dont need a staging area. i am going to add a couple long passins sidings. The ones that are already there will probably be adding some more length to them.
Thanks

[tomikawaTT]

From a quick perusal of your plan:

PRO:
Long mainline run (wireless throttle, I presume.)
Good access to anything that might need maintenance (posibly excepting the turntable, if it cannot be removed as a unit to the workbench.)
Nice wide aisles, and NO DUCKUNDERS! Excellent!
Nomerous places where additional industrial spurs can be added.

CON:
Mainline sidings noticeably shorter than yard tracks. Too easy to build a train that won't fit, unless you like double-sawby meets.
Freight yard lacks proper switching lead. Adding that, and proper arrival-departure tracks, eliminates the need for escape crossovers at the far end of what should be classification tracks.
No foreign-road interchange or staging. Your layout is a self-contained unit, detached from the rest of the world. Connecting it to "elsewhere" can add tremendously to the interest level.

All considered, you have a good foundation on which to work in improvements. Lacking specifics about your prototype interests (railroad, geographical location, era) and modeling "druthers," that's about as far as I wi***o go.

Chuck (who envies you your space!)

[ericboone]

I would definetly find a way to add staging. Being able to run your railroad like the real thing with trains coming and going somewhere would really help cut down on the "boredom" you complain about. You may want to pick up a book on designing for operation. The Layout Design Primer (http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/%7Esmithbf/BFSpages/LDSIGprimer/TOC.html) may be useful to you, especially the section on Designing Layouts to Operate (http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/%7Esmithbf/BFSpages/LDSIGprimer/Operations.html).

[Texas Zepher]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jwey71
a small logging area.

Where do the logs go to? Is that the green square thing down by the square lake?

And why the major sma***o the edge of the benchwork for both the sidings such that the look like they are over the top of each other.

QUOTE: The era is steam/diesel transition.

A bit late for true logging.

QUOTE: I am going to add a couple long passing sidings. The ones that are already there will probably be adding some more length to them.

I don't know if you need more or just better spacing between them. If one leaves the main yard siding going counter clockwise the first passing siding is way down in the center bottom. That is one very long distance compared to the spacing between the others.

Why the extra loop at the almost top left that allows the trains to bypass (short circiut) the yard and balloon track? Taking this track one must go from the center bottom to center bottom between passing sidings.

Assuming that is a passenger terminal in the center top, with the bridge going over it ... How does one get the locomotive there?

Why are there escape tracks on both the outside yard tracks? It seems that all four tracks are now consumed getting locomotives to and from the end of the track. 2 arrival/departure tracks, 2 escape tracks, and zero classification or storage tracks. I would think on a layout this size one A/D track would work and escape back to the main. That would leave three classification tracks.

Looks like a massive locomotive storage facility. Is there any room for the structures? A coaling tower can be a massive structure. How about service tracks for hoppers to bring in the coal, sand, and haul away the ashes. How about a place for machinery and supplies to arrive in box and flat cars, and junk hauled away in gondolas.

Also the tracks (in the loco facility) look very straight. Here is a shot of the tracks in the former CB&Q (now BNSF-gag) 23rd street loco shops in Denver. None of them are straight through. The track to the extreme left is for a tank car of diesel. The track with a gantry for heavy equipment off flat cars is on the other side of the building.

as usual click to enlarge

[Anonymous]

Yes the green box will be the saw mill.
The tracks pushed together was because I wanted to build the "mother of mills", but it took up to much room, so the smaller mill in in its place.
The red square above the t-table is the coal bunker, which does have lines for the coal/ash dumping/loading.
I might do some changes to the yard area, to make it easier loading/unloading them.

[Anonymous]

pLEASE REVIEW OUR THREE-LEVEL PLAN AT [SFRM.ORG].
This multi-level plan depicts the FEC railway during it's heyday.

[nucat78]

You're in a good position with that much room.

I agree that staging and interchange should be added. You can park your trains on the mains, but that implies you'll have to do a lot of jockeying to clear the mains at the start of a session. Can you fit them all into the yard at one time if you don't add staging?

I'd add at least one partly hidden interchange track as mentioned above to provide a place to / from for your trains. Plus it would give you another reason to run some "alien" roadpower onto your layout.

How long is your reach? Can you get to the spurs in the lower left hand corner easily?

And finally, it looks like there are two reverse loops in the yard and above. I'd consider using just one to simplify wiring and keeping track of polarity. Not that two or even more reverse loops are that big a deal, but I've adopted a "simple is better" approach, just to minimize my troubleshooting and maintenance time.

[CascadeBob]

To jwey71: What software did you use to do your track plan design? I have a basement room 21' x 28' in which I'm going to build an N-scale layout along the lines of Dave Barrows' Cat Mountain and Santa Fe, i.e., a around-the-wall continuous loop. I'd like to do some of the preliminary designs on a user-friendly software that will allow me to make changes to the preliminary design easily.

[Anonymous]

I have taken all comments from everyone "Thanks to all" and have revised the plan a little.
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/jwey71/layout2.jpg
Any other comments or suggestions?
Thanks again,
Jeff

[CascadeBob]

What software did you use to do your tack plan?

Bob

[Anonymous]

XtrkCad is the program used.
Easily found with a internet search.

[jxtrrx]

Bob, XtrkCad is http://www.sillub.com/ It is free (open source), but be sure to get the registration information from the website to activate the program. It's a good one!

[CascadeBob]

Thanks for the info on the track plan software.

Bob

[Anonymous]

The updated plan looks pretty good. The only problem is your yard lead (?) crosses another track AT GRADE.
Also, ANY layout this large should have staging. If you don't know where to put it, build a lower level for a staging yard. I'd think your yard wouldn't have to be too long, as your passing sidings are somewhat short and the reverse loop is short, so you must not be running very long trains.

[Anonymous]

Yes the yard lead was a small error, I am going to wrap it around the main line.
I am planning on running long trains say 20+, the passing sidings will be longer then the plan shows, plenty of room to make them longer....
Staging....Not planning on it for now.
Thanks for your comments

[SpaceMouse]

I have to say I don't understand your layout. The only thing I can figure is that you mostly want to run trains without having to worry about operations. The reason I say that is you have a large yard, but your yard lead is not long enough to switch it. That makes me think that you really only plan to store full trains there.

The passing sidings are way shorter than a 20 car train can pass, which makes me think that you only plan on running one train at a time.

None of the industries have run arounds so they can only be switched by trains running in one direction.

Maybe you could explain a little about how you see your trains running.

[Anonymous]

This 4 day weekend I was able to get the main line down and even made a test run!!!!
I still need to solder joiners and feeders, run a LOT of wire, and paint, and put turf down, and build bridges, and....and....and....and...
but I feel I made some small progress... ...

Here are some pics
The Logging area
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/jwey71/Picture001-1.jpg
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/jwey71/Picture002.jpg
There is a 4% grade to the middle section and will be using helper districts.
The top section is 5-6% grade and will be using Shays for the logging.
The triple bridge area
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/jwey71/Picture005-1.jpg

And the Yard..
Still needs roadbed and all of it but the main.
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/jwey71/Picture007-1.jpg

[cudaken]

Looks good, big PIC at the begaaing is missing. Gave me a few ideas as well, thanks.

Cuda Ken