Atlas/Tortoise Under the Table Switch Machine dilema....

[KKEIFE]

I have been gradually accumulating MRR stuff over the last several years in preparation for the day I could start building my first layout - which is now!

Last year I got 5 Atlas under the table switch machines on sale. At the time I thought I was going to use mainly atlas track and accesories.

After reading on these forums it seems like the majority of the modelers prefer tortoise switch machines for several reasons including greater reliability and the fact that you don't have to be nearly as exacting in their placement.

Should I just bite the bullet and get the tortoise machines (I will need 12) or should I save some money and trust that the Atlas machines will work OK and 7 more? (Am I being too critical of the ATlas machines?)

I am going to mount them under 3/8 pywood and 1.5 inches of foam. I have figured out a way to do this with the Atlas machines but I don't have a tortoise to play with.

For those of you who have had experience with both switch machines I would greatly appreciate your input.

Thanks.

Ken

[Adelie]

I've used both before and have the same dilemma. I have an 8-track staging yard that is largely hidden, so whether they are slow throw or snap from side to side doesn't matter. I'm using N-scale code 55 and Atlas has an under table switch machine specifically for them (has a relay to power the frog) and they aren't too bad. Except, as you say, getting them aligned so they completely throw the turnout is a painful process. And there does not appear to be any consistency with where the perfect place is.

I have 3 Atlases, only one of which is mounted. I need 12 more to complete the staging area. I suspect I'll use Atlas down there, since they are $8.75 or so online while Tortoises are higher. In the visible areas, I'll use Tortoises and maybe some home-built manual throw rods where practical. Tortoises take a little tweaking, too, from what I remember.

Anybody know if those old Kemtron machines are still around? Those things would throw prototype rail and snap off fingers if you weren't careful!

[rrinker]

Tough call since you already have some. Mixing two types just makes wiring more complicated. I prefer Tortoises even though they cost more (just means I build slower), just because of the slow motion and the built-in contacts for powering the frogs and/or running signals The slow motion is pretty gentle on the turnouts, as well.
Mounting Tortoises when you have a foam base can be really easy. Since you have plywood under the foam you can just screw the Tortoise on the bottom, I don;t use plywood so I mount them fromt he top - quick and easy. See my web site, or look up the North Bay Freemo club's site, which is where I got the idea from in the first place. Doing the top mounting is great because there's no complicated aligning, I don't need to replace the throwbar with a heavier one because the distance is short, and I don't have the Tortoise hanging down below the benchwork. I've already removed a pair due to a change in track plan - since I fasten the track and roadbed with latex caulk it was ea***o slide back the rail joiners and lift the turnout and Tortoise out, and substitute a section of straight track. I keep all the blocks that get cut out of the foam so I just glued one back in each hole to plug it up.

--Randy

[cwclark]

go with the tortoise because of their reliability...for one..they have a 2 SP/DT or 1 DP/DT accessory posts on them..if you use a plain atlas UTTSM then you'll have to include an atlas relay with them to operate the accessories..(ie powering frogs, target searchlights, panel lighting, ect.)..another good feature is that they have very low amp torque stall motors..you can run about 50 of them from one 12 volt source..the torque stall motors never turn off so you need not fear the motor burning up like you would the coils in an atlas...the other good thing is that you can use DP/DT switches to work the tortoise instead of the bulky atlas momentary slide switch..the slide switch, if it sticks and you don't catch it and continues to feed power to the twin coil of the atlas will eventually burn the coil out....another drawback of the atlas is if you install a number of them you'll need to build a capacitor discharge unit ..it's a simple circuit but no less, another part and expense...the other good thing about the tortoise is the mounting..you can mount them from the top of the table ..the atlas have to be mounted to the bottom and trying to get those little bitty screws in the hole perfectly lined up is a chore in itself when your body gets into those yoga positions under the benchwork trying to mount them...if you need 12 tortoises order them on-line in a twelve pack...they're cheaper purchasing them in the twelve pack than one at a time...Chuck

[KKEIFE]

Randy: I could not quite tell from the pictures on your site, but do you carve a hole in the foam and slip the switch through the hole and then have the edges of the switch rest on the foam? Do you glue it down?

I could not find where on the Freemo site they had pictures of how they installed it.

[hdbob]

i have some undermount atlas 18 #65+# 56switch control help us both out e-mail me and let me know if interested
email is [e-mail]

[rrinker]

QUOTE: Originally posted by KKEIFE

Randy: I could not quite tell from the pictures on your site, but do you carve a hole in the foam and slip the switch through the hole and then have the edges of the switch rest on the foam? Do you glue it down?

I could not find where on the Freemo site they had pictures of how they installed it.

I actually bought a hole cutting attachment for the Dremel - sorta makes it into a mini Roto-Zip tool. The first ones I did, I just used the bit that came with it, but I have since picked up a large router bit and it makes the work go faster. The nice thing about the attachment is you can set depth - so I set it to just the thickness of the perf board. I then go over the entire area where the machine will sit - I set the turnout in place and pu***he Tortoise wire through the throwbar hole and into the foam, and draw around the edge of the circuit board to mark the location. I hold the shop-vac hose in my other hand while doing this to suck up the dust. After I do that, I take a steak knife and cut the center of the space out in a little cube, all the way through t he foam, leaving a small ledge around the outside. Usually takes a little extra carving after that to get the hole just right to clear the Tortoise and the sliding pivot. Once I'm sure everything is is the right place, I put a little latex caulk on the 'shelf' where the circuit board sits and pu***he Tortoise in place.
The Freemo site is: http://www.pbase.com/tracktime/norcalf They used copper PC board, I use perf board because I think it's easier to mount the Tortoise - just slightly enlarge 4 holes to take a 2-56 self-tapping screw and you're off. I make up a bunch ahead of time. The largest sheet of perf board from Radio Shack I can snap apart to get 6 mounting plates plus a little extra left over - the small extras I will use to mount dropping resistors and terminal blocks for my control panels.

--Randy