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Your preferred source or method for realistic brick building corners and other details

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Your preferred source or method for realistic brick building corners and other details
Posted by crossthedog on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 1:01 PM

Not that I'm ready to try this, but I see how expensive the really interesting brick factory building kits are, and I keep thinking that I could probably design something that would suit and build it out of HO scale brick sheeting, but what about corners, cornices, and door and window arches. I don't want the corners of my buildings to look like they're being held together by glue (even though they will be).

This is not about weathering (yet), but more about the structure looking solid and "built".

Which brick building products have you tried that worked well for you, and where did you get them? Or if you're a scratcher, how do you handcraft those details that make a brick building look more real?

Ideas and even strong opinions welcomed gratefully.

Thanks,

-Matt

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by gmpullman on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 1:28 PM

crossthedog
Which brick building products have you tried that worked well for you, and where did you get them?

For me, one of the best, go-to "kitbashing" stock was the modular Design Preservation Models (often simply DPM Models) parts.

The corners were accomplished with moulded pilasters that looked quite good when properly filed and cleaned up. The brick modular sections had several varieties of window, door, loading dock openings of various heights.

Where did I get them? I seem to recall picking up my first few packages back in the late 1980s. Since then whenever I came across them at train shows, sometimes a whole shoebox-full for ten bucks, I snagged them for future use.

Perhaps you can still find some but if you scout the usual on-line sites you'll probably wind up paying as much, if not more, than the brick factory kits you're trying to build for less money. Sign of the times, sadly.

This brewery was built mostly of DPM modulars:

 IMG_4629 by Edmund, on Flickr

and this expansive background building:

 IMG_1346_fix_sm by Edmund, on Flickr

Good Luck, Ed

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Posted by richhotrain on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 1:59 PM

Walthers Modulars are scaled a bit smaller than the imposing DPM Modulars, and they too have been discontinued for quite a while. They were great for building structures like warehouses, but to complete a structure you needed to purchase several kits of different parts, walls, cornices, pilasters, etc. You can still find them on eBay often at reasonable prices. I used them to build 13 large freight houses for my Dearborn Station site.

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by NVSRR on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 7:11 PM

The walthers pilaster sets are the most difficult to locate.      when did DPM modulars stop?  I still see the pieces everywhere along with the modular kits.   

 

I use often the method created where concrete was used for pilsters and corners. 

This is walthers modulars but the concrete pilaster is the sam.  a strip of 250, up t0 500 wide by about 125 thick styrene strip.  

The chuckwood building here uses the dpm and concrete pilaster idea.     If you hadnty guessed, my pilaster supply is almost non existant. 

 

You can also make a corner using styrene strips cut at two different lengths to create quions.  Of course, cannt leave the 3d print option out now.  

Somebody on ebay did a modual pieces for stone walls too.  havent tried them though. 

 

Shane

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 9:20 PM

Shane: What is the big opening in the building for? I saved this image to my idea file. I think it will make a great tunnel entrance in Centerville.

-Kevin

Living the dream and happily modeling my STRATTON AND GILLETTE Railroad in HO scale. The SGRR is a freelanced Class A railroad as it would have appeared on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954, in my personal fantasy world of plausible nonsense.

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Posted by crossthedog on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 10:39 PM

Thanks guys. Your buildings look great, and Ed I appreciate the close-up photo of that building so I could see how the corners look. I often see DPM kits or bags of DPM components at swap meets, in fact there were some at the show I went to a few weeks ago in Kelso. I wish I'd known to grab them. But I think my chances are good of finding some of those. I'm patient.

Shane, I do know someone who is nuts about 3D printing and has flat-out offered to print anything I'd like to have, just send him photos and he'd design it in the software -- I think it would be easy for him to print some brick detail strips if I showed him whatever sheets I was working with.

SeeYou190
Shane: What is the big opening in the building for? I saved this image to my idea file. I think it will make a great tunnel entrance in Centerville.

I had the same question. I assume it's a tunnel entrance -- I've seen similar at a local club -- or a door for moving boxcars in out of the rain for loading something that doesn't like to get wet.

-Matt

 

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 10:43 PM

Most of these are DPM kits, simply placed (and not yet finished) on a relatively empty part of the partial upper level of my layout.  There are a couple from other manufacturers that will likely be recognised as not DPM...

The white structure with the green trim, shown below, was my first DPM kit, but it was several years later before I got around to building it...

...I added the stairs and the back porch, and will, eventually, fence-in the backyard and finish the scenery details....

This one was my first DPM "bags of walls, doors, and windows"...

I still have quite a few packages of similar wall sections, and a fairly large area for a decent-size furniture factory, modelled from a real one.

Wayne

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Posted by crossthedog on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 10:43 PM

richhotrain
to complete a structure you needed to purchase several kits of different parts, walls, cornices, pilasters, etc.

Rich, this seems to be true of DPM as well... their page of parts for sale is shown on the HO Seeker website and each little detail has its own product number. Thanks for these photos... I will keep my eye out for Walthers components as well.

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by crossthedog on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 10:49 PM

Wayne, I was hoping you'd show up. I knew you had some brick factories on your pike. It's a bit frustrating because I keep clicking on your photos to see a larger version but they open up at the same size. I'd really like to see the details in that last photo. Those big buildings have some very interesting curves and angles... did you do all that with DPM modules?

-Matt

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Tuesday, September 27, 2022 10:52 PM

crossthedog

 richhotrain

to complete a structure you needed to purchase several kits of different parts, walls, cornices, pilasters, etc.

Rich, this seems to be true of DPM as well... their page of parts for sale is shown on the HO Seeker website and each little detail has its own product number. Thanks for these photos... I will keep my eye out for Walthers components as well.

Matt: Keep an eye out for the "Designer Bulk Packs" of modular walls from DPM.

-Photograph by Kevin Parson

These include enough to build a good size building, and fam,iliarize yourself with the line of parts.

-Kevin

Living the dream and happily modeling my STRATTON AND GILLETTE Railroad in HO scale. The SGRR is a freelanced Class A railroad as it would have appeared on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954, in my personal fantasy world of plausible nonsense.

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Posted by NVSRR on Wednesday, September 28, 2022 9:22 AM

itla. Has a brick modular system as well

shane

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by NVSRR on Wednesday, September 28, 2022 9:38 AM

Kevin, Matt.    The the two pics are tied toge5er actually by that porthole in the chuckwood building.     It was originally figured to sit where the now E.F. Screw loose machine co now sits in the first pic straddling the tracks.  That were supposed to be originally an urban branch.  But morphed into a urban main.  It was a single track and a siding there.  The chuckwood sat over the tracks with the siding being for a loading dock covered when the building owners expanded over the tracks.   For more space in the urban realm.  It is a two track rail porthole.  One for loading dock.     The chuckwood now sits elsewhere and the tunnel is now a road with signs of the "used to be" tracks buried in the asphalt.

 

of note, this whole section is being saved and designed into the new layout.   

 

shane

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by NVSRR on Wednesday, September 28, 2022 9:44 AM

Along the lines of the thread, I am trying to figure out how to hide those joints in the pilasters that show up on camera.   I was thinking copper round accent. Not sure.   I blended the paint for the concrete so a match would be almost not doable.  Even though I have the formula.   
shane

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by crossthedog on Thursday, September 29, 2022 4:46 PM

NVSRR
itla. Has a brick modular system as well

I looked this up. Thanks for the tip, Shane. Those sure are nice components. I'm not as fond of the concrete pilaster style as I am of decrepit brick. I might use that system if I were making a giant facility of some kind, but my industries will perforce be shortish and narrow, and I think all brick looks better on the smaller structures.

@Kevin, I see some Walthers packs in your stash there. Those seem rare online, moreso even than the DPM. I may resort to brick sheets and homemade pilasters, cantons and cornices, and bulk-bought windows and doors. Also, I hope you and yours are okay... been hearing about a lot of hurt and damage down your way over the past day. God speed you.

@Wayne, I guess you didn't see my question, but having done some research I can see that your big brick edifices indeed look like DPM modulars. Nice work, as always.

-Matt

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by gmpullman on Thursday, September 29, 2022 5:35 PM

Here's an example of what you can expect in one of the Designer packs:

 dpm_Modular by Edmund, on Flickr

MB Klein still has some kits in stock, FYI:

https://www.modeltrainstuff.com/brands/Design-Preservation-Models/

Good Luck, Ed

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Posted by NVSRR on Thursday, September 29, 2022 6:56 PM

 This is an ITLA building using the brick pilasters and mudular pieces made into a low relief (1.5') building. 

 

Shane

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An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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Posted by doctorwayne on Thursday, September 29, 2022 7:16 PM

crossthedog
Wayne, I was hoping you'd show up. I knew you had some brick factories on your pike. It's a bit frustrating because I keep clicking on your photos to see a larger version but they open up at the same size. I'd really like to see the details in that last photo. Those big buildings have some very interesting curves and angles... did you do all that with DPM modules? -Matt

Thanks for your comments, Matt.

The pictures will enlarge if you "left-click" on the image - it's usually fairly quick to react, but occasionally, it might be a few seconds late.

The National Grocers buildings are mostly DPM, but the roofs and back (unseen) walls are .060" thick sheet styrene.  I often use the same stuff as bracing, too.  (I had removed a couple hundred pictures from photobucket a few months ago -  if I can find them, I'll re-post some of them in this thread).

Cheers,

Wayne

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Posted by doctorwayne on Thursday, September 29, 2022 8:53 PM

Well, the removed photos couldn't be found, so I took some new ones.

Here's the site of National Grocers, the structures, other than the walkways on the lower tracks, seem to be currently "out of town"...

Here's the normally-unseen-backside of the lower part of National Grocers...

...and the end that's not usually ever seen...

The shapes cemented to the upper portion of the wall are the supports which hold the walkways over the track to the portion of the structure that's right against the backdrop.

...and here's the structure, standing-on-end, that's normally against the backdrop...

Wayne

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Posted by crossthedog on Thursday, September 29, 2022 9:25 PM

doctorwayne
The pictures will enlarge if you "left-click" on the image - it's usually fairly quick to react, but occasionally, it might be a few seconds late.

Wayne, we disagree. Your photos DO open up in Imagr or Photobucket or whatever, but they are never larger than what appears in the post; never have been as long as I've been clicking on your photos (and I've clicked on a LOT of them). I often want to see your images in greater detail, but no matter; I get the gist of construction from your most recent photos. Thanks, very useful indeed. 

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by crossthedog on Thursday, September 29, 2022 9:29 PM

NVSRR
This is an ITLA building using the brick pilasters and mudular pieces made into a low relief (1.5') building.

Shane, that's more my speed. Thank you. I'll look again at ITLA's offerings.

gmpullman
MB Klein still has some kits in stock, FYI: https://www.modeltrainstuff.com/brands/Design-Preservation-Models/

Thanks Ed, I'll have a look.

-Matt

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Thursday, September 29, 2022 9:38 PM

I just now went back to my last post, and by left-clicking on the original image,  pretty-well filled my computer's screen.

I don't know if the enlarged image will show up here, though...

...and apparently won't remain enlarged.

Wayne

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Posted by crossthedog on Thursday, September 29, 2022 9:49 PM

Well thanks for checking, Wayne. Maybe it's just something at my end.

I use my old Wordpress blog to host most of the photos I post here, since I am no longer blogging and I have lots of space still. For some reason, Wordpress changed things so that now, when you click on one of my photos, it opens first at a smaller size. You have to close that, then click open the original photo a second time, and it finally opens at maximum resolution in Wordpress -- I don't know why, it's maddening. So I tried yours that way just in case... opening first, closing, then opening again, but it didn't solve it. An enduring forum mystery.

I will have to enjoy your inspiring modeling best I can "from a distance".

-Matt 

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by Track fiddler on Friday, September 30, 2022 7:54 AM

Good morning DogWink

Very impressive modeling here gentlemanStick out tongue...Yes

 

I model N scale but wanted to do an experiment in HO.  I know these are not building corners but they do have corners and could be done in continuous brick wrapping the 90° angle for a building.

I realized you HO guys have the better world when it comes to modeling brick out of foam not too far into the experiment.  N scale becomes too small and tedious when it comes to brick.  One has to do them a bit bigger than scale or just decide on bigger bricks so it's more doable and the eyes can see the detail.  I've done some foam brick modeling in N scale as well.

 

Here's a quick sample sheet done with a pencil, some paint and then some drywall mud filling the joints.  Tinted or not, the mortar joints look good either way.  I learned that one from Wayne years ago.

 

Twin double tunnel portals was the experiment.

Fast and final, Patch-n-Paint or One Time (same thing) is foams best friend.  It can be used to hide joints or to shmooze out imperfections.  It scribes the same as foam and you can't tell it's there after it's painted.

 

I have found Lucite Poly-Seam-Seal is the best adhesive for gluing foam to foam among other things.

 

Here they are after paint and drywall compound.  Decided on a limestone look for these.  Different colors would definitely change the effects.

 

I plan on using foam for a brick roundhouse in the distant future.  The other good thing is that it's cheap and fun to work with.

 

Happy modeling MattSmile, Wink & Grin

 

 

 

TF

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Posted by Overmod on Friday, September 30, 2022 10:24 AM

doctorwayne
I don't know if the enlarged image will show up here, though...

omething very strange happens when using Opera on a Mac running 10.11.6.

Left-clicking opens the image 'larger' on screen, but using command-+ to enlarge the image only "enlarges" the black background -- the image itself actually gets smaller!  You may have to 'pan' extensively over and down to see the image at all for enlargements well over 200%.

Someone with a touchscreen device of appropriate size might see if they can pinch-resize to zoom and zero in on particular areas of detail.

I have built a couple of architectural models with brick.  If you are using ordinary running bond, as with typical fascia "brick" in home construction, you can very carefully measure and cut the sides so they line up 'one row off' so that the half-bricks serve as the 'ends' of the adjacent row.  If you have a fancier bond, you might use 'panels' of running bond between courses of the fancy courses, with thin styrene or card as a backing sheet.  Use solvent-welding to join the corner 'brick' and then rescribe so the drywall mud or whatever only goes in the grout lines, not a crack or discontinuity at the corner.

I did try the idea of cutting out the edges and using a bending jig and heat to turn the ends over, so they "interlocked" and then could be jigged to be glued.  If you have something other than a right or included right angle between panels, this may be a better approach, but it's tedious as hell and then even more tedious to get all the grout lines scribed in 3D.  What I did was to use a piece of straight stiff wire and filler made of styrene sprue and solvent adhesive to reinforce the corners at the fabricated joints.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Friday, September 30, 2022 12:01 PM

Last night, I spent well over two hours trying to compose a post with photos of various structures, both wide views and close-ups, but the images (from photobucket) were being deleted from the post faster than I was able to provide replacements.
Photobucket was working properly, but this site was not...I'm assuming that it was part of the glitch that took the MR site off-line earlier. 

I'll make another attempt later.

Wayne

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Posted by crossthedog on Friday, September 30, 2022 12:31 PM

doctorwayne
I spent well over two hours trying to compose a post with photos of various structures,

Wayne, what if you just posted one photo at a time, with notes about it, and do a series of posts? As long as they're relevant, I don't see the harm and you could take your time that way. I can follow the thread of a serial publication :)

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by crossthedog on Friday, September 30, 2022 12:36 PM

Track fiddler
I plan on using foam for a brick roundhouse in the distant future. The other good thing is that it's cheap and fun to work with.

Fiddler, those portals look great! Wow. Nice work.

Overmod
If you are using ordinary running bond, as with typical fascia "brick" in home construction, you can very carefully measure and cut the sides so they line up 'one row off' so that the half-bricks serve as the 'ends' of the adjacent row.

Overmod, I need to look up running bond so that I can get a picture in my head of what you're describing :) It shouldn't surprise me that setting out to build a model of a brick building might require me to know some terms about brick building construction. After all, it's just a smaller version.

-Matt

 

Returning to model railroading after 40 years and taking unconscionable liberties with the SP&S, Northern Pacific and Great Northern roads in the '40s and '50s.

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Posted by Track fiddler on Friday, September 30, 2022 7:53 PM

Thanks

 

TF

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Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, October 1, 2022 9:51 PM

Here are a few close-up views...

This is the office building of Bertrams  Machine & Tool Manufacturers...

...the kit was a fairly simple one, representing a soft drink company, maybe Coke or Pepsi.  I added a few details, but it's otherwise a very simple kit.

Here's the Bertrams plant, with the rest of office building visible to the right...

This is Walthers Argosy Bookstore, re-purposed as a hotel and restaurant...

...but it's not at all in it's intended  locale.

Here's a close-up of the brick-work...

Another close-up of Walther's brick, this one built from parts of two identical Walthers kits...

Here's a view showing a little more...

At least this batch worked out better than the one last night.

Wayne

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