Ok, so I've laid my track and am satisfied with its operation, and now I'm ready for scenery. I have several industrial areas where I want to add roads, bury some track for my intermodal yard, pour a parking lot or two, and, of course, add some crossings.
Most of the MR videos show folks using WS Smooth It and the WS road kit. I found a few videos online that used drywall mud to make their roads. I had considered using some double-sided foam tape as forms for my roads and then I thought about using some strips of styrene to create forms for the parking lot -- filling a section at a time (still need to research the size of concrete sections used for parking lots). I hade some left over drywall mud from some home improvement projects -- it's the lightweight, low dust variety.
Has anyone used drywall mud for roads/poarking lots, crossings, etc? What, if any, are the advantages to using the WS products. I've never tried tinting drywall mud -- does it tint well? Painting enough patches in my house, I know it will take paint...
Another question -- could it be used to make rock castings?
Thanks for your thoughts!
Jeff
Jeff,
In MY 65yrs. of playing with trains and layouts, I have used many different ways, some good some bad.....but I won't get into that...there will be pro's and con's of many ways.....You decide what works best in Your environment, which will also play a role, in what You decide on. Here is a Youtube link to all kinds of ways for You to look at:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqO5AuPwoHk
Take Care!
Frank
With limited experience at grade crossings, but looking at a lot of posts, I recommend using styrene for your street running and for such things as intermodal areas. I have used wood planks for grade crossings sucessfully. For roads I have used foam board and plaster and have seen many other successful products to come up to the outside of the rails.. However, when putting the plaster between the rails and I presume the other similar materials, I found it a real pain to get the flangeways right, even when I used a styrene strip to keep the flangeway clear. With the styrene, cut it to shape, if it needs fine tuning just take it out sand it a little then replace until it's right. A little tacky glue or similar will hold it in place while you are testing.
Good luck,
Richard
I'm also a proponent of styrene. I've tried plaster (smoothed way out), drywall compound, spackle, those foam sheets from the craft store, extremely fine grit sandpaper painted, and styrene in various tests over the years and found that styrene was the easiest to work with. Plus, when you get down to it, all but the most obliterated asphalt roads are pretty smooth looking from a few dozen real-world feet. Weathering and abuse can make styrene look paved. Concrete is a bit speckly and that can be done with paint.
The way I came up with (never saw it before), was to add white glue to mixed plaster, no cracking and sandable and you can score it afterwards without chiping.
I used dry wall mud on all of my roads and paved areas. I used the 15 minute set mud. I also used it for any of my concrete structures, such as the highway bridge and retaing wall.
Mike.
My You Tube
Great pictures! That highway bridge is incredible!
Thanks for the feedback. When I submitted my original post, I had also experimented with the drywall mud on some scrap track. Overall, it looked pretty good, but when I pulled the tape from the sides, several chunks broke off the sides. Reading your replies made me second guess using the drywall compound.
Since then I've been experimenting with some scrap materials laying around. I've decided to go the stryene route, but I still needed to find a way to elevate to the top of the rails. I have A LOT of scrap 1/8 in. masonite laying around, and found that layering 2 sheets of masonite matches the top of the ties fairly well. This allows me to lay .04 in styrene to match the top of the rails.
At first, I planned to completely bury the tracks in my intermodal yard, but pictures of the CSX Queensgate yard in Cincinnati reveal that the track between the rails are ballasted, and concrete was poured outside the rails. This will be easy enough to do with styrene.
I'm hoping to "pour some concrete" later this week. I'll post pics of my results.
Plaster of Paris didn't work for my paved buried track. I even ran a set of trucks through the POP but that was a total failure. What thickness of syryene to use for making the track look like it's hidden in concrete (as seen in many industrial areas)?
When test fit my masonite/styrene combo, I found that .040 in will work with code 83. So, I'm using 1/4" worth masonite (2 1/8 in pieces laminated together with wood glue) to match the height of the ties on the roadbed. At this height, .040 styrene sheeting seems create the illusion.
I've seen a lot examples of people using the styrene between the rails, but for my layout, the various prototype pictures I've seem of intermodal yards simply ballast between the rails. I'm still debating whether to use styrene between the rails for my crossings, or to buy one the crossing kits from WS...
Jmnienab,
I used to be a Intermodal crane operator at the CSX yard in Bedford Pk, Il. Their yard was 10 tracks running west to east double ended a mile and a half long. All the tracks in the center were ballasted, then asphalt, the width of trailer/container, followed by a concrete crane path which was around five feet wide, the rest being asphalt, There were three crossings, one at each end and the center of which was made up off concrete over tracks and the rest asphalt leading into the tracks. The crossings looked similar to My first pic'. but straight. I did that with 1/8'' inch bulletin board cork, that comes in rolls, held down with contact cement. The crossings are styrene, made from Walther's cornerstone street track inserts, that come in a kit for street track running, they are already formed to fit inside and outside the rails. The kit includes many sizes, from straight to curved. There is a lip at the tie area where the cork would fit perfectly flush with just a little sanding. The other pic's are of the same area, that I ripped out the original crossings from the first pic' and replaced with Walther's brick street system, which btw required a lot of cutting and sanding, but I just about got it the way I invisioned it....still a work in progress. I just posted these to give You some idea's.
Frank,
Great pics! and thanks for the insight about the layout of the intermodal yard. I live about 10 minutes from the Queensgate yard, and so get to check it out frequently as I drove past it on the viaducts. My yard is going to incredibly modest as compared to Quennsgate and Bedford Pk, but I guess the cost of being a modeler! My yard will be 2 tracks about 4 feet long. It will be served with a Mi-Jack and possibly a mobile container crainer. I had considered adding crossing somewhere within the yard for the trucks. There will be a small engine house for the switcher at one end of the yard, and so I had planned a crossing at the other end for truck traffic. Thanks for the heads up about the composition of these crossings and tracks.
Here are some pictures of what I'm attempting. Hopefully these post.
https://flic.kr/p/JiHjRP
https://flic.kr/p/HtXaFB
https://flic.kr/p/HtX8Vn
https://flic.kr/p/HZtR97
I think this will work well once I get everything in place. Thanks for the suggestions and great pictures for inspiration.
Just try to remember...the crossings are duel purpose, for vehicular traffic and also for the crane to swing on/off both tracks. The crane operator sits under the engine and faces the track He is unloading. He cannot unload/load the other track without swinging the crane around, especially double stacks, He can't see what's going on and most importantly, He can't see His ground-man, which guide's Him in a lot of circumstances, unlocks fifth wheel lock when unloading trailers, unlocks twist locks on stacks. That Mi-Jack crane You show is for only loading/unloading one track. Real life cranes are longer and straddle two tracks. Some cranes have overhead operator shacks, that can do two tracks without swinging. Most guy's don't like them cause You have to climb ladders to get to them and if there is a problem, You can't exit as quickly, like if You were on the ground. I am one of the guy's that didn't like them....LOL
Before I retired, I got two of My son's job's at the yard, they started out at the bottom and worked their way up. Now one is a yard master at the CSX yard and the other is a ATM at the UP Intermodal yard in Joliet,Il. I'm proud of both of them...they did great! One has 17yrs in, other has 14 yrs. in. If You'd like I can get them to take pic's of some track arrangements...I have a lot now...but CSX and UP frown on showing the public some pic's. Any wrecks/derailments.
Thanks again. I'd love to see some track arrangements.
jmnienab Frank, Thanks again. I'd love to see some track arrangements.
I just asked My Son, the one that works at the UP, to take some pic's for Me of the crane paths, and what they look like, loading/unloading and some of surrounding area. He can do that, so... I will post them in this thread...soon! That is a new yard, some of the trackage has concrete ties.
My avatar... used to own My own trucks at one time...1973 Diamond Reo, that I restored, great city crosstown tractor, getting a can loaded on a chassis at the N&W yard in CHGO. I knew a lot of Railroad workers and still do.
I'll chime in with my plug for using craft foam (EVA foam) for asphalt. It's especially good for track-in-pavement because it can go the full width of the track without need for unsightly flangeways (if you use 1mm foam on code 100 track.) I've never seen 1mm foam at Michael's or Hobby Lobby, but an eBay seller named Wandy-Foam sells it.
Dab gray craft paint onto black foam using a kitchen sponge. Large cracks can be made by tearing the foam. For small cracks, chuck a straight pin into a Dremel and etch them in.
Steve S
Steve S:
Excellent 'roadwork'!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Agreed! For my intermodal yard I'm planning to use styrene -- I'm not planning to completely bury the track. I'm going to "pour concrete" up to the outside of the rails, but leave between the rails for ballast, except for the crossings of course. A later phase of my layout will include a small town/city featuring a street car. I think I may give the foam a shot for that section since the track work will be completely buried in the road.
Steve,
Have you used the foam on code 83? track? If so, is it as "flange friendly"?
Here's an update. I went with styrene. the bulk of the yard has been cut to fit and primed. Nextstep is to weather and install.
Kevin, ''The Krazy'' who works with My Son, has many pic's that He and some of His friends have taken over the years. Here is a link to the site He posts on....You'll find 100's of pic's for freight and Intermodal yards. Most all the one's He has posted are from the Joilet Intermodal Terminal where He works along with one of My Son's. When You see the pic', below on the bottom right under the pic', You'll see Location/photo date....click on more and You'll see more Intermodal pic's. It's a great site for many, many Railroad Photo's.....Do a little navigating:
http://www.railpictures.net/photo/573113/
Have Fun!
Everyone has their own preference. I used air dry modeling clay as the base for my grade crosings and it works fine except that leveling it was a bit of a paint and I have to paint and weather it.
Joe Staten Island West