New layout ideas and input

[Mountain scenery]

 There is a track plan by Paulus Jas I seen on another forum that I like too build. I believe its called Blue Coal, I not able too download it here? Any input on track radius would be helpful also making it a dbl main and doing all this on a 4x8 if possible? Or better yet 4x10.

["JaBear"]

This may help.....

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/p/194933/2131446.aspx

Cheers, the Bear.

[Anonymous]

Is this the one?

Layout size is 3 1/2 ft. by 8 1/2 ft, but adapting it to a 4 by 8 footprint should be easy. Also making it double track is no biggie, just leave out those to switches on the top and connect the ends of the track.

Minimum radius of this layout is 9 3/4".

 

[Mountain scenery]

Yes this is the layout, 9 3/4" is somewhat tight? If i add that extra half a foot too widen it would that give me more room for radius?

[rrinker]

 Yes, 9 3/4" is tight, basically the N scale equivalent of HO 18" radius. You need details on the plan, 9 3/4" is the minimum - if that is jsut on some sidings on the inside of the layout it may not be an issue - the real question is what radius are the mainlien curves where your trains will be doing most of their running. Even with the default width of the layout, there is room for much broader curves - if you widen it to a full 4' width, even more space.

               --Randy

[Mountain scenery]

I like too run 4-6 axle diesel units, along with few 2-8-8-2's. As far as freight cars 40-50's. And last on the list is a Santa Fe El Capitian/VIA Rail sets.

[rrinker]

 You're going to want a simplet track plan with MUCH wider than 9 3/4" radius curves then if you want to run a 2-8-8-2.

14-15" radius would be very nice.

Do you truly have room for a 4x8? By "truly have room", that means at least 2 feet on each side to walk around it to reach all parts. Because if so, you could go with something L, U, or even a donut at 8x12 - it takes the same space as a 4x8 with room to walk around the outside. On such a layout you could easily go up to 20" radius which in N scale makes pretty much anything look good. Or even 17-18".

                --Randy

 

[Mountain scenery]

Yes, but I would like to keep it as a 4-5x8' etc. I will be able too get around all 4 sides with no problem. I would like a radius just enought to handle my few trains. passenger trains.

[Anonymous]

Sounds as if you like to watch trains more than you´d want to "operate" that local freight over your layout.

If that´s so - how about something like MR´s project layout "The Salt Lake Route"?

The layout appeared first in MR´s Jan. 2010 issue. It´s got a 4 by 9 footprint.

[Mountain scenery]

Yes, i'm more into watching trains run then "operate", I also like too switch customers lumber, local coal yard, a few grain elevators also grain mill and oil depot, etc.

The salt lake city was nice but not for me.

I was thinkin of breaking up the tracks in the coal mine area to have 2-3 differnt coal mines.

I have another question on the track, if I build the turnouts myself say with a fast track jig can I use code 80 rail with the jig or dose it only only take code 55?

["JaBear"]

“Or better yet 4x10.”

Assuming that Pauls grids are 12 inches, the layout as drawn is 3’ 6” x  8’6” so yes you can expand to 4’ x 10’.

 

 “Any input on track radius....”

The minimum continuous radius on the track plan as drawn is the hidden track under the mine which I have marked in red, as drawn the radius is 10.2” but by increasing the layouts width by 6”, then the radius could be increased by 3”, giving a minimum radius of 13.2” ( if my maths is correct).

 

“....also making it a dbl main...” 

As for a double main, if it is one of your “givens” then, in my opinion, you’d be better off looking for another plan because trying to convert this track plan would spoil it.

As I see it, and I have drawn in red another track where Paul has noted “double track”, what you actually have is two single tracked mains. This would allow you to have two trains circulating the layout while you switch the mines to your hearts content.

 

Which brings me to my next point!

“Yes, I'm more into watching trains run then "operate", I also like to switch customers lumber, local coal yard, a few grain elevators also grain mill and oil depot, etc”.

Hmmmmm?? I would respectfully suggest that you’re both a watcher and an operator depending on how the mood takes you, and I have to ask the question, once you’ve switched your industries, what then?

Pauls design has given you two mains, and three interchanges, (though I could be tempted to make the one up by the mine into another mine) so the trains you have switched can actually go somewhere.

Not be an “N Gauger” I will not attempt to answer your specific track laying questions.

Have Fun,

Cheers, the Bear.

[Mountain scenery]

Thanks much Bear I like it so far but will either do a 5x8' or 4x9'. I think maybe a few more yard track and industrys if i give it a 1/2 more wide.

[Anonymous]

Although I quite like Paulus´ design, it lacks a vital thing for a realistic operation - an off stage staging yard (fiddle yard for the Brits) Staging is your off scene starting point or destination of trains, which is less important if you just want to watch trains run, but a must for operation!

["JaBear"]

The five foot width should work out just fine, if only for the further increase in possible minimum track radius, though I would point out, as a cautionary note that that is going to make your furthest reach  34.3”. I say this not to discourage you, but from the bitter experience of being involved in building a layout that “growed”. While it would have looked spectacular, as too much was out of reach, the scenery was hardly started and the layout was eventually scrapped. Sometimes “Less is Best”.

Sir Madog

Although I quite like Paulus´ design, it lacks a vital thing for a realistic operation - an off stage staging yard (fiddle yard for the Brits) Staging is your off scene starting point or destination of trains, which is less important if you just want to watch trains run, but a must for operation!

Yeah, it comes back to available space Ulrich, though with the help of the 0-5-0 switcher, Paul has allowed for the interchange tracks, and depending if Mountain Scenery became so inclined at a later date, and had the room, a cassette(s) could be plugged into the interchange tracks at the bottom right.

Have Fun,

Cheers, the Bear.

[Mountain scenery]

My next question, what type of table top should I use cookie cutter and how?

["JaBear"]

Gidday, here’s a discussion on “what”......

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/t/215364.aspx?page=1

 

Cheers, the Bear.

[Mountain scenery]

Thanks much bear, maybe the question should have been where too cut on a 4x8 sheet of playwood should go? I will do the track plan on a 4x8 sheet.

["JaBear"]

Ahh yes, the old measure three times, cut once and still get it wrong!!!  

I don’t have any construction photos though I have used the cookie cutter method reasonably extensively at the club and was hoping that some else might step into the breach.

The first thing to do is draw your track plan onto your base board and mark out where your variations in height start and finish, allowing for a smooth transition on to the grade. You will now most likely see that you will need another sheet as you don’t have enough material especially where your different track heights cross over each other. I generally try and cut my curving grades in one piece, but will also use doubler joins so not to waste material.

If you have a look what the guys have done in this thread you should get my drift.

 http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/t/202934.aspx

Hope this helps, Cheers the Bear.

[kasskaboose]

See below

[kasskaboose]

Sir Madog

Although I quite like Paulus´ design, it lacks a vital thing for a realistic operation - an off stage staging yard (fiddle yard for the Brits) Staging is your off scene starting point or destination of trains, which is less important if you just want to watch trains run, but a must for operation!

 

I don't have a staging yard on my layout, but can still replicate operations. Having trains dropping off cars, picking up others and then leaving is quite easy. Yes, it would be nice to have this yard, but you can easily replicate operations without one.

[Mountain scenery]

Yes, sounds like I will need more then one sheet of plywood! I would like too do the whole plan on a 4x8 sheet, I wonder if shorting it by 5"-6" is going too be a problem?

I would like a least 3-4 coal mines in the upper right area. Also lumber yard, oil dealer, grain mill/2-3 grain elevators, propane gas dealer too name a few.

Was thinkin of a saw mill somewhere?

Thanks Bear...

["JaBear"]

 OK, having had a bit of a think and presuming you’re sticking with Paulas Jas track plan as a basis for your layout, and that you’re going to use the cookie cutter method,  it is not as if you’re tied to the 4 x 8 sheet. The extra width is a bonus and while shortening the length by 6 inches may not sound much, you will note that the yard ladders and turnouts are orientated to suit the length. While I’m not an “N Gauger” I’d be concerned how much the effects of the compression would compromise the operational qualities of the layout. Besides with all those industries you want you’ll need all the room you can get, and although it all adds up, there's not alot more framing timber required.

As far as your proposed industries in the top right, I’ll once again say “Less is Best”. Trying to fit too much into an area is a common trap that too many of us fall into, and at the risk of trying to tell you what you already know, the mine, as drawn, has three tracks for loading which suggests to me that the mine generates a lot of rail traffic just by itself, mainly in the form of open hoppers, which will keep you occupied switching the mine and supplying coal trains for main line running. The one thing I would do though is move the mine closer to the turnouts so there is room for more hoppers “behind” the loading chutes. You could, and it would perhaps require some visual trickery, put a smaller seperate tipple that utilises the top two tracks, and put a simple “truck dump” on the Interchange track.

As for your other industries Paul has drawn seven possible locations, not that their location is set in stone, and that extra 6 inches width does give you a bit of leeway.

Hope this is not discouraging you,

Cheers, the Bear.

[Mountain scenery]

Would it be possible to do an in and out coal mine to power plant on this layout? Like what was done on the n scale clinchfield layout?