Hi all,
Would you recommend going with 1" of foam for my base or 2"? My track plan is flat, and there aren't any major hills or valleys, either. But when it comes to culverts or ditches that are below the track level, I'm wondering which way to go. For those of you (if any) that have gone with 1", have you wished you had gone with 2"? And those of you with 2", do you think you've used that second inch? Would it be better to go 2" just to be safe regardless?
Thanks,
Jim
What kind of support are you going to have under the foam? I recently built a 2x8 foot module for use at our HO club's outdoor display layout during open houses, using two 1" thick pieces of blue extruded foam covered with 1/2 inch of sound board. The sound board is strong enough that I could have gotten by with only one layer of foam, and if I build any more that's what I'll do. But I did carve a deep ravine through the sound board and both layers of foam and it could not have been as deep as it is with only one layer.
How thick your foam needs to be depends on how much weight it is going to support and how well you support it on the bottom.
Jim,
I actually went with 1-1/2" extrude foam. Not quite so thick but not too thin either. It's easier to add than it is to take away.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
It's braced every 16 inches with vertical 1x4s, and is also supported along one side, also by a 1x4. It's no more than 30 inches wide. I'm comfortable with it strength-wise, but you raise a good point. And the more I think about it, the more I'm thinking about going 2 inches to allow for more depth if I want to use it.
Hi Tom,
Yeah, 1 1/2" kind of splits the difference, no? And that extra depth could come in handy down the road. I might as well go for a bit more than 1 inch.
Thanks much,
My N Scale layout has 2 layers of 2" foam. That might be overkill, but I got it for practically nothing. I don't have the track length to get the elevations I wanted, so that gives me some extr wiggleroom to dig canyons, cliffs, ditches, etc...It's built on dominos on 16" centers. anchored to the wall with diagonal supports below..
If you do want some vertical relief on a 2" foam, you must purchase more foam (assuming you have to actually purchase it and can't find a source of waste). So, if you use a thinner surface, support it sensibly, and then use a second similar thickness to build up the layers as you need them, it only involves some preliminary carving to rough shape and then some filing or sanding. If dollars are somewhat important, then, a thinner first surface with a second sheet used for carving up should be somewhat less costly than starting with 2" and adding more on top of it.
Here's how I built mine.2 inch foam on 1x3 cross supports every 16 inches, and 1x4 sides.Added another 2 foot wide piece so my tables (3 of them, are 6 feet by 8 feet)
I have 3 tables end to end for 6 by 24 feet, 45 inch table surface heigth with total walkaround capability right now.The legs bolt on so if I ever decide to move my layout, it can easily be moved, yet is very strong and yet lightweight. I put leveling screw pads on the bottom of each leg.Crossmembers were pre-drilled for wiring runs.
2 inch foam is glued to crossmembers with a special glue I bought at Menards, comes in a caulking gun tube.
TheK4Kid
Here's a picture of my buddy Denny who helped me build the tables and has been helping me with my layout.Denny is the train guy at Phil's Hobby Shop in Fort Wayne Indiana.
Off to Denny's right in the far corner is "The Airplane Factory" , my other hobby.bout my whole basement is my workshop.( about 1700 square feet.)And another picture of some of my PRR BLI equipment now running on the two completed mainlines.This picture was taken after Denny and I finished the first table for inspiration!And another picture of my BLI T1 setting on my Walthers 130 foot turntable.
And another shot of one of my M1's and my Proto Heritage 2-8-8-2 I have two #373 and 376.
And a better shot of one of my two T1's
And a shot of one of favorites, ( I have had this engine since I was a kid, and it still runs great!I want to put a decoder in it so I can convert it to DCC.My Dad gave this to me for my 11th birthday in 1962.It is a Lionel switcher #0602
I'm about to start a large N scale layout using "L" girder construction for the benchwork. I plan to use 2" blue extruded foam on top of 1/2" plywood. The 1/2" plywood is so I can run screws up into it from below to secure it to the "L" girder benchwork. The 2" foam will allow me to do terrain below track level. If I need something more than 2" deep, I can always go down to the tops of the "L" girders with my plywood as the bottom for deep river gorges, etc. I'll use layers of the 2" foam to build up the terrain above track level.
A word of caution about thinner forms of extruded foam! It has been pointed out in several posts in this forum that the thinner forms of extruded foam, i.e., 1" or less, have a protective plastic layer attached to the surface of the foam. This must be peeled off the surface for proper adhesion to occur when gluing the foam sheets together or when gluing features to the foam surface. I think this would be a real pain if you had to peel it off a large amount of the thinner foam. To me this is another good reason to go with the 2" thick foam which, to my knowledge, does not have the protective plastic layer on its surface.
Bob
Hello, Jim,
Seems like you're possibly modeling the west end of the EL like me! I have decided to just put my (temporary) free lanced layout on just plywood. cutting out the below grade contours (streams, etc.) with a jig saw. Right now, I'm modeling northern Ohio east of Toledo and it is like a billiard table so there's not much contour to the landscape. The hills and valleys are therefore very few gently rolling at most. I am putting together a small switching layout (designed to be part of a larger layout one day) and the only below grade feature is a creek that runs under the tracks. Good luck!
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
I eneded up using 1.5" blue foam because the 2" stuff was $30 a sheet but I dont' think it will hinder my plan at all. My layout will be mostly flat also except for a incline to the coal mine and maybe a few created hills and ditches. Sometimes sacrafices have to be made.
erielackfanoregon wrote: Would it be better to go 2" just to be safe regardless?Thanks,Jim
Would it be better to go 2" just to be safe regardless?
2" is a decent sized culvert. It might be a lil overkill. However if you intend on using tortoises, with 2" you should mount the tortoise right below the track. With <2" you have to mount it under the table.
I'm finding the closer the switch machine to the actual turnout, the easier it is to place it for switch point control. The piano wire has a tendency to "flex" the further it gets from the throw bar. And this can create problems.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
I am looking at adding a removable module (2'x4') to an existing yard. Due to where the module would reside (too close to the Franklin stove for comfort) it needs to be removable. I was thinking about constructing it out of 2" foam, with some sort of "knock down" legs to facilitate easy set up/knock down/storage. I have never used foam before and i am wondering if the 2" foam would need much support from underneath, or would it be able to span 4' without any help? Also, will it hold track nails?( I'm not a fan of "gooing" down my tracks) Another idea i had was to make a "foam sandwich" - a sheet of foam between 2 layers of old "wood" (luan type) paneling - I think that would hold nails and add some structural integrity without adding too much bulk. Comments?
Thanks
Richard
Reformed Grownup,
Foam itself won't hold nails. Your sandwich method may work. I'd try a small "sandwich piece" first with a piece of test track and see how it works. If so, go for it!
On my tables I used cross supports every 16 inches, but with a piece of luan plywood in between like you suggest, I would imagine with only four feet, the plywood would give all the support you need.
I used two layers of 1.5 inch foam on my shelf layout. The upper layer is cookie cuttered to allow elevation changes. It works well but if I had to do it over again I would use 2 layers of 1 inch instead. I think that would still be plenty sturdy. I like foam by itself (not sitting on plywood) because it is easy to poke holes thru it for wiring and switch linkages. I don't find that attaching components underneath is a problem. I just screw these items to the foam with long screws and maybe add a little glue to the screw threads. I also have found the two layers to be quiet. I would be wary of a single layer, especially of 1 inch transmitting too much noise.
george
"I just screw these items to the foam with long screws and maybe add a little glue to the screw threads."
If you need to screw something to the underside of the foam, just glue a 4 inch square of wood to the foam.
"If you need to screw something to the underside of the foam, just glue a 4 inch square of wood to the foam."
Sure, that works too. That's especially good if you need to prefabricate an assembly prior to mounting. Other techniques include just gluing the device to the foam, or sticking it in place with double-sided tape. There are lots of ways. I find that screwing the device directly to the foam is simple, it works and it allows me to easily remove the device. My main point is that you don't need wood down there to mount things on.