Working with concrete

[diggerdooley]

I am trying to use concrete to build a realistic vertical cliff on a mountain railroad. Somewhere I read about using burlap draped over some kind of frame and covered with mortar or stucco. I saturated the burlap in a very wet mixture of mortar before hanging it on the frame, but so far, the burlap has not stiffened up enough to hold the mortar. Has anyone ever used this method?

[FJ and G]

http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=29931&whichpage=1

[Anonymous]

Diggerdooley,

Something like this?



Gary Olmstead and I have written a how do document that details just how to build cliffs and related stuff using Gary Olmstead's plastic cement/burlap technique.

From wire framing:



to the stuff you need for concrete work:



to the burlap as paper mache:



to painting:



Find the PDF here (note it's over 5 megs with over 50 pictures so if you're on dialup it'll download slowly):

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/tj-lee/Cliffs%20of%20Insanity/

The key to Gary's technique is the use of "plastic" cement. Comments most welcome.

Best,
TJ

[Ray Dunakin]

What is "plastic cement"? Is that the same as vinyl patching cement?

[Anonymous]

Ray,

> Is that the same as vinyl patching cement?

No, as I understand it from Gary (and keep in mind I'm not a handyman in any way shape or form) "plastic" cement is the base cement componet of stucco. I purchase it at Lowes but I would think Home Depot or any major building supply would carry it. What I've found comes in 90lb bags and just says PLASTIC CEMENT on the bag.

What makes this mountain building technique work is that by simply varing the amount of water mixed with the plastic cement you can get any consistancy you want. From thick pea soup for doing the burlap wrapping to a cake frosting consistancy to modeling clay consistancy for doing detail texturing work.

Plastic cement sets up slowly as cements go which gives you plenty of time to work in the details for your mountain, tunnel, cliff or what have you.

The result takes the latex base paint very nicely and that gives you a great base for acrylic colors to make your mountain look however you want.

It's cheap and easy to work with in either large (like Gary's) or small (like mine) projects. In the PDF you can see pics of Gary's totally impressive Mountain Range that he and Chris Walas built using this technique.

Best,

TJ

P.S. I should mention that this technique uses water and plastic cement only. No sand, rock, or other aggregate is added as in traditional cement mixing.

TJ

[dwbeckett]

Thanks for asking the my next question, Thats the ansure I was looking. The stucco version comes colored Its being used on my new house. And will be used onTHE NEW INDOOR DNRR.

[Rene Schweitzer]

TJ,
AWESOME post. I wanted to add that Jack Verducci has covered his method of using his "gulapata" mix. We have a free download here. The file is rather large, so if you have problems, drop me an email and I'll be happy to send it to you.

http://www.trains.com/content/dynamic/articles/000/000/004/997emwzk.asp

[FJ and G]

IDEA FOR GRR:

There's a bewildering variety of cements, concrete, vinyl patching, hydraulic cement, Portland, mortar, stucco, grouts and other things at Lowe's and HD. I'm OFTEN confused and bewildered.

An article explaining which works best with which project would be MOST welcome. For example, making roads, building, pilings etc etc etc

[Anonymous]

Rene,

Thank you!

I have read Jack's excellent piece on his "mix" but it was too complicated for a newbie like myself when I started the cliffs. Gary and Chris' plastic cement technique uses just two ingredients and can be mixed in small batches which suited my project nicely. It was a lot of fun going from this:



To this:



Although it seemed like it took me forever.

I really appreciate the information in GR though. I had fair results following Ed Frey's Beginner Project for weathering an ore car (mainly because I was able to get some help here from the online community) and had great fun doing it. Ed himself chimed in on another thread with some pointers that helped a lot.



I hope GR continues to include a beginner projects for newbies like myself. I really like the solid wood buildings example in the last issue and plan to try my hand at something like that at some point.

Best regards,
TJ

[Anonymous]

David,

> An article explaining which works best with which project ...

I second that! I'd love to know about all the different types of cement. Most posts (and a fair number of articles) just assume you know all about the stuff they mention.

Best,
TJ