Pre War American Flyer Pictures - An Invitation

[Northwoods Flyer]

1926 Christmas List

The 1926 catalog had a number of great looking trains in both Narrow and Wide Gauge.  Many of the Narrow Gauge sets came with accessories like stations and tunnels and signals.  The Wide Gauge line was headed by the tan President's Special. There were other Wide Gauge sets as well and some of them were very appealing. 

Consider the All-American Limited

 

It had a full page spread that described the virtues of each car.

 

 

If Santa granted your request there would have been an impressive addition to your railroad empire under the tree:

 Set #1433  for 1926

 

 

 

 

 

 

You would have needed some space in the front parlor to run this impressive set.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby,

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

[Northwoods Flyer]

Christmas List 1927

Children pouring over the 1927 Flyer Catalog had many choices to fuel their dreams of what would be waiting for them under the tree on Christmas morning.  Both the Wide Gauge and Narrow Gauge lines had many new offerings.  The trains pictured in the catalog art were a visual delight to the eyes.

One that caught the eye of many children was the bright orange The Oriental Limited.

When it showed up under the tree carrying passengers and baggage from town to town it brought many a "Wow" to the lips of its new owner.

 

 

It had some great details like the brass identification tags and a bell and a light and a pantograph.

 

 

 

What kids of that time didn't know was that while The Oriental Limited would appear in catalogs for several years, this was the only year that the lithography would have red windows on the engine and all of the cars.  In the following years the windows would become various shades of green, and it would be pulled by a different engine.

 

 

The Oriental Limited provide easy access to neighboring towns for all the inhabitants of Christmas Town. It must have been pretty busy during the holidays.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

[Sturgeon-Phish]

It has been a while since I've posted any pics here and I have aquired some interesting additions

593 Signal Tower

748 Footbridge

Track Gang

793 Union Station (non-talking)

769A

750 Tresel Bridge

768 Oil Supply Depot

I really like this thread.  It is like a muesum tour!

Jim

[mersenne6]

Christmas 1938 List - Addendum

    Even though you and your friend down the street thought trains (and particularly American Flyer trains in the 1938 Catalog) were the most interesting things in the world it didn't mean the two of you were in exact agreement with respect to types of trains.  He always seemed to have more of an interest in freight trains whereas you thought nothing could compare to those crack passenger trains you would see roaring through the grade crossing you had to traverse every day on your way to school.   Well, not to worry, on that same page of the 1938 catalog there was something for each of you.  In your case it was the No. 1 Passenger set

 

 

  He had asked for the freight set and you (you lucky dog) had asked for the passenger train.  When you opened up the box and were confronted with all of that crackle gray, copper, brass, and red you just couldn't believe what you were seeing.

 

 

[mersenne6]

Christmas 1915  

The year 1915 had seen many changes at American Flyer.  They had started using the Winged Engine herald and they had also applied for copyright protection for same.  They had moved to new quarters at South Halsted Street in Chicago where they would stay until the purchase by A.C. Gilbert in 1938 and they had started making clockwork motors based on their own design as opposed to those based on Hafner’s.  

 

They had also joined the competition (Ives and Lionel) and begun advertising in children’s magazines like American Boy.  The ad extolled the virtues of the new AF motors –

  

“Winds easier, runs farther, last longer.  The engines and cars are beautifully lithographed in bright colors.  They don’t cost much. You can get a dandy train, with engine, cars and track complete for $1. Or you can pay as much as you like, up to $10.

  Ask For One For Christmas” 

 

 

 

  At a $1.50 the M1X was a step or two above the lowest priced train offered that year.  It came, as advertised, with engine, a car, and track. 

 

  The loop of track (eight curved and two straight) was a modest empire and when you added the station (Grandma could always be counted on to provide that all important extra) the end result was a small rail empire that hopefully brought you a great deal of joy and fired your imagination.

  

 

[Northwoods Flyer]

Christmas List 1928

If you were a child looking at the American Flyer Catalog before Christmas 80 years ago there would have been many things to fill your head with dreams and wishes.  There were trains that you could wind up, trains that were large enough to fill a room, trains that were a bit smaller but were all new called the Rainbow Line, accessories to keep you busy on the railroad for hours and Structo Toys.

It was a small group of children that could hope for a President's Special to be waiting for them under the tree, so just maybe you could hope for the new train in Wide Gauge called The Hamiltonian.  In its color of Victory Red with all of the brass accents it was a breathtaking sight.

 

 

If you were the child of the town banker or your dad owned the General Store in town you might see that train on Christmas morning.  But if you happened to be a friend of the that child, you would probably get to see it running around his tree later on Christmas day or the day after.  Even if it wasn't yours it would be a sight to see; all 5 feet 3 inches of it.

 

 

 

 

If you were willing to settle for something a bit smaller you could have asked for something from the Narrow Gauge line.  All new for that year was The Potomac  set.

 

 

While just under 3 feet in length and no match for The Hamiltonian.  Its colors of Rookie Tan and Emerald Green would have looked great speeding around under the tree on the parlor floor.

 

 

 

 

Who says it was easier being a kid 80 years ago?  It would have been a tough choice to pick what to ask for from the catalog that year.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

 

[QueensNY]

hey Northwood,

Have a question for you. I have a motor it's an 4644 af standard gauge. For the life of me i cant find a wire diagram for it. would you by any chance know how to wire this motor? Or maybe have a picture of one of yours? Thanks for any help.

[mersenne6]

 

   Christmas 1925

     The Flyer Catalog for 1925 had some offerings that were improvements over those from the year before.  One of these improvements was Set #1202.  It was the replacement for Set #1201 from 1924.  The 1924 set was headed by engine #1201 a steeple cab engine without a headlight.  In 1925 Flyer replaced #1201 with #1218, a steeple cab identical in construction with #1201 except that it had a working headlight. 

  #1218 was not new. It had been around since 1920 and 1925 would be the last year it was offered.  Most of the #1218's were black with either red or yellow enameled window frames, however, there were other colors and, in the case of set #1202 the engine could be purchased in either black or dark green.

  As was typical for the day the illustration on the set box was something of an exaggeration with respect to contents.

 

 However, #1218 was a cab type electric outline locomotive and it was pulling a baggage car and a coach.  What makes set #1202 interesting today and what probably made it interesting in 1925 was the prototypical look of the passenger car lithography.  The baggage car sported the GN goat logo and the passenger car bore the name of the then top-of-the-line GN passenger train - The Oriental Limited. 

 

  The engine with its operating headlight, the oval of track, and the consist made for an interesting train that possessed elements of the real thing and it would certainly have been a welcome site under the Christmas tree that December of 1925.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mersenne6]

 

  Christmas 1930

     The first page of the 1930 catalog highlighted Set #1316 The Clipper - a freight set headed by #3103 an upgrade of the #1218 steeple cab.  #3103 had a beefed up chassis - sheet metal sides riveted to red-painted cast iron pilots.  The cab sported brass trim in the form of brass oval nameplates and stamped brass door hand rails. The engine was painted a bright red and had either gold or yellow window trim.  A brass bell and pantograph and an operating headlight completed the engine.

 

 

  The catalog cut also hinted at the planned upgrade of the boxcar which "sort of" happened.  The litho treatment of the car, besides changing from red to yellow was also supposed to reflect a more prototypical look.  Gone from the illustration was the winged engine logo as well as the words "American Flyer" across the top of the car. 

 

  What actually happened was the following:  The winged engine logo remained and the type font for the lettering on the car side changed - as did the number of lines of car reporting marks.  In order to "remove" the lettering at the top of the car adjustments were made to the way the litho was cut from the sheet metal.  This change caused the lettering on the car side to register higher on the car side. Thus, when the roof was attached the words "American Flyer" were obscured.

 

  The set included a number of extras - a tunnel, a manually operated banjo signal, a grade crossing warning and a small suburban station.  These along with the oval of track provided the new railroad magnate with an instant empire.

 

 

 

[mersenne6]

 

  Christmas Day 1933

     You had been pouring over the Flyer catalog since September and you had spent endless hours looking at the illustrations. Twice, when Dad had to go downtown, you had gone with him and visited the local hardware store with the train display.  You had examined the various trains on the shelves as well as those that were running in the window display and while every one of them looked great it was the passenger set with the engine with the ringing bell that had really caught your eye. /

 

 

    In addition to the ringing bell the Highlander set had illuminated passenger cars and that, as far as you were concerned, made Set #1343RT the most interesting set offered.  The tradition at your house was that Santa would leave the main present under the tree, set up and unwrapped.  When you came down the steps that morning and turned the corner into the living room - there it was, set up and ready to roll.  You could hardly wait for nightfall when you could run the train with the room lights off so you could lie down on the carpet with your head next to the rails and watch your bell ringing, lighted train boom past./

 

[Northwoods Flyer]

Christmas List 1929

The Flyer catalog in 1929 had some great new trains and some old favorites that had been there for years.  Children looking at that catalog and dreaming of wonderful trains and toys under the tree might have had those dreams shaken by the situation in the world around them.  Many children must have heard their parents talking in hushed tones about the economic changes taking place and the scary thing that had happened in November of that year.  In the midst of all those dreams and hopes the stock market took a huge drop, and people everywhere were losing jobs.  If you had been hoping for a top of the line Ambassador set that year, you might have gone back to the catalog to modify your requests to Santa to get more bang for your buck.  Instead of paying $21.00 for the Ambassador, you might have chosen The Bluebird, a complete railroad system.

 

For $15.50 you could get an engine, three cars, a tunnel, a semaphore, and a station.  It would be hard for anyone to deny that you were being frugal - and getting a great value for your money.

 

If you were lucky The Bluebird might just have shown up under your tree that year. 

 

 

It might be the last train you would get for a long time.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby.

 

Northwoods Flyer

[Northwoods Flyer]

Christmas List 1930  -  Part II

The year after the big crash on Wall Street was pretty lean for many families.  Many folks considered themselves lucky to still have a job.  Even if your dad was still working many children got the message not to expect too much from Santa that year.  Even a set like the Clipper might have been out of reach of many families.

The country might have been in the depths of a depression, but the American Flyer Catalog was still healthy and robust and fueling the dreams of many a young railroad magnate.  If a full train set wasn't possible, Flyer offered a varied line of accessories to add to your empire.

 

What railroad wouldn't benefit from a Watchman's Tower

 

 

Or a Suburban Station

 

 

Or maybe even the Hyde Park Station?

 

 

With a letter to Santa pleading your case, and visits to several of the Santa's "helpers" present in the stores around town, you might just find those vital structures under your tree on Christmas morning.

 

 

And with the help of Grandma's egg money you might just find all three!

 

 

Afterall, even during a depression the railroads were a vital part of American commerce, even if it was just the railroad in your living room.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby,

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

 

[mersenne6]

Year's End

 

     So here we are - 2008 is almost over and this thread is almost a year old.  We've counted cars, our keyboards have been dusted with the soot from hard charging steam powered trains, we've had our eyes dazzled with the lingering after image of night time sparks from the overhead wires as the electrics whizzed past, taken a tour of American Flyer architecture, asked and answered any and all manner of questions related to prewar American Flyer and in general had a great time.  Below is a New Year's Eve visual feast to augment the more traditional one.

 

 

 

....and here's our young Flyer fan looking out in anticipation of the trains that will be rolling this way in 2009.

 

 

Wishing you all the best in the coming year.

 

              Mersenne6

[Northwoods Flyer]

Year's Beginning

One year ends and another begins.  As Mersenne6 ushered out the old in grand style, and with a visual feast of American Flyer trains, let me welcome you to the new year of 2009. 

The Roman god Janus, for which the month of January is named was the god of gates, doors, doorways, and beginnings and endings.  Janus has the ability to look into both the past and the future.  He is depicted as having two faces that look in opposite directions.

 

It makes me wish that Flyer had produced some form of double A unit in prewar equipment. I guess the closest I can get is that double header set from 1939.  Post war Gilbert Flyer collectors have many examples of double A units to choose from.

It has been great fun looking into the past of American Flyer history and researching items and sets that have been presented.  As I look into the future on this New Year's day I can tell you to expect more of the same as we present more pictures of Prewar American Flyer equipment.  There is plenty yet to come.

As we begin the new year I want to wish all who read this thread a safe, healthy, happy and prosperous year.  May you add some of Flyer's wonderful toys to your collection and come to appreciate those that you already own. And may all of your plans have enough track to complete them.

 

Happy New Year!

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

[johnnyt]

Hi,beautiful A.F. collection! I have a rare 1957 uncataloged #21004 loco and slant back tender w/ rocket freight set,and i'm in love with it!! Nice pics

[Northwoods Flyer]

  to the forum and welcome to the thread.

Your 21004 is indeed a nice engine.  It is an uncataloged version of the 0-6-0 switcher in S gauge.  Most of my S gauge collection is packed up in boxes, but I did go and hunt down the pictures of it in Greenberg's Guide to American Flyer S gauge Vol 1.  Here are a couple of pictures of it.  I will have to go look through my catalogs to see if I can find the page that the set appears on.  It will probably show it as the 21005 in the catalog.

Here is the picture of the 21004 and its almost identical twin the 21005

 

And some closer views

 

 

 

That's a great way to start a collection.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

[johnnyt]

Hey, thank you for the info and pics can you send it to me in a ( p.d.f. file )? I have been wanting more info on it , i found it when i painted apartments for a living, someone left it behind when they moved( my gain).Check my posts in the toy train forum, i have an article with pics of my train!! I think the whole rocket freight set is worth around $1000.00 with that loco

[Northwoods Flyer]

Uncataloged Set

American Flyer is well known for assembling sets, for stores and other outlets, that did not appear in their catalog.  This has created some interesting variations and unusual sets that show up. I have aquired most of the items in my collection one or two pieces at a time.  Recently I came across a full set that I recognized from Greenberg's book.  In the book it is listed in the passenger car section.  Its the set on the right.

 

My set contains a #614 steamer.  Mersenne6 describes this engine on page 13 of this thread.  It has the typical problem of deteriorating wheels and has a tender labeled "Champion", althought it is difficult to see it in the photo.

 

 

It also comes with a baggage.  Note that the door is a different color than the one shown in Greenberg, the door also has no lithography as compared to similar baggage cars, and the car has the Great Northern logo.

 

 

 

You have to wonder if there was any problem with liscensing agreements - somehow I doubt it.

 

 

There are two identical passenger cars

 

 

And an observation car.

 

 

None of the cars have numbers on them identifying them, and all are without journals, just like the photos in the Greenberg book.

 

One of the things that I enjoy so much about this forum is the ability to exchange information. I contacted Mersenne6 to see if he could help me with any additional identification or information.  I was curious to see if I could find out who sold these sets.  He managed to come up with some additional facts:

 

" The cars you are asking about are numbered #1226, 1227, and 1228.  As noted they are unmarked but they came in cardboard sleeves with the number rubber stamped on the sleeve.  The engine is our old friend #614 of the crumbled wheels fame. It is identical to the one I photographed and posted in response to the earlier question concerning that engine's wheels.(edit - page 13)  I've never seen the set with a box so I don't know who marketed it but I have seen two sets with the cars, engine, and tender in the cardboard sleeves.  This would put the set in the 1935-37 time frame because of the method of packing the cars."

 

He also provided a picture of a car and its sleeve.

 

Many Thanks Mersenne6 for the additional information.

 

So it is still possible to find information about items that hasn't been published in books.  The hunt for information and the history of items is something that keeps me interested in this hobby.  I still don't know who marketed the set. The hunt continues.  If you have any information about this set I'd enjoy hearing it.

 

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Northwoods Flyer]

234 Suburban Station  -  variation

Those of you who follow this thread or have read all the way through it know that I add variations to earlier posts as I find them.  Back on page 10 I documented the variations of the 234 station that I have collected.

 

I recently came across a 5th variation.  It has a red roof which has some embossed ridges on it.

 

 

And here it is with its green roofed twin.  Interestingly the green roofed version does not have any embossing on it.

 

 

With the way that American Flyer used existing stock to make up items for sale to accounts and include in sets I have a feeling that there are variations yet to be found.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

[Northwoods Flyer]

Manual Reverse

The technology used in many of the toy trains produced today is very impressive, and to some of us confusing.  Technology and electronics have changed in 80 years.  But even 8 decades ago toy manufacturers were being creative and innovative to produce toys that drew the interest of children.  American Flyer came up with an interesting way to reverse its electric outline engines.  Initially all reversing was done manually, but with this small accessory it was possible to manually reverse an engine at a remote location.

 

This little gizmo attaches to tubular track by means of the hooked end and the thumbscrew.

 

 

Those engines with manual reverse capabilities were equipped with a reversing bar that stuck out on both sides of the frame.

 

 

When the manual reverse accessory is folded down it lays flat at the side of the track.

 

 

And the engine passes over the trip without any effect.

 

 

When the accessory is folded up it sticks up along the edge of the track.

 

 

When the engine passes over the raised accessory the reversing bar strikes it and rotates the bar and the engine reverses.

 

 

 

If the engine strikes the trip at a high speed it immediately throws the engine into reverse.  Imagine the effect on the cars following.  Those poor passengers, and the damage to freight would be incredible.

 

The reversing option was mentioned in catalog descriptions and the reversing track trip was usually included in the set, as you can see in the illustration of The Oriental Limited and The Jeffersonian from the 1927 catalog.

 

 

I'd say that was a pretty clever way to handle a desire for reversing a train.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

[Northwoods Flyer]

1/22/2009 

Today marks the one year anniversary of the founding of this thread.  When I started it I was hoping that I would be able to connect with other Pre War American Flyer enthusiasts to hear their stories of collecting and to see the pictures of items that they have collected or found interesting.  I was hoping that it would gather information about Flyer in one place.  When I started collecting I found it difficult to find information. I wondered if there would be any interest from others on the forum. The over 30,000 views to this thread would indicate that there has indeed been interest.

For me the thread has been a great deal of fun, and an educational experience. I have learned from others and I have had to do the research to answer questions presented by other posters. It has allowed me to be active in a great hobby while expanding my knowledge base and making some friends along the way.

I want to thank all of you who have participated in this thread during the last year; those who have read it regularly, those who have posted pictures and stories, those who have asked questions or provided additional information.  Most of all I want to thank Mersenne6 for being such an important part of this thread. His collection and wealth of information have helped make it what it is today. I have enjoyed collaborating with him. I have been delighted by the response and its gratifying to know that there are others who enjoy the charm and history of American Flyer Trains.

So let me offer this greeting to all of you who participate;

Happy Anniversary

Here is to the continuation of enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

 

Northwoods Flyer

[Eljay]

 

[Northwoods Flyer]

The Other Freight Cars  V

The Caboose - Addendum A

Back on page 24 Mersenne6 posted lots of information on the caboose production of American Flyer.  Here are a few more pictures of the 6.5 inch variations of the enameled caboose.  In 1930 American Flyer painted the caboose in enamels.

3017

Type VII truck, red body, green roof and silver lettering

 

Type VIII truck, orange roof, silver lettering

 

 

Type VIII truck, green roof, silver lettering

 

 

Type VIII truck, red body, darker red roof, decals

 

 

232

1939 version  -   red body, darker red roof, silver lettering, type XII trucks and type X knuckle coupler (curly cue)

 

 

3017

red body, darker red roof, type XII truck, type VII coupler, this is just like the 232 but without the curly cue coupler, decals under window only

 

 

1127

This is technically not one of the enameled versions.  It is an uncataloged version.  Mersenne6 shows the 4 wheel version back on page 24.  This is the 8 wheel version from  1936-1937 with type X trucks.

 

 

There are other variations. Just as was once true with real railroads, the caboose is an easy car find and every freight train needs one.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

[Eljay]

I am new to posting in general and to the pre-war AF addiction in general so here goes.

I have an AF1218 loco with a missing cab top as shown:

and an AF 3107 missing a motor and copula:

 

Small parts such as bells and pantographs seem to be available from parts dealers but body parts and motors can be tough to find. I'm hoping that someone here might have (or be) a source for these things. Also I'm having a hard time finding out which motors go with which locomotives for pre-war AF. Even the TCA museum doesn't seem to have much info on this subject. It would be very helpful to those of us who are crazy enough to try to assemble our treasures from the parts we can find on the internet or at train shows to have photos of the insides of pre-war equipment. I have already run into too many pre-war items cobbed together from incorrect parts or even from parts made by different pre-war manufacturers. It would be great if we could post photos with the correct identifications of motors which go with our AF locos. To that end I am posting photos showing six views of locomotive motors.

First a 1218 motor that I'm pretty sure is correct:

 

 

Second an unidentified AF motor:

 

If anyone can help with identification of this one it would be greatly appreciated. Also if anyone has a photo of the correct 3107 motor it would be very helpful.

Thanks,

Eljay

[Northwoods Flyer]

Eljay,

   to the forum and to this thread.  Thanks for posting your pictures and questions.  I will go through my engines and see if I can post some pictures for you.  I admire your willingness to bring back some basket cases to operating condition.  We all have our interests within the hobby.  I wish you luck in your search for parts.  Occasionally motors show up on Ebay.

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

 

[mersenne6]

  The lack of wheels with simulated counter weights certainly suggests both motors are from electric outiline engines.  I pulled out my #1218 and the the first motor seems to be a match for that locomotive.  The second motor with the headlight mount and the insulation paper for the brushes matches the appearance of the motor in my #1096. 

[Eljay]

Thanks for the info. That's exactly what I needed to know.

Eljay

[Northwoods Flyer]

 Eljay,

You asked for some pictutes of the motor in a 3107.  I dug mine out and as I told you in an email I am hesitant to take the body off because it is held in place by 4 metal tabs that bend and become more fragile with each bending.  I can tell by looking at it that mine has been worked on in the past.  The paint on the tabs is scratched and missing.  I am making an assumption that the pictures that I have taken are of the motor that originally came with the body because it matches the description in the Greenberg guide.  I can see some rewiring and I am a bit suspicious that it has been rewheeled.  I hope the pictures give you something to go on.

Your 3107: 

Mine:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe this will help you identify a motor for the 3107 if you come across it.  The most distinctive feature appears to be the sliding bar for the reversing unit that protrudes through the roof.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

 

[ivesboy]

 

      Good evening gentlemen..... I picked up a satin black 420 loco today for a small fee. I figured i'd travel into the flyer O sector for awhile. The loco has nickel trim. Could you guys school me as to it's background and what cars it came with? Thanks in advance.

[Eljay]

Great detail shots! These will help a lot. One other question. Could you post a couple of shots of the cupola on the roof. This loco is close to being complete. Much appreciated.

Thanks,

Eljay