Lionel ZWs: Which is my best bet? What do I really need?

[Anonymous]

I'm slowly building out my layout. I'm looking to be able to run a few trains at a time if possible and I'd like to do it from one controller as well. I will be running mostly modern era stock (engines w/ bells and whistles but no TMC at this time). My layout is basically 8ft x 12ft w/ a few loops of track and roughly 16 powered switches. I plan to set up blocks to facilitate running different engines.

I'm looking at the ZWs old and new. What is the difference between the old classic ZWs and the new "ZW and Powerhouse Supply Set"? What do I really need? I'm seeing reburbished ZWs on eBay that are relatively inexpensive compared to the new ZW sets. Am I taking a chance w/ these refurbs? And will they do what I need? I also have a couple of the new CW-80 transformers. What can I do w/ these? Power accessories and switches?? I'm clueless...

Thoughts? Am I asking the right questions? Please help!

Thanks!

Matt

[ben10ben]

The old ZW is a totally self-contained 250 or 275 watt 4-tap variable transformer. The new ZW is basically four independent voltage controllers and a circuit breaker housed in a Bakelite case that's the same shape as an old ZW. The power comes from 1-4 separate 135 or 180 watt 18 volt transformers that Lionel calls powerhouses. The new ZW can provide roughly 180 watts per variable output for a total of 720 watts(it comes with two 180 watt powerhouses, for a total of 360 watts). The old ZW has roughly 200 watts available in practical terms divided across all four outputs.

There are advantages and disadvantages to each. The advantages to the old ZW are its reliability(built like a tank), availability of replacement parts, ease of service, low cost, and the pure sine wave output. Disavantages are the slow-acting circuit breaker and inefficency of the core under high loads. Advantages of the new ZW are its fast acting circuit breaker, high possible output, and its ability to control track power remotely through TMCC. Disadvantages are the high initial cost, lack of a true sine wave, and the 180 watt limit on each output channel.

[alton6]

So, for the technically impared, what is the advantage of pure sine wave over impure sine wave?

Also, does an old ZW hum as obnoxiously as my old LW? How about the new ones--any quieter?

And, how is an old ZW for low speed operation? I gave up one my LW in large part because engines would go from 0 to 60 so quickly. Never mind 15, or 20; it just wanted things to rip!

Thanks,

Carl

[ben10ben]

Carl,
Some early release QSI and MTH Protosound 1 engines wouldn't work on anything but a pure sine wave transformer, such as a traditional ZW. The real issue was with more modern electronic power supplies, many of which output a modified and highly distorted sine wave, and not so much with the ZW and Z-4000, which put out an electronic aproximation of a true sine wave. There still is a potential for problem with these, but it's much reduced, and really not an issue unless you plan on running early QSI or PS1 engines.

As for the hum, every LW I have ever used has been louder than pretty much every other postwar transformer. Every postwar transformer I have used hums some, but not nearly as loudly as my LW did, and really only audible when my ear is about 6 inches from the transformer case. My KW gets pretty loud when there's a short circuit, but I don't mind, as I can react to the loud hum more quickly by shutting off power than the circuit breaker can. I usually don't notice any hum at all with newer transformers.

Slow speed operation with a new can-motored engine on any traditional transformer is pretty much hopeless unless you have speed control. Most transformers immediately apply 6 volts as soon as the power is turned on. An open frame motor reacts to this pretty well, and will usually start pretty smoothly, but newer can motors will jump to high speed at this voltage.

[alton6]

Thanks, Ben. Are you saying that a modern ZW or Z-4000 would offer conventionally equiped engines with can motors some capability for speed control at the low end? How about MTH's 750?

I've lately been using K-Lines bigger hobby transformer, but find that it's pretty underpowered.

Carl

[Anonymous]

Hello Y'all SP_DAY_PA here.. I'm a HO kinda guy new to this chat-list. What is a ZW and a LW ? Does anyone recognize the term DCC? If so is it used on O gauge much? Does any one know about motor brush noise and what it does to decoders?